Off Topic Hull City Centre Public Realm Strategy

[Plum]

One simple bench. Tucked under a window against the wall. 12 inches deep, maybe 4 foot long at the most. Bonkers. WTF has happened to common sense.

It's a dilemma. A 12-inch deep bench will actually be nearer a metre deep when a couple of people put their bags down and sit on it. Then someone comes along with a 2-child buggy, a mobility scooter, a walking frame, whatever, and has to manoeuvre around it, then eventually someone will fall over.

I can see why a license should be applied for, I can just about see why there should be a cost for the application. But I can't see why it should be excessive (£500 is excessive imo) and I don't see why it should be renewable annually.

 

[originalminority]

ERYCC have a licensing system, you pay £25 to apply, someone will come to your premises, discuss where you want to site it, what size it can be and what it will say on it. Then if it's accepted, there's another £25 to join the scheme, which confirms your permission and provides you with a license to go in your window to say you're allowed to display it (it's reviewed annually).

I don't think either system is particularly unreasonable.

That is fair and reasonable.

 

[Cityzen]

A part of the problem relates to issues they can create for the less able bodied, blind people etc. Some people are quite thoughtless when they position these things.

Another of those things that doesn’t seem to be such a problem in Europe where there tables and chairs all over the place with no problems.

 

[bradymk2]

Another of those things that doesn’t seem to be such a problem in Europe where there tables and chairs all over the place with no problems.

On roof?

 

[DMD]

It's a dilemma. A 12-inch deep bench will actually be nearer a metre deep when a couple of people put their bags down and sit on it. Then someone comes along with a 2-child buggy, a mobility scooter, a walking frame, whatever, and has to manoeuvre around it, then eventually someone will fall over.

I can see why a license should be applied for, I can just about see why there should be a cost for the application. But I can't see why it should be excessive (£500 is excessive imo) and I don't see why it should be renewable annually.

If it wasn't renewable, there's every chance the traders would push the boundaries, so the opportunity to review keeps that in check. Also, circumstances (and operators) change.

Oh, and the legislation itself says the licence cannot be for more than 2 years, so the Council have limited choice.

 

[DMD]

Another of those things that doesn’t seem to be such a problem in Europe where there tables and chairs all over the place with no problems.

Rather depends what you choose to believe.

https://euroweeklynews.com/2024/05/22/alfresco-fiasco-italians-reject-outside-tables/

 

[Trumpton Tiger.]

ERYCC have a licensing system, you pay £25 to apply, someone will come to your premises, discuss where you want to site it, what size it can be and what it will say on it. Then if it's accepted, there's another £25 to join the scheme, which confirms your permission and provides you with a license to go in your window to say you're allowed to display it (it's reviewed annually).

I don't think either system is particularly unreasonable.

I do because ER claim A board's are a hazard unless you pay the fee to join the scheme, and it's not £25, its more like £50 in Beverley, so how does paying a fee to the ER make the boards less of a hazard?

 

[Gone For A Walk]

It's a dilemma. A 12-inch deep bench will actually be nearer a metre deep when a couple of people put their bags down and sit on it. Then someone comes along with a 2-child buggy, a mobility scooter, a walking frame, whatever, and has to manoeuvre around it, then eventually someone will fall over.

I can see why a license should be applied for, I can just about see why there should be a cost for the application. But I can't see why it should be excessive (£500 is excessive imo) and I don't see why it should be renewable annually.

Fair comments. Except in this case there was absolutely no obstruction due to the width of the pavement.
Yes, maybe (arguably) makes sense for a simple process to go through and a very small fee to cover any admin cost. Or maybe just use common sense - is this causing an obstruction in any way? No. Is it 'out of character' ? No. OK, carry on.

 

[Gone For A Walk]

I do because ER claim A board's are a hazard unless you pay the fee to join the scheme, and it's not £25, its more like £50 in Beverley, so how does paying a fee to the ER make the boards less of a hazard?

Exactly.
If it's causing a hazard, or other material problem, issue a warning to get it moved or whatever. Simple.

 

[Trumpton Tiger.]

Exactly.
If it's causing a hazard, or other material problem, issue a warning to get it moved or whatever. Simple.

A bigger hazard is avoiding vans and lorries driving down pedestrianised street, and tripping over the legs of beggers, dodging the charity bucket collectors, and the raving lunatic Jesus-Saves-You-bloke who shouts abuse at you. Talking Beverley here.

 

[Plum]

If it wasn't renewable, there's every chance the traders would push the boundaries, so the opportunity to review keeps that in check. Also, circumstances (and operators) change.

Oh, and the legislation itself says the licence cannot be for more than 2 years, so the Council have limited choice.

But they can review without charging, only charge if things have changed and a new application is needed.

 

[originallambrettaman]

I do because ER claim A board's are a hazard unless you pay the fee to join the scheme, and it's not £25, its more like £50 in Beverley, so how does paying a fee to the ER make the boards less of a hazard?

If you read my post again, that's exactly what I said it cost.

They don't claim it's a hazard if you don't pay, but not one if you do, they make you pay the fee to fund the licensing scheme to make sure everyone places their A boards in a place that doesn't cause a hazard.

 

[originallambrettaman]

Another of those things that doesn’t seem to be such a problem in Europe where there tables and chairs all over the place with no problems.

It doesn't seem to be a problem in Beverley either, half the car park in Saturday Market is now outside seating, as is the area next to the bandstand, along with half the old car park in Wednesday Market...

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[Cityzen]

It doesn't seem to be a problem in Beverley either, half the car park in Saturday Market is now outside seating, as is the area next to the bandstand, along with half the old car park in Wednesday Market...

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I was referring to outside shops and on pavements not no a closed off area.

 

[Ric Glasgow]

What's the going rate for cardboard box/sleeping bag, pavement space for our down and out/downtrodden indigenous homeless these days?

 

[Cityzen]

Rather depends what you choose to believe.

https://euroweeklynews.com/2024/05/22/alfresco-fiasco-italians-reject-outside-tables/

That is because too many tables on the pavement gives them less room to park their cars on it.

 

[TwoWrights]

What's the going rate for cardboard box/sleeping bag, pavement space for our down and out/downtrodden indigenous homeless these days?

The same cost as the night shelters the council provide for the homeless, free. The shelters are never full, some just don't want to be helped. A few years back BBC Look North talked to a woman who was homeless and sleeping on the streets, she told them she used to live in a flat but slept in the garden. David Burns on his radio show talked about this often, his solution was that some of them needed 'tough love', he's probably correct.


The views expressed in my posts are not necessarily mine.

 

[Jim the Tiger]

It doesn't seem to be a problem in Beverley either, half the car park in Saturday Market is now outside seating, as is the area next to the bandstand, along with half the old car park in Wednesday Market...

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Do you need a parking ticket to eat at those tables?

 

[rovertiger]

Do you need a parking ticket to eat at those tables?

You might get your chair clamped.

 

[TwoWrights]

You might get your chair clamped.

Some on here need their chair plugging in.


The views expressed in my posts are not necessarily mine.