LEAVE OR REMAIN

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LEAVE OR REMAIN

  • LEAVE

    Votes: 33 30.3%

  • REMAIN

    Votes: 76 69.7%
  • Total voters
    109
  • Poll closed .
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Not open for further replies.
Archers Road said:
If he is I'm not laughing.
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It's the biggest load of total hogwash - are people still so thick to continue to blame migrants/foreigners for our country's misfortunes? Utterly ludicrous. These are people who want to make a good life for themselves and are contributing to our economy, and our society, but still demonised as some alien race. They are humans just like everyone on this forum.

We have no divine right to anything just because we were fortunate to be born in this country.

That's of course, if Imp wasn't joking :)
 
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ImpSaint said:
Good for exporters. Means our products if they used to cost $1000 now cost $950. Means not a lot to us unless it is long term. Those companies in the UK that import means things cost more.
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Who are they going to export to? You suddenly have no long-term trade agreements. You can also expect huge tariffs. Also, you will have just destabilized a bunch of industrial economies so that's going to put a damper on their ability and willingness to trade as well.

I don't know if it is going to be as bad as some of the doom-mongers have said, but it's definitely going to suck pretty bad for a couple of years. So bad that I wouldn't be all that surprised if Schad's prediction comes true and England ends up not leaving.
 
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Sunderland voting out. That'll be the region of the UK that receives the most EU funding of anywhere over here, and has had large business saying they'll pull their operation from the NE if we vote leave.

Reaction up there will be interesting if we leave, Scotland leaves the UK and we get saddled with the Tories forever more.


(* - hypothetical)
 
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AL. said:
You're joking aren't you?
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Did you really think all the people in the Midlands have been making up that they lost their jobs to be replaced by agency migrant workers? All of them lying? Why? Because they speak in a limited vocabulary that makes them sound racist or xenophobic?

I posted on here when this politics thread started about this and you are seeing the results already. There is huge resentment in large parts of working class England because the establishment just "meh" to them when the reality is they had secure 40 hour week work in factories and now they have to scrabble around for hours and juggle jobs to get their week's wage while agencies cream deductions from agency worker's wages and charging employers less than is feasible to cover NMW+employers NI+Hols+profit.

They have undercut even the British agencies hourly rates to make the profits back in deductions and British people cannot get a look in. YEs I am serious. I have been talking about this for 11 years now yet the politicians still to this day just go "meh" these people are all bigots. My Portuguese wife got ditched as well. Unfortunately for her she left the agency and move in with me and after a while they were pinning anything they could on her to get through disciplinaries and ditch her as well.

I guess to many of you this might sound like BS and exaggeration but wait to see what Lincolnshire, Cambridgeshire (not cambridge) and East Anglia vote!!!

People have told politicians this is happening and see this as the only way to stop things before they are locked out of the workplace forever.
 
I Sorry I Ruined The Party said:
Who are they going to export to? You suddenly have no long-term trade agreements. You can also expect huge tariffs. Also, you will have just destabilized a bunch of industrial economies so that's going to put a damper on their ability and willingness to trade as well.

I don't know if it is going to be as bad as some of the doom-mongers have said, but it's definitely going to suck pretty bad for a couple of years. So bad that I wouldn't be all that surprised if Schad's prediction comes true and England ends up not leaving.
Click to expand...

The EU hardly has any trade deals. That is the point. Tariffs from who? WTO maximum tariffs? and they are what?

I don't mind staying in the EU and I would bet the majority of those working class voters wouldn't IF they removed the freedom of movement of Labour. It is all about Jobs and the main parties have misjudged this and the feeling about it for over a decade. Big mistake.
 
- Doing The Lambert Walk said:
Sunderland voting out. That'll be the region of the UK that receives the most EU funding of anywhere over here, and has had large business saying they'll pull their operation from the NE if we vote leave.

Reaction up there will be interesting if we leave, Scotland leaves the UK and we get saddled with the Tories forever more.


(* - hypothetical)
Click to expand...
Ed Miliband may have a point on this. Just as people in local or European elections often base their vote on their opinion of the government, those areas may be voting this way to protest against the current government and/or the direction of the Labour party.
 
ImpSaint said:
Did you really think all the people in the Midlands have been making up that they lost their jobs to be replaced by agency migrant workers? All of them lying? Why? Because they speak in a limited vocabulary that makes them sound racist or xenophobic?

I posted on here when this politics thread started about this and you are seeing the results already. There is huge resentment in large parts of working class England because the establishment just "meh" to them when the reality is they had secure 40 hour week work in factories and now they have to scrabble around for hours and juggle jobs to get their week's wage while agencies cream deductions from agency worker's wages and charging employers less than is feasible to cover NMW+employers NI+Hols+profit.

