Off Topic EU deabte. Which way are you voting ?

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How will you vote in the EU referendum ?

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petersaxton said:
The Remain campaign reminds me of the Sheffield Wednesday fans. Before the match they were discussing face painting and inflatables and how they had a right to get promoted. Hull City comprehensively dominated them and it was only due to a good goalkeeping display and the usual poor finishing that we only won 1-0. Afterwards the Sheffield Wednesday fans said they were proud of how all the fans stayed in their places to watch their players collect their losers medals when in reality they didn't even wait for Hull City players to collect the trophy and medals.
The only difference is most of the lies by the Remainers were before the main even and the childishness was afterwards.
They feel on safer ground now by commenting on events that wont happen until well in the future. They'll be proved wrong in the future but they are wrong now.
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You're actually getting duller Pussyman Pete. I think we should send you to negotiate the deal with the EU. The 27 leaders would eventually give you what you wanted as long as you promised to go back to Colliers Wood and promise never to come back!

Is that how Hull agreed your Pexit?
 
petersaxton said:
When I moved to London 40 odd years ago I was in an economics night class and the lecturer decided to ask questions about the UK. None of the Londoners had a clue when any place was outside London. Their lack of knowledge was frightening.
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What a ignorant, patronising and ridiculous person you are. You go to a night class for economics and make a decision about Londoners based on a handful of people some of whom, like you, may not have been Londoners at all.
 
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petersaxton said:
When I moved to London 40 odd years ago I was in an economics night class and the lecturer decided to ask questions about the UK. None of the Londoners had a clue when any place was outside London. Their lack of knowledge was frightening.
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I'm sure you "educated" them Pete!
 
petersaxton said:
It makes sense that if you are resigning then the important decisions should be made by your successor. I dont expect you to understand that. But it's how sensible people behave.
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The important decisions to be made by his successor relate to the negotiations with the EU, and not the triggering of our formal departure by invoking article 50, which he said is what he would do.

However, it appears that it has to go to a commons vote anyway, which none of them even mentioned during the campaigning, which if correct either shows their collective lack of understanding or yet another example of their lack of transparency.
 
NowsufferinginSpain said:
Like I've said Gonz, the more you look at it the more you get the feeling that we've been caught in the middle of an Old Etonian dick waving contest!
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I certainly think there was an element of that to it, but to think we have come to this situation (which I embrace) because of it is a big exaggeration for me. As I said a number of days ago, I don't believe Boris could or should take leadership, as he is inexperienced. Gove has now shown his true colours and he has an excellent intellect, but is too abrasive. May, as I have said previously is my choice and I thought her opening speech was high quality, covering a great many concerns with sensible, pragmatic solutions. I wish her well.
 
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It's becoming more and more obvious this is becoming a debate between people who voted Leave who have sensible opinions and a small bunch of Remain people who seem to not be able to say anything sensible at all and/or are reduced to being childish.
 
petersaxton said:
To just choose one point: how are the government "strangling the NHS to death"?
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Do you seriously need to ask???? My god!

They are underfunding it. They have already privatised huge amounts of it, leading to failures and increased costs wherever it has been tried. They have cut doctor and nurse training so there is a huge lack of skilled staff and because of Hunts attack on Junior doctors a exodus of skilled, caring professionals from the industry (my sister is a nurse and has said she wouldn't come back to the NHS with what the Tories are doing to it now). The Tories have cut to the bone social care and mental health care leading to a crisis in those areas, which has had a knock on effect on hospital attendances - putting further strain on an already underfunded hospital network.

But you must surely know all of the above, it is common knowledge.
 
paultheplug said:
What a ignorant, patronising and ridiculous person you are. You go to a night class for economics and make a decision about Londoners based on a handful of people some of whom, like you, may not have been Londoners at all.
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You obviously are an idiot without a simple grasp of comprehension. I didnt make a "decision about Londoners" - I was referring to the people in the class - the one's who were from London. You really have to go to classes if you want to have sufficient understanding to follow a couple of English sentences.
 
