The Stupid Questions thread

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genjigonzales

genjigonzales

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Apr 20, 2011
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When you have a question that it's not worth starting a new thread for, but it doesn't fit into an existing thread, ask it here.

No.1 What the hell is an inerter?

Jarno Trulli's was dangling down between his legs during the closing stages of the Canadian GP. It has something to do with infamous J-Damper according to wikipedia:

Wikipedia said:
Shortly after its discovery, the inerter principle was used under the name of J-damper in the suspension systems of Formula 1 racing cars. When tuned to the natural oscillation frequencies of the tires, the inerter reduced the mechanical load on the suspension. McLaren Mercedes began using a J-damper in early 2005, and Renault shortly thereafter.

J-dampers were at the center of a Formula 1 spying case arisen when Phil Mackereth left McLaren for Renault.
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What is it and what does it do?
 
Well inert means still or motionless. So presumably an inerter would be a device which reduces vibrations to (or close to) zero. It could simply be a mass added to a moving to change it's natural frequency, and preventing it resonating. If it's added to a suspension system it may be to prevent the tyre vibrating at its resonant frequency, if it was flat spotted for example, to prevent suspension damage.

I've never heard of one before though, and like WCB, I reckon Cosi would probably be best able to shed some light on it.
 
I thought inerters (in F1) were an extra piece of the suspension which stores rotational energy through a flywheel and reduces the oscillation that occurs with regular suspension and the wheel and therefore gives better grip. My understanding is a bit superficial so I will try and find more info on it.
 
Good idea for a thread Genji,

Just thinking of a question , does anyone know roughly how much the teams get in WCC ranking money, i know it goes to 10th place.
 
Sportydan said:
Good idea for a thread Genji,

Just thinking of a question , does anyone know roughly how much the teams get in WCC ranking money, i know it goes to 10th place.
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I'm not sure a complete breakdown is available - possibly it's in Formula Money.

Total prize money in 2010 was $658m. Red Bull received (or will receive, I think it's still paid 12 months in arrears) $87m for winning it. That's 13.2%. Team Lotus allegedly won $20m, or 3%, for coming tenth. If the other teams received between 3% and 13% that leaves around 15% unaccounted for, which amounts to approximately the $100m Ferrari receives for taking part.
 
genjioleone said:
I'm not sure a complete breakdown is available - possibly it's in Formula Money.

Total prize money in 2010 was $658m. Red Bull received (or will receive, I think it's still paid 12 months in arrears) $87m for winning it. That's 13.2%. Team Lotus allegedly won $20m, or 3%, for coming tenth. If the other teams received between 3% and 13% that leaves around 15% unaccounted for, which amounts to approximately the $100m Ferrari receives for taking part.
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Thanks for that Genji.
 
Sorry I was late to this thread.
However, I see that there has been some thorough investigation and that the answer to Genji's excellent question has already been provided: AbsolutelyGlorious came up with a brilliant answer, particularly if unaware of an existing explanation - as provided by Mifune's research effort.

Great thread Genji, (as ever) ;) Top marks to AG: well worthy of 'Rep'.
 
nice one cambridge, thanx very much for using british tax payer money to invent something then license it to Americans to sell on for the profits. a bit like our pharmacuetical advances.
 
Been doing a bit more digging on the inerter and found some things on Scarb's blog:

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I'm sure that's the bit that flew off Rubens' car in Hungary and hit Massa a couple of years ago. It looks as if it's mounted in the same place at least. The picture is of a rear push rod suspension, mounted to the gearbox.

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The picture above is of the front inerter on a Ferrari, and explains how Jarno could've came to having one between his legs. :D

And here's Scarb's description of an inerter:

Scarbs said:
An inerter is a simple device akin the Renault Mass Damper, pioneered initially by McLaren. It consists of a weight that spins on a threaded rod as the suspension moves, in order to balance out the ‘bounce’ of the tyres. This creates a more consistent load at the contact patch and resultingly better grip from the tyres.
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I thought this was called the stupid question thread, not the "really intelligent and interesting technical thread"

If the inerter is similar to the mass damper, why hasn't it been banned? The mass damper was banned in 2006 after renault were gaining too much performance with it.
 
I believe the Renault Mass Damper wasn't rigidly attached to the chassis, making it a moving aerodynamic device, resulting in its ban.

And I agree with cowboy, this is a fascinating thread! I'm learning a lot.
 
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