Listening to Bilic was a highlight. Him putting Ian Wright in his place was also a bonus
Match Day Thread Euro 2016 Thread
- Thread starter RogerisontheHunt
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- May 22, 2011
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Not jf big Sam is manager, will be Carroll and Defoe and long balls up to them. No need for wide players.
No, really - he is.Who is bigging him up? I've said plenty of times that he needs upgrading - I'm just arguing that he's not as bad as people make out.
I'm not someone who likes to criticise players, but we have to be realistic - the lad is a liability. Nothing against him personally, and if he got his act together I'd support him fully, but he was worse than useless last season. I feel sorry for him because he's obviously willing, and he does have some talent, but his game intelligence is non- existent, and he'll cost us more than he'll ever contribute.
Sorry to say it, but we've struggled to fill the LB role for so long, and I'm struggling to think of a worse incumbent.
Seems a likeable lad, and I'd let him buy me an Estrella any day, but he shouldn't be anywhere near our first team.
Will be interesting to see.Think you might find your criticism of Sterling is another thing to bite you on the arse now he actually has a manager
I said the other day I think Sterling has real talent - but like so many others, if you can't get your head on right then it counts for little.
So far, he's been a victim of his own self-importance - we'll see if the right manager can give him a sense of place and get the best out of him.
"As simple as doves and wise as serpents,"
Very good article....
http://www.skysports.com/football/n...6-fernando-santos8217s-men-are-worthy-winners
Very good article....
http://www.skysports.com/football/n...6-fernando-santos8217s-men-are-worthy-winners
Chelsea. The only way to beat the Spanish style (Barca style) of Tiki-taca was to be cautious and defend, it won them the CL. Teams have developed it further (from just parking the bus) into a mentality that 'avoiding defeat at all costs' is all that matters and scraping a 1-0 or going to pens is an acceptable result.
Its been made worse in this tournament by the fact that a few teams got to 2nd round either by drawing or just winning one game, Portugal wouldn't even have got out the group never mind won it under a smaller format. UEFA have encourage defensive football by making it too easy get through and to qualify in the first place.
BTW, enjoy your football under Mourinho, the master of 'not getting beat at all costs'
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lol you can't just blame it all on chelsea. Football is cyclical and at world cup 2014, most teams were very attacking and there were some great games. Teams that are inferior will naturally defend and has always been the case.
Defensive football has always been done by Italy and italian teams have been defending brilliants for years.
As for 2004 Greece won the Euros being really negative and this was before mourinho went to chelsea and won the league with conservative football.
the fact is guys don't seem to want to admit that the style played across europe is quite similar and so you have highly organised similar teams.
the fact is also theres very few players like messi in europe. the best players produced are power runners like ronaldo, bale and greizmann... we seem to not make zolas, baggios, zidanes, or iniestas much.
look at the midfields of france, portugal, germany... the pogbas and mutidis. its all power.... not all power granted but its the strength of the players that comes to the fore
the fact is also theres very few players like messi in europe. the best players produced are power runners like ronaldo, bale and greizmann... we seem to not make zolas, baggios, zidanes, or iniestas much.
look at the midfields of france, portugal, germany... the pogbas and mutidis. its all power.... not all power granted but its the strength of the players that comes to the fore
- May 22, 2011
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European football is tactical. You see that all the time, that's why Rafa was awesome in Europe and England and English clubs hard struggled recently. We try and adopt s similar approach despite our players not playing like that week in week out.
I've said all along that I watch football to be entertained, not in order to have bragging rights over rivals or some vicarious sense of achievement for a victory I played no part in. It goes without saying that I want my team to win, but not by any means.
The so-called "professionalism" of avoiding defeat at all costs is ruining so much of football for me.
That a team like Portugal can call themselves champions of Europe after such a lacklustre set of performances throughout is a travesty.The blame is on them, but also like you say, on the other teams who had the chance to beat such an average side but fell foul of their own negativity.
The exploits of Wales and Iceland apart, this tournament has largely been a thrill-free zone imo, and not a good advert for the game.
Still it's only football - not the referendum - so we'll just get over it and go on to next season.
It's a thrill free zone because (as I've said before) the technical quality of players in certain positions has dropped. Centre forwards are overrated, as are many midfielders. There are absolutely no wingers worth mentioning when you compare them to the past. Players just don't want to beat their man anymore, they'd rather pass and keep possession even if it means giving up territorial advantage.
This hasn't just happened btw, it's been a gradual process over the last 7/8 years.
Football is primarily about winning games. I don't think it's in any way a travesty that Portugal won that competition.
They did what they needed to do and came out on top. Tactically and defensively they were excellent throughout. If other teams couldn't derail them then that's not a tragedy for the game, it's just football!
If England had have won by winning via the same route as Portugal did, there'd not be many glum faces this morning bemoaning the style by which they achieved it.
