General Matchday Thread

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PJS - BACK AND BOSSING IT said:
The amount of times this season I have seen eto'o, rom naismith have the ball knocked to them and lost is amazing. So to say we only play with a plan a is crazy!
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But when that happens it's not controlled, that's the point.

The long punts are invariably the result of the split CB's being pressured on the ball and launching it due to having no other option. It's not as if they're playing it looking for an opportunity to turn the opposition CB's with a ball in behind, they're just aimless hoofs, at least in Moyes era they were ****ing planned and we usually had someone up there winning them.
 
PJS - BACK AND BOSSING IT said:
So we have gone from a manager who played dour defensive football that relied on workhorse players and square pegs in round holes to a manager who has trasnformed players who were always looking to release the ball to players who want and demand the ball and are comfortable in posession. A manager who helped us to our best ever points haul while playing a tika-taka sideways game that people raved about.

being more solid defensively is all down to having a solid and settled back four......but equally him giving licence to Barkley and Mirallas to not do any real work in the defensive third.....this is where your tracking...or lack of runner tracking comes from, we did the same last season and how people(managers) never figured that our after 10 games who had not yet played us is a shock and why did it take every team a season to figure it out?
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It often does take a season for a side to be sussed out, hence the much used "second season syndrome" cliche, as it has a ring of truth about it.

Martinez is facing a tough period and he needs to show that he's the quality manager that we all hope he is, and not some one trick pony who's on a vanity project.
 
Tobes said:
But when that happens it's not controlled, that's the point.

The long punts are invariably the result of the split CB's being pressured on the ball and launching it due to having no other option. It's not as if they're playing it looking for an opportunity to turn the opposition CB's with a ball in behind, they're just aimless hoofs, at least in Moyes era they were ****ing planned and we usually had someone up there winning them.
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How often is a long ball controlled, it travels 40-50 yards giving CB's or FB's time to get over and cover!

When you see our CB's split.....what do oyu really see? Yopu see Barry, McCarthy, Besic or one of the many others who have had to play in MF this season drop in the middle. This allows the two FB's to bomb on giving plenty of options for forward passes.

When these balls are not planned does that make the striker less effective and able to get to the ball?

If te opposition are playing so high against us, why are more of these long balls not turning the CB's? Thats becauuse teams play so deep against us. They may well play a pressing game in spells....but nothing in the game report said this for Saturdays game.
 
Tobes said:
It often does take a season for a side to be sussed out, hence the much used "second season syndrome" cliche, as it has a ring of truth about it.

Martinez is facing a tough period and he needs to show that he's the quality manager that we all hope he is, and not some one trick pony who's on a vanity project.
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Are you trying to tell people seasoned PL managers were not sure how Martinez was going to get us to play.....or others how Rodgers wuold play?
 
PJS - BACK AND BOSSING IT said:
How often is a long ball controlled, it travels 40-50 yards giving CB's or FB's time to get over and cover!

When you see our CB's split.....what do oyu really see? Yopu see Barry, McCarthy, Besic or one of the many others who have had to play in MF this season drop in the middle. This allows the two FB's to bomb on giving plenty of options for forward passes.

When these balls are not planned does that make the striker less effective and able to get to the ball?

If te opposition are playing so high against us, why are more of these long balls not turning the CB's? Thats becauuse teams play so deep against us. They may well play a pressing game in spells....but nothing in the game report said this for Saturdays game.
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How often this season have you seen both fullbacks in advanced positions tightly marked, as the opposition know we're going to look for them from the CB area. So they receive the ball under pressure and simply lay it back or inside. When at our best down the left with Baines and Pienaar, Bainess would bring the ball out and Pienaar would offer himself inside, taking the ball and then giving it back to Baines on the overlap. When was the last time you saw us work a position like that and get a full back to the byeline and get a decent cross in for Lukaku?

The problem with Martinez style is that it heavily relies on confidence, of late players haven't been showing for the ball, they've been hiding. It can become a downward spiral if you're not careful, and there's times a manager has to merely play to get a result, how it's done doesn't matter and Boxing day is one such game for Roberto.
 
PJS - BACK AND BOSSING IT said:
Are you trying to tell people seasoned PL managers were not sure how Martinez was going to get us to play.....or others how Rodgers wuold play?
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It's not that they don't know what's coming, its that no-one has come up with a game plan that completely nuilifies it, once it happens it becomes the template for others to copy, it happens all the time ffs.
 
I think as well as the points Tobes has mentioned our attackers have become lazy they don't make as many runs as they know they are not going to get It..Its just going to get passed sideways and backwards?