Fez said:
We should uphold the UK Constitution and not make knee-jerk demands. We voted in a party with a manifesto that included a referendum to decide Brexit; we should honour that.
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You are trying to debate this with people who don't understand the basics of democracy. One of them was saying we don't have a constitution before he was proved wrong and had to backtrack.
 
petersaxton said:
They are panicking now - like a lot of people - but once they calm down and get on with things they will realise that a free trade deal without freedom of movement is in everybody's best interests.
It was funny - I was watching a German politician saying that "you can't cherry pick" and refer to freedom of movement as an "obligation". She realises that in lots of circumstances it's not a good idea.
If there's two countries with wildly different standards of living then it is obvious that people from the poorer country will want to live and work in the richer country. Is it sensible to allow this? When the EU consisted of countries of relatively similar standards of living it wasn't a problem. Same with the Euro. It's messed up the poorer countries.
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They are not all panicking, Peter. There are some very sensible noises coming from those who will have the influence in the EU. They are concerned, certainly, and so they should be, as it has been their constant intransigence that has brought us to this and I think they realise that now. There are some very quiet voices who, perhaps, are more interested in the opportunities than the problems. There is a great deal of development to take place before there is a platform for constructive negotiations and that will be concentrated in the other 27 and beyond; we know what we must do and we are in the process of doing it. As long as Roy Hodgson isn't picking the team I'm really comfortable what is happening at the moment.
 
Fez said:
We should uphold the UK Constitution and not make knee-jerk demands. We voted in a party with a manifesto that included a referendum to decide Brexit; we should honour that.
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Can't see how a general election is knee jerk. We vote for a party but we very much do this based on who they put out there to lead the party and become our Prime Minister. IMO if the PM steps down we should have the opportunity to once again decide who is the new PM.
 
Smirnoffpriest said:
Do you seriously need to ask???? My god!

They are underfunding it. They have already privatised huge amounts of it, leading to failures and increased costs wherever it has been tried. They have cut doctor and nurse training so there is a huge lack of skilled staff and because of Hunts attack on Junior doctors a exodus of skilled, caring professionals from the industry (my sister is a nurse and has said she wouldn't come back to the NHS with what the Tories are doing to it now). The Tories have cut to the bone social care and mental health care leading to a crisis in those areas, which has had a knock on effect on hospital attendances - putting further strain on an already underfunded hospital network.

But you must surely know all of the above, it is common knowledge.
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The Conservative Party have spent more on the NHS every year since they came to power.
 
petersaxton said:
The Conservative Party have spent more on the NHS every year since they came to power.
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hmmm - hook line and sinker. I suppose you just can't teach some people can you. I suppose you think they fixed the economy, improved people's standard of living, given people more freedoms and reduced immigration - and every other thing they promised as well...
 
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Fez said:
They are not all panicking, Peter. There are some very sensible noises coming from those who will have the influence in the EU. They are concerned, certainly, and so they should be, as it has been their constant intransigence that has brought us to this and I think they realise that now. There are some very quiet voices who, perhaps, are more interested in the opportunities than the problems. There is a great deal of development to take place before there is a platform for constructive negotiations and that will be concentrated in the other 27 and beyond; we know what we must do and we are in the process of doing it. As long as Roy Hodgson isn't picking the team I'm really comfortable what is happening at the moment.
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Not all of them are panicky right now but most of them.
This guy seems to be more realistic:
"Everything will be on the table in Brexit talks, says French minister"
http://www.theguardian.com/politics...he-table-in-brexit-talks-says-french-minister
 
luvgonzo said:
Can't see how a general election is knee jerk. We vote for a party but we very much do this based on who they put out there to lead the party and become our Prime Minister. IMO if the PM steps down we should have the opportunity to once again decide who is the new PM.
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So now people want multiple referendums AND multiple General Elections. The lunatics really have lost the referendum! Isn't that the saying!?
 
Smirnoffpriest said:
hmmm - hook line and sinker. I suppose you just can't teach some people can you. I suppose you think they fixed the economy, improved people's standard of living, given people more freedoms and reduced immigration - and every other thing they promised as well...
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You seem to be unable to discuss matters like a mature adult. You jump from one thing to another while you points are demolished.
 
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