I'll go through this:
1) within hours of 7/10 there were thousands of people in the streets of major western cities (London included) and across the Arab world celebrating the attack. They call it resistance, they genuinely see no issue with it. They have debased Jews to that level. We see this when they rip down hostage posters.
This isn't true. Or it isn't true in the sense that supports it as an excuse for what has happened. The global response was overridingly of shock and horror. There was a genuine groundswell of pro-israeli comments around the world. You can actually go through popular social media platforms and time stamp them. You can track that pro-israel feeling - and see it quite quickly collapse along with the bloodthirsty response.
2) Even if Israel hadn’t responded that movement would have grown. Perhaps more so if Israel appeared weak in its response, perhaps less so. But it would have increased compared with 6/10.
This ignores the importance of narrative building. The narrative being built is that Hamas does what it does because Israel is so brutal. Israel has played into that narrative 100%. A weak response here was the correct one. This isn't war. This is murder. By fighting back in the way they have, the Israelis have made this look like war. It should have been murder.
3) Israel cannot share a border with a government whose whole ethos and purpose is to destroy Jews around the world.
Israel cannot share a border with a government it doesn't recognise or cooperate with. Not apportioning blame for this, but this is two sides who both PREFER to hate each other.
4) the Jews that Hamas killed were the most left leaning, pro Palestinian Jews in the whole of Israel. Many of those killed drove Gazans to medical appointments, ran workshops assimilating them etc. This has turned leftist, progressive Israelis against Palestinians.
Does this matter? The issue is global feeling and not internal. I have met young Israelis and they are incredibly patriotic. They all serve in the army. They are brought up to distrust Palestinians. None of that impacts on the global message - and I still assert Hamas, bizarrely, have won that. They have committed an atrocity that ISRAEL has converted into a war. This is such an epic blunder I think it will be being written about 100 years from now.
5) we all know about the right wing nut jobs in the Israeli government. Leftists moving to the right has empowered them but they still remain unpopular among normal Israeli voters. The government would lose an election very badly tomorrow, if one was called. There is still a desire for peace even despite the growing hate.
But ring wing nut jobs were elected last time and most probably will be elected tomorrow. This situation has worsened that. And it really doesn't help that so many radical zionists move there from the US.
6) 90% of Palestinians in Gaza and even more in the West Bank support Hamas and 7/10. So both sides are now utterly dehumanised to one another.
Of course they do. All they see is Israel throttling their nation and blowing them up. This war won't change that. It simply won't.
7) The PA/UNRWA and all other organisations in Gaza and/or the West Bank are so committed to teaching children to hate Jews and martyr themselves that there will always be a threat as long as that is allowed. This was shown on the intifadas and also on 7/10 and since.
But what does it say in holy books about people with different religions? I won't use this as an opportunity to repeat my feelings on religion, but it isn't helping either side.
I don't disagree with any of your sentiments. I think Hamas is pure evil. I also think the Israeli government is pretty evil. I think all the innocents on both sides are suffering and no amount of bombs will ever end this conflict. You have to make Palestinians feel like life is great and it is better with Israeli help. And you have to keep doing it for 2 generations. Otherwise this is just blood and murder and words.
1) within hours of 7/10 there were thousands of people in the streets of major western cities (London included) and across the Arab world celebrating the attack. They call it resistance, they genuinely see no issue with it. They have debased Jews to that level. We see this when they rip down hostage posters.
This isn't true. Or it isn't true in the sense that supports it as an excuse for what has happened. The global response was overridingly of shock and horror. There was a genuine groundswell of pro-israeli comments around the world. You can actually go through popular social media platforms and time stamp them. You can track that pro-israel feeling - and see it quite quickly collapse along with the bloodthirsty response.
2) Even if Israel hadn’t responded that movement would have grown. Perhaps more so if Israel appeared weak in its response, perhaps less so. But it would have increased compared with 6/10.
This ignores the importance of narrative building. The narrative being built is that Hamas does what it does because Israel is so brutal. Israel has played into that narrative 100%. A weak response here was the correct one. This isn't war. This is murder. By fighting back in the way they have, the Israelis have made this look like war. It should have been murder.
3) Israel cannot share a border with a government whose whole ethos and purpose is to destroy Jews around the world.
Israel cannot share a border with a government it doesn't recognise or cooperate with. Not apportioning blame for this, but this is two sides who both PREFER to hate each other.
4) the Jews that Hamas killed were the most left leaning, pro Palestinian Jews in the whole of Israel. Many of those killed drove Gazans to medical appointments, ran workshops assimilating them etc. This has turned leftist, progressive Israelis against Palestinians.
Does this matter? The issue is global feeling and not internal. I have met young Israelis and they are incredibly patriotic. They all serve in the army. They are brought up to distrust Palestinians. None of that impacts on the global message - and I still assert Hamas, bizarrely, have won that. They have committed an atrocity that ISRAEL has converted into a war. This is such an epic blunder I think it will be being written about 100 years from now.
5) we all know about the right wing nut jobs in the Israeli government. Leftists moving to the right has empowered them but they still remain unpopular among normal Israeli voters. The government would lose an election very badly tomorrow, if one was called. There is still a desire for peace even despite the growing hate.
But ring wing nut jobs were elected last time and most probably will be elected tomorrow. This situation has worsened that. And it really doesn't help that so many radical zionists move there from the US.
6) 90% of Palestinians in Gaza and even more in the West Bank support Hamas and 7/10. So both sides are now utterly dehumanised to one another.
Of course they do. All they see is Israel throttling their nation and blowing them up. This war won't change that. It simply won't.
7) The PA/UNRWA and all other organisations in Gaza and/or the West Bank are so committed to teaching children to hate Jews and martyr themselves that there will always be a threat as long as that is allowed. This was shown on the intifadas and also on 7/10 and since.
But what does it say in holy books about people with different religions? I won't use this as an opportunity to repeat my feelings on religion, but it isn't helping either side.
I don't disagree with any of your sentiments. I think Hamas is pure evil. I also think the Israeli government is pretty evil. I think all the innocents on both sides are suffering and no amount of bombs will ever end this conflict. You have to make Palestinians feel like life is great and it is better with Israeli help. And you have to keep doing it for 2 generations. Otherwise this is just blood and murder and words.
