Off Topic Back to School

[SW3 Chelsea Tiger]

Thank you. It's good to see some people have a realistic view of what we face.

The government have been totally unhelpful, they changed on a tuppence and often left us baffled as to what they actually wanted to see. Many schools were left to fend for themselves. I went to a management training seminar just before lockdown and nobody had a clue what was going on in their respective schools, they just took it upon themselves to do it.

But isn’t this the best approach? A local solution based on your schools layout & situation. Why did you need exact instruction from the Gov??

My company didn’t get exact instructions on how to cope - a large dose of common sense & risk assessments fixed 99.99% of all problems

 

[look_back_in_amber]

But isn’t this the best approach? A local solution based on your schools layout & situation. Why did you need exact instruction from the Gov??

My company didn’t get exact instructions on how to cope - a large dose of common sense & risk assessments fixed 99.99% of all problems

The problem is that common sense is unfortunately no longer common.

 

[SW3 Chelsea Tiger]

The problem is that common sense is unfortunately no longer common.

if you wait on exact instructions from the gov it will never ever be based on common sense

 

[Plum]

But isn’t this the best approach? A local solution based on your schools layout & situation. Why did you need exact instruction from the Gov??

My company didn’t get exact instructions on how to cope - a large dose of common sense & risk assessments fixed 99.99% of all problems

I agree that local solutions can be more suitable but a difference is that the government is ultimately responsible for the education system, it isn't responsible for your company. The government could have issued schools with guidelines, best practice, and so on but then left schools to do their own thing.

 

[SW3 Chelsea Tiger]

I agree that local solutions can be more suitable but a difference is that the government is ultimately responsible for the education system, it isn't responsible for your company. The government could have issued schools with guidelines, best practice, and so on but then left schools to do their own thing.

Isn’t the school responsible for the child’s welfare?? This isn’t about the overall education system

 

[Plum]

Isn’t the school responsible for the child’s welfare?? This isn’t about the overall education system

The government made it about the overall education system by adopting their centralised, top-down approach and not making a very good job of it. I agree that the school is responsible for the child's welfare on a day-to day basis but I'm sure a few guidelines from the top wouldn't have gone amiss.

 

[Steven Toast]

But isn’t this the best approach? A local solution based on your schools layout & situation. Why did you need exact instruction from the Gov??

My company didn’t get exact instructions on how to cope - a large dose of common sense & risk assessments fixed 99.99% of all problems

Because education works on the basis of consistency. In a profession where we get hammered for the stupidest little thing or whatever little fad OFTSED have decided to focus on that year, is it any wonder why schools are worried about doing things independently? No other profession seems to be monitored as closely as education is, so when we ask for guidance, it isn’t because we aren’t capable of coming up with a solution, it’s because we know whatever we choose will be picked apart.

Many schools now cow-tow to parents and it’s sickening, it’s like they’re worried the parents are going to leave a bad review on Yelp or yank their kid out of mandatory education. You need parental cooperation, 100%, but parents also need to understand that schools aren’t there to cater to their whim. No, your kid can’t have an extra day off to go caravanning in May, get him in that ****ing classroom. It’s amazing the hypocrisy you hear, when we were in lockdown, it was “they need to be in the classroom learning” but now they’re back it’s “oh Excelsior won’t be in for three days because he’s in the Lake District”.

 

[Ric Glasgow]

Because education works on the basis of consistency. In a profession where we get hammered for the stupidest little thing or whatever little fad OFTSED have decided to focus on that year, is it any wonder why schools are worried about doing things independently? No other profession seems to be monitored as closely as education is, so when we ask for guidance, it isn’t because we aren’t capable of coming up with a solution, it’s because we know whatever we choose will be picked apart.

Many schools now cow-tow to parents and it’s sickening, it’s like they’re worried the parents are going to leave a bad review on Yelp or yank their kid out of mandatory education. You need parental cooperation, 100%, but parents also need to understand that schools aren’t there to cater to their whim. No, your kid can’t have an extra day off to go caravanning in May, get him in that ****ing classroom. It’s amazing the hypocrisy you hear, when we were in lockdown, it was “they need to be in the classroom learning” but now they’re back it’s “oh Excelsior won’t be in for three days because he’s in the Lake District”.

Good post..

 

[Barchullona]

Because education works on the basis of consistency. In a profession where we get hammered for the stupidest little thing or whatever little fad OFTSED have decided to focus on that year, is it any wonder why schools are worried about doing things independently? No other profession seems to be monitored as closely as education is, so when we ask for guidance, it isn’t because we aren’t capable of coming up with a solution, it’s because we know whatever we choose will be picked apart.

Many schools now cow-tow to parents and it’s sickening, it’s like they’re worried the parents are going to leave a bad review on Yelp or yank their kid out of mandatory education. You need parental cooperation, 100%, but parents also need to understand that schools aren’t there to cater to their whim. No, your kid can’t have an extra day off to go caravanning in May, get him in that ****ing classroom. It’s amazing the hypocrisy you hear, when we were in lockdown, it was “they need to be in the classroom learning” but now they’re back it’s “oh Excelsior won’t be in for three days because he’s in the Lake District”.