Our full backs are not getting forward the midfield Is static and I can count on one hand the amount of times Lukaku has touched the ball In the last 3-4 matches so something has to change weather It be formation or tactics or whatever? Its not a knee jerk reaction at all when a manager see's the game needs changing he changes It not carries on hitting his head against a wall hoping his headache will get better..
 
Tobes said:
How often this season have you seen both fullbacks in advanced positions tightly marked, as the opposition know we're going to look for them from the CB area. So they receive the ball under pressure and simply lay it back or inside. When at our best down the left with Baines and Pienaar, Bainess would bring the ball out and Pienaar would offer himself inside, taking the ball and then giving it back to Baines on the overlap. When was the last time you saw us work a position like that and get a full back to the byeline and get a decent cross in for Lukaku?

The problem with Martinez style is that it heavily relies on confidence, of late players haven't been showing for the ball, they've been hiding. It can become a downward spiral if you're not careful, and there's times a manager has to merely play to get a result, how it's done doesn't matter and Boxing day is one such game for Roberto.
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That was Moyes system and the only attacking outlet we seemed to use. martinez has us more balances and less reliant on two players down the LHS.

We will disagree on this so it will bounce back and forward as we both feel we are correct in what we say.

as Just said, why ar eofrwards not making runs? Dont give me that "they wont get it" lark. Forward players movement make space and create opening for players to run/move/have the ball played into<ok>
 
PJS - BACK AND BOSSING IT said:
That was Moyes system and the only attacking outlet we seemed to use. martinez has us more balances and less reliant on two players down the LHS.

We will disagree on this so it will bounce back and forward as we both feel we are correct in what we say.

as Just said, why ar eofrwards not making runs? Dont give me that "they wont get it" lark. Forward players movement make space and create opening for players to run/move/have the ball played into<ok>
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In fairness to Lukaku I think the lad's got bored of making runs off the shoulder and showing for the ball, only to see it knocked back inside. He cuts a frustrated figure at times, as he's not being used in the way that'll see the best of him at the minute.

We've lost the pace and urgency that was in our game last season, we've become pedestrian and predictable, if we were losing games after creating hatfuls of chances and giving our all, then I'd not be bothered. But that's not what I'm seeing at the minute and I'm concerned, as we need to turn it round quick or before we know it a decent league finish will be beyond us and we'll be out of the FA Cup.
 
Bring back David Moyes...

I hope Bill doesn't show too much patience with him the way we are playing...Does this bloke want us too play wigan next yr????
 
More of the same old ****, really glad I've bought tickets for New Years Day as well <doh>
 
Tobes said:
Not Bill's style, but for me he's lost the dressing room and that only ends one way
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Sure looks that way he needs to shut up shop more and try to start nicking 1 nillers Just to try and get some points on the board....We are In trouble at the moment
 
Tobes said:
Not Bill's style, but for me he's lost the dressing room and that only ends one way
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You really think he is the first and last manager to have 'lost the dressing room' and if so what evidence do we have on this? Players current and new were full of praise for him and his methods last season. So their poor form is now his fault and they know what is best for the club? **** them, the players are not in charge
 
PJS - BACK AND BOSSING IT said:
You really think he is the first and last manager to have 'lost the dressing room' and if so what evidence do we have on this? Players current and new were full of praise for him and his methods last season. So their poor form is now his fault and they know what is best for the club? **** them, the players are not in charge
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No, of course not, but it usually ends with them clearing their desk....

Evidence? I stated an opinion, based on watching the absolute bobbins being produced on the pitch and the lack of passion that was accompanying defeat after defeat.

Only this week Lukaku has come out and said they collectively asked him to alter the style to get the ball forward quicker, which was in evidence on Tuesday. Martinez has since come out and tried to make out that it was 'normal' dialogue, but he's covering his arse, as it was a significant shift in tactics as a direct result of the players giving him some honest feedback.
 
Tobes said:
No, of course not, but it usually ends with them clearing their desk....

Evidence? I stated an opinion, based on watching the absolute bobbins being produced on the pitch and the lack of passion that was accompanying defeat after defeat.

Only this week Lukaku has come out and said they collectively asked him to alter the style to get the ball forward quicker, which was in evidence on Tuesday. Martinez has since come out and tried to make out that it was 'normal' dialogue, but he's covering his arse, as it was a significant shift in tactics as a direct result of the players giving him some honest feedback.
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So that reads 'Martinez loses dressing room'

Better look at who is free to replace him, who would you suggest. I know who I want....
 
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