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Off Topic Politics Thread

Discussion in 'Southampton' started by ChilcoSaint, Feb 23, 2016.

  1. Brinkworth Saint

    Brinkworth Saint Well-Known Member

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    I'm almost in total agreement with you but I do not have a feeling of any certitude that Ukraine is his only long term goal. He has always held a belief that Russia should be the country on par with where it was pre-Soviet times, which included Finland too. I fully agree that to follow such a path is disasterous for Russia today, but his destiny as he sees it is to oversee the restoration of the Greater Russia. He is certainly, as you say, not stupid, but strategically he is at present well ahead in his calculations of how the West will and can respond. Populations of Western states are, for very good reasons, not at all enthusiastic about engaging Russia in a war, however limited, that, he knows, is what will encourage him to go as far as he can with his plan.
     
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  2. tomw24

    tomw24 Well-Known Member
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    Biden has just said that the US will defend every inch of NATO and thousands of US troops are currently stationed in these eastern NATO members.
     
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  3. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    Does that bother him ?

    I have no idea of his true mental state , I doubt anyone else on here does either .
     
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  4. Archers Road

    Archers Road Urban Spaceman

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    He might not be stupid, but I doubt this is a clever move on his part. The cagey poker player image he cultivated doesn’t seem so convincing now; stupid bastard called his own bluff. This won’t end well for him - or anyone else, unfortunately.
     
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  5. garysfc

    garysfc Well-Known Member

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    Not sure a wounded Putin will in anyway be good. He worries the **** out of me. The military build up had been so orchestrated & deliberate. The initial defensive words just total lies. I did feel they might use the propaganda east Ukraine unrest as a pretext to take a few eastern provinces but it’s quite obvious on this the first day he’s going for at least 50% including the capital & almost sure the whole country. What a fcuking cnut. Sorry for the language.
     
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    Last edited: Feb 24, 2022
  6. garysfc

    garysfc Well-Known Member

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    Does he really give a ****e? I’m not convinced. Very difficult for NATO to militarily resist. That stance is just unthinkable.
     
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  7. Schad

    Schad Well-Known Member

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    I suspect that's a gamble too far for Putin. Invading Ukraine is incredibly costly, but there is little spillover risk, and there's an underexplored side benefit here: Belarus, which has long been a Russian client state, is now going to be housing Russian troops indefinitely, its military has effectively been placed in Russian hands, and the country will probably be more-or-less peaceably annexed whenever Lukashenko dies/retires. Invading the Baltics, much though he would like to, triggers Article V; unless NATO outright disbands, it means direct conflict between Russia and NATO, and that's a conflict that Russia doesn't win (it's likely a conflict that absolutely no one wins, but I have no idea what Russia's win condition is there).
     
    #32647
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  8. StJabbo1

    StJabbo1 Well-Known Member

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    There are many that say we just have to accept the brexshit, not so, each and every example of the monumental **** up has to be highlighted and the movement to rejoin be supported.
     
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  9. SaintsForTheWin

    SaintsForTheWin Any holes a goal

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    He’s probably as mental as you, jasper…. So worrying <whistle>
     
    #32649
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  10. Number 1 Jasper

    Number 1 Jasper Well-Known Member

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    He’s a rank amateur when it comes to that compared to me .

    I just had a chat with myself , and I am in total agreement :emoticon-0110-tongu
     
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  11. Gregm1988

    Gregm1988 Well-Known Member

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    In what way did he call his own bluff ? What makes you say it isn’t so convincing now?
     
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  12. Schad

    Schad Well-Known Member

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    Up to this point, Putin was very good about taking measured steps that bolstered his own standing in Russia, (marginally) improved Russia's strategic standing, and didn't present particularly grave risks to his position. Getting bogged down in a guerrilla war in Ukraine, particularly if paired with sustained economic consequences for the people who prop him up, is potentially a different story. Putin is making an enormous gamble here, with more risk than reward.

    Which is also why the response here, from the West, should be: seize everything. Take every European and North American possession of the clique of oligarchs Putin has created to maintain his rule. Money (looted from the Russian economy) is the means by which he has bought loyalty: take the spoils from them.
     
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  13. Osvaldorama

    Osvaldorama Well-Known Member

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    Biden has said today he doesn’t think Putin will stop with Ukraine. He thinks he wants to restore the Soviet Union.
     
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  14. garysfc

    garysfc Well-Known Member

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    Yep I know what you’re saying but there’s an awful lot of logic there. You know what I’m going to say next.
     
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  15. Schad

    Schad Well-Known Member

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    Be forewarned: as dumb as many UK politicians have become, you still have a lot of work to do in order to catch the US. Here is Tommy Tuberville, Senator from Alabama (and former college football coach), showing his keen grasp of international politics:

     
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  16. San Tejón

    San Tejón Well-Known Member

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    Is blaming communism the American equivalent of the Tories blaming Corbyn?
     
    #32656
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  17. StJabbo1

    StJabbo1 Well-Known Member

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    Bugger me he trumps Truss's geography
     
    #32657
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  18. San Tejón

    San Tejón Well-Known Member

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    #32658
  19. - Doing The Lambert Walk

    - Doing The Lambert Walk Well-Known Member

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  20. Le Tissier's Laces

    Le Tissier's Laces Well-Known Member

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    Spot on.

    My main concern at the moment is that if the gamble starts failing and he gets backed into a corner, his capacity to think "**** it".
     
    #32660
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