Bu they can have a day off for Baker days or because of teacher's industrial action (aka lack of action) or because there is a cm of snow with no ill effects on their education?

 

[Steven Toast]

Bu they can have a day off for Baker days or because of teacher's industrial action (aka lack of action) or because there is a cm of snow with no ill effects on their education?

Yep, because training days aren’t taken in lieu of mandated learning time.

Snow doesn’t impact school unless it prevents people from getting there, for a school to close because of weather you’re talking something pretty major to disrupt transport. We had bad snow a few years ago and some teachers who live in the sticks couldn’t get in, so we just covered the lessons with our own staff.

 

[Barchullona]

Yep, because training days aren’t taken in lieu of mandated learning time.

Snow doesn’t impact school unless it prevents people from getting there, for a school to close because of weather you’re talking something pretty major to disrupt transport. We had bad snow a few years ago and some teachers who live in the sticks couldn’t get in, so we just covered the lessons with our own staff.

My mate travelled from Brid to Hull to teach for over 30 years. I remember him more than once travelling from Brid, battling through drifts at Beeford to get to Hull then having to come home as the school had to shut as teachers from Hull and Cottingham hadn't come in though the snow in the Hull area was miniscule.
One of my local schools closes at the drop of a hat in any inclement weather, it is a secondary one, whilst the primary school next door remains open.

 

[look_back_in_amber]

if you wait on exact instructions from the gov it will never ever be based on common sense

Which is the reason I’d never ever wait to be instructed by the government, and never ever have.

 

[Steven Toast]

My mate travelled from Brid to Hull to teach for over 30 years. I remember him more than once travelling from Brid, battling through drifts at Beeford to get to Hull then having to come home as the school had to shut as teachers from Hull and Cottingham hadn't come in though the snow in the Hull area was miniscule.
One of my local schools closes at the drop of a hat in any inclement weather, it is a secondary one, whilst the primary school next door remains open.

I can’t speak for secondary schools, but I think their reasoning is that because the students travel to the school using things like public transport, that gives them more scope to close. Not saying that’s the exact reason, just a theory.

 

[Barchullona]

I can’t speak for secondary schools, but I think their reasoning is that because the students travel to the school using things like public transport, that gives them more scope to close. Not saying that’s the exact reason, just a theory.

I think it more down to the teachers involved. The other local secondary school tends to remain open. In a place the size of Brid most pupils, even today's unfit lot, live within walking distance and don't use public transport.

 

[Steven Toast]

I think it more down to the teachers involved. The other local secondary school tends to remain open. In a place the size of Brid most pupils, even today's unfit lot, live within walking distance and don't use public transport.

Well, if staff can't get it and they can't cover it, then yeah, there'd be a reason to close, but you're talking a lot of staff being off before a school can close.

You don't seem to have a lot of love for teachers, may I ask why?

 

[Barchullona]

Well, if staff can't get it and they can't cover it, then yeah, there'd be a reason to close, but you're talking a lot of staff being off before a school can close.

You don't seem to have a lot of love for teachers, may I ask why?

As I said, one of my mates spent his whole working life teaching in Hull. Modern day teachers tend to be a softer lot. He got to Hull from Brid but teachers who lived in Hull and Cottingham couldn't get in.
The only time my school ever closed was in 1963, a far worse winter than any recent ones, and then most reluctantly, for a brief period.

 

[originallambrettaman]

My kids school never closed due to weather, they always said if you can get the kids here, then we'll make sure there's someone ready to teach them.

 

[Howdentiger2]

As I said, one of my mates spent his whole working life teaching in Hull. Modern day teachers tend to be a softer lot. He got to Hull from Brid but teachers who lived in Hull and Cottingham couldn't get in.
The only time my school ever closed was in 1963, a far worse winter than any recent ones, and then most reluctantly, for a brief period.

I think modern day people full stop are softer!

 

[Steven Toast]

As I said, one of my mates spent his whole working life teaching in Hull. Modern day teachers tend to be a softer lot. He got to Hull from Brid but teachers who lived in Hull and Cottingham couldn't get in.
The only time my school ever closed was in 1963, a far worse winter than any recent ones, and then most reluctantly, for a brief period.

I don't think anybody is softer than they were, say, 20 years ago. There are better approaches and more detailed ways to assess and break down barriers to learning. From a professional standpoint, there's more there to support teachers, but I don't understand why anybody would begrudge the education sector that support just because previous generations didn't have the foresight to implement it.

The quality of teaching has massively improved, I'm now teaching things to six year olds that I wasn't taught until I reached Year 6 and that's massive. But that's because the expectation we have of younger people has gone up enormously since I started school some 30 odd years ago. We all start out with the same hardware, more or less, it bugs me that I wasn't taught like children are today because my peers and I would have been capable of doing it, though I'll concede that technology has played a huge part in the evolution of teaching and that has made life easier.

 

[DMD]

I think modern day people full stop are softer!

I blame the teachers.