Is it going to take another tragedy for the sick chants to finally end?

[Tobes]

Man Utd fans chant the majority of both games without charge, Liverpool fans chant in the final minutes and are charged.

Even 1 minute is enough to be punished, but UEFA have made it clear that Man Utd won't be.

That doesn't mean I don't want Liverpool fans punished, I'm glad we're being held to a higher standard.

Let's just not pretend the fans are behaving equally or are being punished proportionally.

The referee in the first game didn't put anything in his report, so they didn't even look at it. The guy last night did.

UEFA will now investigate the full sorry episode, so save the cries of injustice until it's concluded mate.

 

[astro]

The referee in the first game didn't put anything in his report, so they didn't even look at it. The guy last night did.

UEFA will now investigate the full sorry episode, so save the cries of injustice until it's concluded mate.

UEFA will investigate Liverpool fans chanting, having already excluded the possibility of charging Man Utd for the same thing

 

[moreinjuredthanowen]

The referee in the first game didn't put anything in his report, so they didn't even look at it. The guy last night did.

UEFA will now investigate the full sorry episode, so save the cries of injustice until it's concluded mate.

they won't be investigating first game though... just this one.

they won't be investigating outside ground either.

the fact is away fans got in with home fans which is a big no no in europe but i'm not at all shocked a few did get in but the brazen neck on them to take out a banner is actually shocking as even if not one manc reacted the stewards would have fired them out.

god only knows where they were from though. they might be scouse, they might be from derby i dunno... probably not mansfield though.

 

[Tobes]

There are umpteen cameras at each and every game these days. They spend enough time showing reaction shots of Dalglish, Fergie, Rooney etc, so why can't they actually use them to try and assist in stamping out a sickness within the game?
Someone pitch-side can inform the OB unit when it's happening, and they can zoom in on an area to show the offenders. The director doesn't have to let it go out live if they're squeamish about repercussions, but the footage can be handed over to the authorities to identify and punish people.
They don't have to get everyone, just a few every time it happens and it will stop soon enough.
Sky, BT, the Beeb make countless ****ing millions out of this game, surely they can help to clean it up?

Back in the day - before the dozens of TV cameras everywhere, the Police used to come in front of the terrace and take still photos of the fans if there was racist chanting heard. That was part of the reason it became extinct.

If they did the same now with video cameras every time there was an unacceptable chant, and then acted on the evidence, it'd soon disappear

 

[Sharpe*]

Tbh I get fed up with talking about it.

Our society has a lot of dicks in it and as a result the chants wont go away.

Some people just don't give a **** about what they say and do.

I block it out as much as possible.

 

[saintanton]

Back in the day - before the dozens of TV cameras everywhere, the Police used to come in front of the terrace and take still photos of the fans if there was racist chanting heard. That was part of the reason it became extinct.

If they did the same now with video cameras every time there was an unacceptable chant, and then acted on the evidence, it'd soon disappear

Exactly. It's well within the power of the authorities, helped by the media, to stamp out this sort of behaviour. Instead they sit back, wring their hands, and sanctimoniously condemn people when it happens. It's about time they did something to stop it rather than just making self righteous noises.
At the moment they seem content to blame and punish the clubs- but it's a criminal offence ffs, and should be treated as such.

 

[Libby]

Back in the day - before the dozens of TV cameras everywhere, the Police used to come in front of the terrace and take still photos of the fans if there was racist chanting heard. That was part of the reason it became extinct.

If they did the same now with video cameras every time there was an unacceptable chant, and then acted on the evidence, it'd soon disappear

Problem with that is, that with racism you're talking about a criminal offence, so the police will gather evidence to press charges later. The police aren't going to spend considerable time & resources to pick out people who they can not arrest or charge with anything.

This is why I think it needs to come from the clubs themselves. Once a few got a life ban for it then it would soon stamp it out. No real fan will risk not being able to go to sing a stupid ****ing song, and if they do, then they're not the sort of fan you want around anyway are they?

 

[Sharpe*]

Problem with that is, that with racism you're talking about a criminal offence, so the police will gather evidence to press charges later. The police aren't going to spend considerable time & resources to pick out people who they can not arrest or charge with anything.

This is why I think it needs to come from the clubs themselves. Once a few got a life ban for it then it would soon stamp it out. No real fan will risk not being able to go to sing a stupid ****ing song, and if they do, then they're not the sort of fan you want around anyway are they?

