Name change discussion

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Happy Tiger said:
Don't worry, I didn't make that mistake with you. Why haven't they joined you then? Like Mel says, if you had 10k+ members, you'd have a solid platform on which to claim you're representing a sizable chunk, as it is, you do not.
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We represent the same numbers as the OSC. There will be many reasons why people haven't joined just yet. I think we'll see the numbers increase over the coming weeks.

The evidence we submit to the FA will be based on a number of things, the on-line petition, the paper petition Facebook likes, Twitter followers, scarf sales, and maybe one or two other things I've forgotten. As I've said before I've got no idea whether it will be enough to persuade the FA but given where we stood after the Cardiff City match I'd say its fairly impressive.

mostynthecat: The people in the middle may be bothered about the name but fear that Assem Allam will take his money out and we'll tumble down the leagues if they speak out. I'm sure he has a business plan. Whether he intends to sell any shares to another investor is another matter. Whether he wants to share the glory of Hull City with somebody else is another question especially if they provide the finance to get the players to keep us up and make us an established Premier League team.

We all know what we want this transfer window. If anyone serious about investing in the club would make funds available now, for example by a loan whilst the fit and proper tests are completed, to ensure we stay up. What's the point in putting millions into the club if there's a possibility of relegation? Unless of course you realise the owner is overstretched and you can get the club on the cheap.

There is a possibility that its all about removing City from the name to get back at Hull City Council. If he loses some money so what he's rich enough already and its a price worth paying. After all its his club.
 
or Obi they may not care what our name is given that numerous chairmen (Loydd and Duffen etc) have nearly ruined the club and are happy that we have a chairman who is running the club as a business, which means that we still have a club to support. and yes the next owner might be from China (where the money is) but given the choice of where we were at Boothferry Park where we had the gates locked on us or survival under the new name
 
mostynthecat said:
or Obi they may not care what our name is given that numerous chairmen (Loydd and Duffen etc) have nearly ruined the club and are happy that we have a chairman who is running the club as a business, which means that we still have a club to support. and yes the next owner might be from China (where the money is) but given the choice of where we were at Boothferry Park where we had the gates locked on us or survival under the new name
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He's not running it as a business though, is he? If he was we'd spend next to nothing this transfer window as he says he's run out of money. If he's telling the truth about having no more cash he could borrow more money on Allam Marine's assets to put into the club.

To sell to a Chinese businessman he'd need to decide how much of the £80 million loan he's prepared to write off. No astute businessman would pay £80 million for a club that doesn't own its own ground.

Some of our supporters agree with the name change, some think Assem Allam can do no wrong and trust him, some don't care, some oppose it in private but don't want to upset him and some oppose the name change to Hull Tigers. Nobody knows how many are in each group.

The January transfer window will see how much the planned shortfall of £11 million increases, or not as the case may be. Once the accounts of Allamhouse and Allam Marine are published we'll see whether Hull City is financially healthy or not.
 
can you provide a link where it says as a quote from our chairman that he has run out of money.

yes the not owning our ground is a worry - but it depends where Allam or our next owner considers our future - if it is at the KC, then according to leading lights in the CWTD campaign we only need have a discussion with Brady and his cronies (and as they hold the aces in the negotiations - they can ask for the moon) or if it is elsewhere it is financing any new stadium (and whether that is cheaper than the KC).
 
mostynthecat said:
can you provide a link where it says as a quote from our chairman that he has run out of money.

yes the not owning our ground is a worry - but it depends where Allam or our next owner considers our future - if it is at the KC, then according to leading lights in the CWTD campaign we only need have a discussion with Brady and his cronies (and as they hold the aces in the negotiations - they can ask for the moon) or if it is elsewhere it is financing any new stadium (and whether that is cheaper than the KC).
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[video=youtube;k47SClIOa8U]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k47SClIOa8U[/video]

From about 26 seconds in.
 
mostynthecat said:
that was 5 months ago - things change
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Yes they do, which is why I said it will be interesting to see the published accounts of Allamhouse and Allam Marine. If his businesses are making net profits of over £30 million this year he could afford to push the boat out. If they aren't then we'll see what he does.
 
well if the name changes and new investment occurs things will have changed and for the better if we can get more players to ensure we stay where we are
 
mostynthecat said:
well if the name changes and new investment occurs things will have changed and for the better if we can get more players to ensure we stay where we are
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The name won't change before the end of the transfer window which is the point I was making. If you were thinking of investing in our football club and you saw our current league position wouldn't you want to make funds available in this transfer window to get in a couple of players? Why would you wait until next season when there's a chance we could be relegated. I would have thought any serious investor would put Premier League survival above changing the name.
 
