Off Topic BREXIT

  • Please bear with us on the new site integration and fixing any known bugs over the coming days. If you can not log in please try resetting your password and check your spam box. If you have tried these steps and are still struggling email [email protected] with your username/registered email address
  • Log in now to remove adverts - no adverts at all to registered members!

How will you be voting?

  • Remain

    Votes: 89 46.1%

  • Leave

    Votes: 104 53.9%
  • Total voters
    193
Status
Not open for further replies.
I'm voting out. It's not about who I trust or like/dislike on either side. For many reasons I believe our country will be better in the long run if we are out.
 
Sir Cheshire Ben said:
In my opinion the argument for staying in revolves around protection. Protecting our rights as workers (maternity/paternity pay, equal pay, paid leave, rest breaks etc). I think the Conservatives will rip apart the EWTD at the first opportunity. They've already started making it easier for employees to sack people.

Protecting us as consumers. Food labeling. The right to return goods to anywhere in the EU if it fails, up to two years after purchase. The right to cancel an agreement in the first seven days. Mis-leading advertising is prohibited & products must be safe. Consumers are free to take goods throughout the EU without paying excise duty on the goods.

Protecting & improving our environment. The Urban Waste Water Treatment Directive has ensured our rivers have improved dramatically over the last 30 years. We now have otters & other wildlife, once again, thriving in our waterways & countryside. Other legislation has ensured our sulphur emissions have been vastly reduced meaning the problem of acid rain has also reduce dramatically. 30 years ago most of our beaches would fail the Bathing Water Directive, now 98% of our beaches pass.

Protecting us from Conservative autonomy which would, without doubt lead to the, already started, complete dismantling of the NHS. The privatisation of schools & education. The eradication of unions & workers rights. The return to university places only for the privileged. Further badgering, bullying & intimidation of those claiming benefits. The protection of those avoiding paying their taxes whether through legal means or fraudulently.

Protecting us from Boris ****ing Johnson. There is a serious threat that the buffoon will become PM if we opt out. Think about it!


Unfortunately I also have a massive problem with how the EU is managed. It's not a democracy. The elected MEPs are not making the decisions, although they are claiming sufficient expenses & salaries to pay off the national debts of some countries. Important decisions are being made by bureaucrats, on inflated salaries, who are not elected & have secondary interests.

The EURO needs to be all or nothing. You cannot run a single currency through different treasuries. The value of the Euro needs to be consistent across all countries. A loaf of bread needs to be taxed similarly in Germany as it is in Greece as should a gallon of unleaded. A plumber should be paid & taxed similarly in France as he is in Italy. Inflation should be the same across all Euro member states as should interest rates. A single currency with different values is never going to work.

I liken the EU to FIFA. It's corrupt. It needs to be stripped to the core & rebuilt from the base. I doubt we can achieve this from the inside, being part of it. I think if we decide to leave the Dutch will follow suit & a cascade will follow. Hopefully that will lead to a rebuild.


I'm undecided, my head's telling me in, my other head's telling me out. I'll probably be swayed by a similar cockponce incident as the one displayed by that **** of a Councillor from Beverley today.

That's my ten cents worth, unless you're in Greece where it's 8 cents worth, Spain 7 cents, Germany 15 cents, Italy 11 cents, Netherlands, 13 cents or UK 2 pence.
Click to expand...
We could vote out any buffoon after 4 years but try that with Herr Junker....
 
  • Like
Reactions: Real ale tiger
I think we can all agree that some of the campaigning on both sides has been terrible. Equally I think some of the arguments to either stay or leave are decent, but you don't hear them from most of the politicians, you have to dig. I'm leaning towards leaving but I'm extremely uncomfortable with giving the Tories free reign for nearly 4 years with no one to say, "hey you can't do that."
 
Old Tige said:
::emoticon-0140-rofl:
Click to expand...

I'm sure you laughter is genuine; have you listened to the good arguments, the daft arguments and the challenges, criticism and calls for reason that many see and hear. It's democracy; what's your way?
 
I don't like UK politicians at all with the increased power they would have.

Our politicians are ****s and they would be even more ****ish without the shackles of the EU to hold them back.
 