Agreed.

Start being hard on those who sing that nonsense and word will soon get round that its not a great thing to do if you want to watch your club.

They need to be more tough and set an example.

Both clubs continually fail at this.

 

[astro]

Problem with that is, that with racism you're talking about a criminal offence, so the police will gather evidence to press charges later. The police aren't going to spend considerable time & resources to pick out people who they can not arrest or charge with anything.

This is why I think it needs to come from the clubs themselves. Once a few got a life ban for it then it would soon stamp it out. No real fan will risk not being able to go to sing a stupid ****ing song, and if they do, then they're not the sort of fan you want around anyway are they?

There are so many decent people waiting for tickets there's no need to pander to morons

Even from the most bottom-line POV possible, the kind of scum who come prepared for fights or sick chants aren't going to buy merchandise that they have to carry and usually don't wear club shirts either

 

[moreinjuredthanowen]

This issue here is this is two local teams abusing each other over tragic events of the past in quite a nasty way but its nothing compared to whats indulged weekly in eastern Europe and italy. the wanton racism and frankly stabbing and killing are completely ignored

the sad truth is this was probably tame compared to what would have happened if english fans got in a home end in italy and the chanted abuse whic sick and i condemn it was nothing compared to the bile spewed at black players on the continent.

its shameful to think that one ref left it go while another wrote it down.

perhaps the serb ref see smore of it and knows what to do? who knows.

 

[moreinjuredthanowen]

Agreed.

Start being hard on those who sing that nonsense and word will soon get round that its not a great thing to do if you want to watch your club.

They need to be more tough and set an example.

Both clubs continually fail at this.

its a thorw back.

sorry to say but not all will be but the ringleaders are usually 40-50 white males who would be very comfortable on terraces of the 80s throwing bananas on the pitch.

I would like to say that a significant majority of utd fans on the night were probably disgusted and a lot were families and such which is the changing demographic of match goers.

 

[Super G Ted'inho]

There are umpteen cameras at each and every game these days. They spend enough time showing reaction shots of Dalglish, Fergie, Rooney etc, so why can't they actually use them to try and assist in stamping out a sickness within the game?
Someone pitch-side can inform the OB unit when it's happening, and they can zoom in on an area to show the offenders. The director doesn't have to let it go out live if they're squeamish about repercussions, but the footage can be handed over to the authorities to identify and punish people.
They don't have to get everyone, just a few every time it happens and it will stop soon enough.
Sky, BT, the Beeb make countless ****ing millions out of this game, surely they can help to clean it up?

They should air it though. Let the sick ****ers (Liverpool or Man Utd fans) get what they deserve in the street.

 

[Tobes]

Problem with that is, that with racism you're talking about a criminal offence, so the police will gather evidence to press charges later. The police aren't going to spend considerable time & resources to pick out people who they can not arrest or charge with anything.

This is why I think it needs to come from the clubs themselves. Once a few got a life ban for it then it would soon stamp it out. No real fan will risk not being able to go to sing a stupid ****ing song, and if they do, then they're not the sort of fan you want around anyway are they?

That's not strictly true.

The 1991 act covers indecent and racist chanting. If a chant is deemed to be 'indecent' then the perpetrators could be prosecuted under the current law.

All that clubs would need to do in order to make that stick would be to publish what they consider to be indecent chanting, that is unacceptable as it causes offence.

 

[Red Hadron Collider]

I was embarrassed for football listening to that **** last night.

For me it ruined what should have been a great footballing occasion.

I had hoped that the Liverpool fans would rise above it, as I understand was the case at Anfield, but they were obviously goaded into a response last night.

It needs stamping out now, we've been talking about this issue for way too long, time for some draconian action that sends out the signal that it's wholly unacceptable behaviour at the match.

Rivalry, banter, even near the knuckle jibes, it's all part of football - but not chants about death. Enough is enough.

If you read what I posted after going to the first leg, you'll know that I agree completely. I doubt that banner helped, but still no excuse.

 

[Libby]

That's not strictly true.

The 1991 act covers indecent and racist chanting. If a chant is deemed to be 'indecent' then the perpetrators could be prosecuted under the current law.

All that clubs would need to do in order to make that stick would be to publish what they consider to be indecent chanting, that is unacceptable as it causes offence.

Don't see that without a change in legislation, otherwise you could technically be nicked for "You fat bastard!" or something similar.