They did what they needed to do and came out on top. Tactically and defensively they were excellent throughout. If other teams couldn't derail them then that's not a tragedy for the game, it's just football!
If England had have won by winning via the same route as Portugal did, there'd not be many glum faces this morning bemoaning the style by which they achieved it.
Yeah... running in behind and crossing is now bad cos theres rarely a cf in the box to score anyway.
Or playing 4 forwards is fine in a 4231 but its not a real 4. Is a advanced cm not a second striker who falls back to defend but hasnt the same skills or discipline of a real cm.
We bullshit about dcms and acms and forgive fabregas and gerrard for being woeful in tactical terms and lack discipline
Playing 2 strikers and 2 wingers is terrible on the minds of some
We say kante is a dcm... but hes not its just we lack the terms to describe a tradional honest cm playing in a cm duo with drinkwater any more.
Leicester played 442 for a good part of the season and had some serious weak players playing yet won games though good defense and causing trouble through set piece and counter attack game but they also broke teams down who sat back.
We need to divorcevourselves from the fashionable terms and see the good football where its played.
Or playing 4 forwards is fine in a 4231 but its not a real 4. Is a advanced cm not a second striker who falls back to defend but hasnt the same skills or discipline of a real cm.
We bullshit about dcms and acms and forgive fabregas and gerrard for being woeful in tactical terms and lack discipline
Playing 2 strikers and 2 wingers is terrible on the minds of some
We say kante is a dcm... but hes not its just we lack the terms to describe a tradional honest cm playing in a cm duo with drinkwater any more.
Leicester played 442 for a good part of the season and had some serious weak players playing yet won games though good defense and causing trouble through set piece and counter attack game but they also broke teams down who sat back.
We need to divorcevourselves from the fashionable terms and see the good football where its played.
I certainly wouldn't be proud of it.
If all that matters is the result why even bother watching games at all?
I've expressed discontent many times after Liverpool have ground out a win when playing badly so I'm not being hypocritical here. If we'd have won the Europey final that way I'd have accepted it, but it would be with relief rather than pride.
Occasionally, against superior opposition, you have to knuckle down and win dirty, but that doesn't justify making it your overall strategy as far as I'm concerned.
Of course, some might enjoy watching what they see as a tactical master-class rather than an exciting open game, but I'm not one of them.
It's anti-football to my mind. Nothing I've seen from Portugal this time is going to live in my memory for long.
So you didn't enjoy Liverpool winning those Big Ears back in the day then mate?
When you were the masters of grinding out results in Europe?
I think it's easy to apply football snobbery when it's not your team who's been victorious.
Winning with style is a bonus to winning. Most great sides set out as pragmatic and then add flair when they've become seasoned winners.
Hold on, look tbf to Portugal they didn't stick 10 behind the ball and play negatively. Their ONE big problem was they lacked a proper Centre Forward and focal point for their attacks. They were the underdogs in the final, but prior to that game they went forward in EVERY game but just didn't have the spark in the final third. Had they had the same tight defence but with a recognised CF they would've displayed a much better attacking flair than they were able to muster in many games.
I understand your point, and I know I'm on a hiding to nothing trying to get mine across- but I've always been critical of my own team if I think they've underperformed, even if they get the result. It frustrates me to watch negative football, no matter who's playing it.
Of course it's great to be a winner, but we're not participants here, and as an observer I want to enjoy what I'm watching, otherwise it's just a waste of time. I turned down an invite to the neighbours' last night so I could watch the final - after the 90 I went anyway because it was so dull.
As for the last sentence, Portugal are hardly new kids on the block - how long is it going to take them to add a bit of flair then? Last night apart, they have Ronny, how much more do they need?
No, mate - it's not a method forced on them through pragmatism, it's a philosophy which they and many others have adopted as the preferred route to success, a philosophy legitimised by the rest of us accepting that winning by any means is the sole criterion of participation.
That's the long-winded version
the short one is they're dull as ****.
weren't Portugal in the highest scoring game of the tournament 3-3 against Hungary (?)
i thought nearly every team played with the main concern being not to lose rather than to win - ironically not a criticism you could level at England it was just they were **** at turning all that possesion in oppositions half into chances never mind goals
i thought nearly every team played with the main concern being not to lose rather than to win - ironically not a criticism you could level at England it was just they were **** at turning all that possesion in oppositions half into chances never mind goals
There seems to a a change withinn footy where a lot of teams are realising that a system that all players buy into can be more effective than a bunch of superstars. When Portugal set out their stall v Wales we had no answer, I thought France would have an individual that could pull off a moment of brilliance but it just didn't happen and France became more and more frustrated trying to play against such a rigid formation where you simply cannot play through the middle.
It made for a poor game to watch because of Portugals system/tactics but fair play to them they got the job done.
It made for a poor game to watch because of Portugals system/tactics but fair play to them they got the job done.