Surely it's reasonable that SB is expected to offload some deadwood before committing to new players? He has mad a start on letting some go and he has cemented some deals on current players. SB has said (I'm pretty certain) that funds are available for players if they will significantly improve the squad. I think any talk of outside investment relevant to this window is not realistic. No investment news will break until the FA speak forth.
 
Fez said:
Surely it's reasonable that SB is expected to offload some deadwood before committing to new players? He has mad a start on letting some go and he has cemented some deals on current players. SB has said (I'm pretty certain) that funds are available for players if they will significantly improve the squad. I think any talk of outside investment relevant to this window is not realistic. No investment news will break until the FA speak forth.
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Yes its reasonable. We offered WBA the full price for Shane Long, agreed his wages and then started haggling. There's a difference between saying funds are available and actually spending it.

If we are talking about investment rather than sponsorship the name change would be way down my list of priorities. I'd want to know how many shares I'd have, whether it would be a majority holding and what would happen to the £80 million loan.
 
but when any new shareholder/investor invests in a club the debt for some reason never is the main priority as evidenced by most clubs in the PL (a lot who have more debts than us) and atm it does not look as if we will be relegated which means any investment over the next few months is 99% PL next season guaranteed.
 
mostynthecat said:
but when any new shareholder/investor invests in a club the debt for some reason never is the main priority as evidenced by most clubs in the PL (a lot who have more debts than us) and atm it does not look as if we will be relegated which means any investment over the next few months is 99% PL next season guaranteed.
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If you had £50 million to invest to buy a minority shareholding wouldn't you want to know where the money was going to go? The company could hold a vote with a majority voting for the money to be repaid to Allamhouse Limited.
 
People seem quite stuck on the numbers issue.

It's quite conceivable that one solitary person could come up with a reason that prevents the name change going through.
 
Hull City AFC (DMD) said:
People seem quite stuck on the numbers issue.

It's quite conceivable that one solitary person could come up with a reason that prevents the name change going through.
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I agree, but it is, unfortunately, far more likely that one solitary person will come up with a reason that will facilitate the name-change taking place. He who pays the piper.
 
I presume that when the FA are coming to a decision the club will present a business plan showing it will provide additional revenue, so will CTWD (if fans are really being consulted by the FA) be presenting an alternative business plan which shows that either there will be no additional investment and a percentage of season ticket holders (as facebook likes do not mean they are season ticket holders, as the club will reasonably point out) with names/ticket numbers of said ticket holders who are against the name change. As tradition and history will not be a good enough argument by themselves (as tradition has been trampled on in the past)
 
I believe they will also be inventing time travel and going forward in time, in order to truly demonstrate the weaknesses in Dr Allam's argument. All in the next three weeks. Got to admire the dedication.
 
At least the FA know that if they're presented with evidence of numbers being against being a sum total of various forums and groups, that there's some dodgy double accounting going on as a lot of people are in more than one of those groups.

Bottom line is less than 2k have joined a campaign group to register their opposition to the name change, despite some supposedly terrible, allegedly inflammatory and insulting comments from our owner. That speaks volumes. Reliance on lazy journalism to bolster the "whole football world is watching" will only reinforce that, as even with that, less than 2k "local" people care enough to join a group specifically to challenge Dr Allam's plans.

In fact, how can you tell how many of that sub 2k are actually Hull City fans and not just family members signed up by someone else, or friends from our twin football club, Cardiff?

CTWD doesn't speak for the fans. It speaks for a very small minority.
 
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