They have undercut even the British agencies hourly rates to make the profits back in deductions and British people cannot get a look in. YEs I am serious. I have been talking about this for 11 years now yet the politicians still to this day just go "meh" these people are all bigots. My Portuguese wife got ditched as well. Unfortunately for her she left the agency and move in with me and after a while they were pinning anything they could on her to get through disciplinaries and ditch her as well.

I guess to many of you this might sound like BS and exaggeration but wait to see what Lincolnshire, Cambridgeshire (not cambridge) and East Anglia vote!!!

People have told politicians this is happening and see this as the only way to stop things before they are locked out of the workplace forever.
Click to expand...

Still think you're blaming the wrong people: not the workers fault.

Enforcing the correct wage levels would be a start. That's on the employers, on the government. Not the EU.
 
- Doing The Lambert Walk said:
Sunderland voting out. That'll be the region of the UK that receives the most EU funding of anywhere over here, and has had large business saying they'll pull their operation from the NE if we vote leave.

Reaction up there will be interesting if we leave, Scotland leaves the UK and we get saddled with the Tories forever more.


(* - hypothetical)
Click to expand...
Way it is looking Scotland won't get their leave vote.
 
- Doing The Lambert Walk said:
Sunderland voting out. That'll be the region of the UK that receives the most EU funding of anywhere over here, and has had large business saying they'll pull their operation from the NE if we vote leave.

Reaction up there will be interesting if we leave, Scotland leaves the UK and we get saddled with the Tories forever more.


(* - hypothetical)
Click to expand...


It's not surprising the pound"took a hammering" after that particular result was called then. The markets eyes perhaps were focused on that otherwise innocuous result , for your stated reasons.

PS: I voted NO (stay) in the Scottish ref, a big factor was not saddling you guys down there with the Tories for eternity (Although the subsequent GL Scottish Labour wipeout perhaps makes that moot). I'm not against an Independent Scotland at some stage though.
 
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AL. said:
Still think you're blaming the wrong people: not the workers fault.

Enforcing the correct wage levels would be a start. That's on the employers, on the government. Not the EU.
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However, you can't force other EU countries to pay more money. So what ends up happening is experienced, well-qualified people come here willing to work for lower wages than their equivalents here. This means people with skills and experience here cannot compete. It is good for consumers but not great for those in trade.
 
AL. said:
It's the biggest load of total hogwash - are people still so thick to continue to blame migrants/foreigners for our country's misfortunes? Utterly ludicrous. These are people who want to make a good life for themselves and are contributing to our economy, and our society, but still demonised as some alien race. They are humans just like everyone on this forum.

We have no divine right to anything just because we were fortunate to be born in this country.

That's of course, if Imp wasn't joking :)
Click to expand...

People aren't demonising migrants as an alien race. And they don't blame anyone for wanting to improve their lives. They are seeing this as that they have no choice but to vote out because the governments have not listened to them. This is nothing to do with the financial crisis or the crash. People were trying to tell the establishment that employers were ditching the British workers way before the financial crisis.

The BBC are over analysing this. It is all about jobs that people want to do but can't get because agencies with tiny offices in the UK recruiting in Europe and putting EU migrants straight into jobs that British workers DO want to do because they were doing them.

My wife is a migrant. Yesterday I watched the Portugal game with my black portuguese wife, my black portuguese brother in law, One of his Polish friends and one of his portuguese friends. I have no gripe with the people as most don't it is with the policies, the denials and the complete ignorance by the establishment that this was real and not bigotry.

Maybe in places like Hampshire and Suffolk it is hard to comprehend but it is seen up here as a mass cull of the British worker and the establishment's reply? meh you're all bigoted racist xenophobes.
 
spacedsaint said:
However, you can't force other EU countries to pay more money. So what ends up happening is experienced, well-qualified people come here willing to work for lower wages than their equivalents here. This means people with skills and experience here cannot compete. It is good for consumers but not great for those in trade.
Click to expand...

Yeah, but at some point if it's not good for consumers, it's not good for the workers either. Plus the consumers are also workers, and the workers are also consumers. Tough to find the balance point.
 
- Doing The Lambert Walk said:
Sunderland voting out. That'll be the region of the UK that receives the most EU funding of anywhere over here, and has had large business saying they'll pull their operation from the NE if we vote leave.

Reaction up there will be interesting if we leave, Scotland leaves the UK and we get saddled with the Tories forever more.


(* - hypothetical)
Click to expand...

If people can't get jobs then it doesn't matter that the EU is putting money into their favourite pet projects. And if people can't get jobs then they aren't going to listen to car manufacturers that are buying most of their steel from the EU instead of British steel!! Remember there was a large steel industry in the North East yet the car manufacturers still imported from the EU. That is why the Tories wouldn't support the high steel tariffs. because the steel using manufacturers are not buying much British Steel and the government knew there were more jobs dependent on the automotive sector than the Steel sector.
 
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