  • Like
Reactions: GlassHalfHull
Hull 3-1 Liverpool said:
I think we can all agree that some of the campaigning on both sides has been terrible. Equally I think some of the arguments to either stay or leave are decent, but you don't hear them from most of the politicians, you have to dig. I'm leaning towards leaving but I'm extremely uncomfortable with giving the Tories free reign for nearly 4 years with no one to say, "hey you can't do that."
Click to expand...

Well blame the people who selfishly elected the unelectable Corbyn then - they're the ones who have given Cameron and Co free reign.
 
Fez said:
But far from all accept it, which is my point, as yours is defeatist.
Click to expand...

Not sure at all what your point is.

You think it's defeatist to challenge attempts to be ****ed by either and that choosing which one you want to be ****ed by isn't.

Hope you have some condoms handy.
 
City Man said:
Well blame the people who selfishly elected the unelectable Corbyn then - they're the ones who have given Cameron and Co free reign.
Click to expand...

I'm sure he'll say "hey you can't do that" plenty of times but he can't really do anything about it. The local election results suggest that he isn't unelectable, if I remember correctly he did better than Blair did at first.
 
I'm voting Leave. The fact Britain has a deficit of democracy is no reason to vote to Remain. You need to remove one layer of bureaucracy and accountability and work from there. We leave the EU and we work at reforming our own democracy. I'm actually astounded by how many on the Left support Remain considering the EU is such a bureaucratic free-market capitalist institution. Since when have the Left ever give a **** about GDP and growth considering it's a capitalist phenomena and the antithesis of seizing the means of production and fruit of all labour etc.? I think this entire campaign has exposed people's political and philosophical principles, or lack thereof in some cases. If you consider yourself left-wing and are citing centre-right politicians, banks, big business owners and capitalist economists as reasons for Remain, then you either don't actually understand capitalism and socialism or your principles mean **** all. If you like free-market capitalism and are voting Remain then that's totally understandable. Left-wing people voting Remain have very flimsy principles if any at all. The EU hasn't assured peace in Europe, it didn't prevent the wars in the former Yugoslavia (even if they weren't members at the time it hardly matters when it claims to represent all of 'Europe') and it didn't prevent the Ukrainian crisis either. If you're referencing peace between France and Germany then NATO's responsible for that. The EU isn't internationalist or inclusive, it's actually openly hostile to Russia which is itself a European nation. On top of all that it is expensive, it is secretly organising TTIP without the consent of the European people and the European Commission is composed of unelected bureaucrats not accountable to popular mandate. Leaving won't be easy, it won't be beneficial in the short term but hopefully it is worth it in the long run and may even bring the entire institution to collapse.
 
On balance, I'm in. Lots of problems to sort out but negative campaigning has clouded the issue. I just can't take Boris Johnson seriously. Forget the hype, Remain is nailed on.

Double a bet up with Clinton as the next US President and you're on a winner.
 
Irememberwaggy said:
I'm a definite in. You just have to look at some of the people advocating Leave & it's a no-brainer. Anyone who would side with Johnson, Gove, Farage, the right wing of the Tory party and the right wing press needs their head examining.
Europe is by no means perfect, but it's much easier to improve it from the inside than in xenophobic isolation.
Click to expand...
I'm not making political comments but I don't think you should base your vote on personalities, you can't lump in Dennis Skinner and the likes of the late Tony Benn with the right wingers you mention
 
ellewoods said:
They are forced to stay due to your higher population, if their population votes to stay and they are still forced to leave then they should get a vote to leave you. Thats the concept of self determination.
Click to expand...

Good, I'm hoping exactly for that. Hopefully, Northern Ireland unites with the Republic; let Dublin subsidise the basket case and sectarian backwater. Likewise, I hope the Scots gain their independence. Wales might even be more Eurosceptic than England so we'll see on that.
 
Fez said:
It's democracy; what's your way?
Click to expand...

And the USA would claim that their system is democracy while you ridicule it as inferior

I consider both to be a sham.

My way would be for an informed populace to take direct responsibility for their own governance and not submissively doff their cap's to some supposed elite who as history has shown, act only in their own interests.

That's not very popular I know, but you did ask.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Real ale tiger
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom
Back