Just because indecent chanting is there officially, doesn't mean it's as easy to put into effect practically.

 

[Super G Ted'inho]

Problem with that is, that with racism you're talking about a criminal offence, so the police will gather evidence to press charges later. The police aren't going to spend considerable time & resources to pick out people who they can not arrest or charge with anything.

This is why I think it needs to come from the clubs themselves. Once a few got a life ban for it then it would soon stamp it out. No real fan will risk not being able to go to sing a stupid ****ing song, and if they do, then they're not the sort of fan you want around anyway are they?

Both clubs have massive waiting lists for tickets so its not like they need to keep the culprits anyway.

 

[Tobes]

Don't see that without a change in legislation, otherwise you could technically be nicked for "You fat bastard!" or something similar.

Just because indecent chanting is there officially, doesn't mean it's as easy to put into effect practically.

Technically you could - if enough people found that offensive. But I take your point.

Stewarding years ago used to be much more strict. I've seen numerous people warned / chucked out for shouting out over the top abuse. Nowadays the stewards do **** all in the main. If someone is really pushing it they'll notify the old bill, but that's very rare in my experience.

Ultimately the responsibility for making this a thing of the past lies with the fans. Both those who do it and those who sit along side them.

If you shouted out racist abuse now, you'd get verbals from your own and rightly so. Until that becomes the new norm with this kind of stuff, it'll carry on.

 

[carlthejackal]

Technically you could - if enough people found that offensive. But I take your point.

Stewarding years ago used to be much more strict. I've seen numerous people warned / chucked out for shouting out over the top abuse. Nowadays the stewards do **** all in the main. If someone is really pushing it they'll notify the old bill, but that's very rare in my experience.

Ultimately the responsibility for making this a thing of the past lies with the fans. Both those who do it and those who sit along side them.

If you shouted out racist abuse now, you'd get verbals from your own and rightly so. Until that becomes the new norm with this kind of stuff, it'll carry on.

The morons will not take advice from the FA, the journos, the premier league or anyone else. They will however listen to people they respect. If Klopp says it is disgusting and unacceptable, it will soon stop, at least for our morons. We can't do much for the other morons..

 

[JustAManc]

United fan here.....in peace!

I've been a member here for a while and was an avid poster back on the original 606 forum. I don't bother posting anymore as I only tend to use this site on my lunch break for a bit of banter.

However, the last 2 games our clubs have played have led me to want to post something here.

I'm a United season ticket holder and have been for 8 years. Stretford End, Tier 2.

I couldn't get a ticket for the first leg at your place but watched it on TV and was disgusted by the number of "fans" singing the disgusting chants towards to Liverpool fans. I've heard arguments on here and from fellow United fans that say that it was both sets of fans doing these chants but watching it on TV I honestly only heard United "fans" doing it. And for the vast majority of the 90 mins.

I was at the game last night and, again, only heard United "fans" making these disgusting chants during the game. From where I was stood they didn't seem to be as often or as loud as it was at Anfield but it did still happen.

I'm as sick of these mindless whoppers as I imagine most of you guys are.

Please do remember that we are not all idiotic peasants. Along with myself there were several United fans that told those singing the idiotic chants to shut the &&&& up and grow up.

It sickens me having to stand in such close proximity to those who want to bring shame on the club that I have loved from being a boy and I hope one day that these mindless idiots will either grow up or get lifetime bans from buying tickets.

Anyway....the main point of my post was really to say a massive thanks to the 99.9% of Liverpool fans at Old Trafford last night. It would have been so easy for you to rock up and sing about Munich as loud as the thousands of our lot did at Anfield. But from where I was that didn't appear to happen. So thank you!








PS - I still hate you all, and your club, with a passion but you do have my upmost respect.

 

[moreinjuredthanowen]

I still can't figure why 10 guys got tickets into utd home area, brought a banner (premeditation of actions) and thought it'd be good.

Its like.. at BEST you were getting thrown out. I presume they did it near the end


the echo is up in arms and saying its pursiing a line with uefa.

I could save them the bother. the response will be precisely the same as the first leg. "the referee report said X"

So if a ref did not hear thier M word but hear dout M word or recognized one and not the other... well it does show a rather arhaic way of doing business.. like as if the ref is the only witness in the world.

kind of 1960s thinking from uefa really.

there'll just a a couple fines and that will be that.