Morgan please stay
- Thread starter lamby
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I do not think we will be related this coming season, but I think the moral in the team will have taken a huge knock. The leadership on the pitch is critical, as will the motivation of the dressing room, plus leadership in the club itself. I am so proud of what we have achieved us NC; it will take special leadership to keep this club together. What is my concern is where that is coming from...
As it is for all of us (in terms of the board). However spin your concern round - we've employed a hugely respected manager with a big reputation in the football world, signed the highest chance creator statistically in Europe (by a mile), will be bringing in a younger, more mobile replacement for Rickie, and several more players having received inflated prices for our outgoing players. I think we'll end up about 12th. It's the season after that we'll see how we're really doing. It's new times, there's nothing we can do to change things, so we may as well embrace it.
Yeah...even if we don't miss on a single addition, people are really underselling how difficult it is to turn 7-10 new players into a cohesive side overnight.
The season is just five weeks away; all of our business won't be done by then, and even many of those who are brought in beforehand will only get a couple weeks of training with the squad. I'm hopeful that we won't be relegation fodder, but with such upheaval we could well hit Christmas flirting with the drop zone before things start to come together.
From the rumours/leaks we read from someone ITK/Insider then I think moral in the team had already taken a knock. The talk of player(s) not putting the effort in et al smacks of division within the dressing room to me and for all we know starting afresh and removing any 'want-aways' may actually make moral better.
I am like LTL. I am quite excited by the prospect of watching a manager build a side in his own image from virtual scratch rather than have to mix and match his choices with incumbants and risk the wrath of the crowd should he remove any crowd favourites from the first 11. I still predict (depending on us getting who RK wants) a very good season ahead.
Football, like any business, relies on the internal perception of progress, of advancement based on belief, in all aspects of life; it's about people and the motivation that you engender. Going forwards it's about establishing a framework that people buy into. It drives success on a personal level and within a team environment. NC and ML understood this at a fundamental level; the players and staff believed in what we were trying to achieve.
It's why leadership now is required; it's not about being able to buying player with the cash we have generated; there are those in life who will always put cash first; that does not buy you success; because the foundation is who you are and where you want to get to out of your one chance on this planet; be it at Saints or any company you work for. NC sold an idea, that so many at Saints bought into; I see it all the time in life and in business; you manage theirs and you own expectations. The owner and the directors at Saints now need to get us back on track.
Cortese sold a dream that could never happen the way he was going about it. Now instead of throwing cash at having a very good match day squad we will have a squad with depth. We will also try and build Saints the right way by increasing our profits. Instead of relying on a billionaire to cover our debts over and over again.
But we are talking about a transitional phase. The club vision, the one that moved us forward, was great until we hit the Premier League, and then it suddenly became an issue between KL and NC. Why? Well, it looks like money. Evidence? Overspends, players coming here despite interest from elsewhere, rumours of big bonuses. KL tried to get NC to compromise, asked him to share power with others - and he refused. He left. He left a vacuum where his enormous presence had been. Now, we're trying to fill the hole - but how do you fill the hole with honesty when no one wants to hear it?
-- We aim to be club without debt
-- We want to focus on the development of youth
-- We would like to push higher in the league (but CL is probably an overspend)
-- We do not HAVE to sell players (but will if it is in the club's best interests)
These are the things we have been told. They all appear to be true. Still, fans rant and rave as if we hadn't been in League 1 just a few years back. Still they whinge and cry, as if we even filled our 32,000 seater stadium most games last year. What is wrong with realistic ambitions? Nothing - unless you were sold the club on unrealistic ones. Over the last few years, our players have been indoctrinated with win or bust. Well, there is no leadership in the world that will re-educate these guys into having realistic ambitions. We have hope for Morgan because he's been through it all and is a sensible guy, but he's going to have great offers and he may leave.
We'll survive. We still have the core of a very good team. Boruc, Clyne, Fonte, Cork, Wanyama, Davis, JWP, JRod -- and now Tadic. That's not a total rebuild requirement. Those are not average players. Saints will be okay.
Let's see what realistic, honest, within-our-means management can get us.
But we weren't hemorrhaging cash in the most recent set of books, and that included our spending spree upon arrival (and didn't include the bounty received for our final position last year). It would have been trivially easy to run the club at or close to break-even without a selling spree.
I don't think the "selling spree" is related to the financial running of the club, more to the goings on at the club from January todate
I agree entirely. I'm just not that fond of declaring whatever we're doing to be "the right way" and whatever preceded it "the wrong, unsustainable way" as a justification for the goings on at the club from January on. Because selling it that way also undercuts the message from many of the same individuals that we don't need to sell, they aren't doing this for the cash, etc.
I'll not say the same as Beefy about realism. HE has that covered.
It is fine to say it is about building a framework that people buy into but its no good to continue with said framework when you realise it doesn't fit the plan. If we manage to replace every player with equal or better then we may be at an advantage having removed some players that were obviously pissing off others with their attitude.
Were we building a framework? Seems to me that people think it was virtually built and that just keeping that framework together would progress us. I probably bought into that hype too but looking back even with fond memories and great respect the day when/if we finish 4th or better in the PL, would Lallana, Lambert or Lovren be good enough to be in that side? And I mean imagine time is irrelevant? The answer is no so we would have replaced those 3 anyway.
Shaw maybe, although I still have doubts. He is a good full back, great runner but the final ball isn't there....yet.
Morgan is probably the only one we could realistically say would be good enough, however if he bought into the hype that the rest were good enough and part of said framework then lets take the framework down and rebuild it properly and this time try and get the framework to fit the plan.
So far so good IMO. Tadic looks to be the real deal and certainly looks like he could be better than Lallana. More of that kind of progression and I will be wetting my pants for next season more than I was before we ****ed things up last time (when we could have gone 2nd) against Arsenal and then Chelsea.
But those leaving are leaving for ambition that was sold to them by Cortese. I think we are right to backtrack from it. It is dangerous, and a better model for our club is the sustainable, youth developing, upper mid table team we seem to want to be. However, the players don't want that. They were told something different. Now we have no choice but to sell them as ours is not a glamorous new vision. It's a hard sell for top players, but a necessity for the club.
We were a youth-developing, upper mid-table team, but we were also in a financial position to make modest additions to that squad and perhaps continue to move upward and sate those ambitions (or at least offer the hope that we would do so in time).
Look, it's entirely possible that the new management will push us on to something great. But I don't see the reason that people have to tear down or distort what was a rather successful and rather sustainable tenure of the guy that came before.
As I read and listened to what was said at the time was that we were trying to break the mold of how clubs succeed in the EPL; doing deals under the radar; generating a playing style and about how we go about running our club. All good stuff; hopefully we will follow the NC programme that he put together with ML.
Can I add that this debate tonight is really good, whilst my comments may not sit well with some of you; the constructive commentary has been great. Thank you for engaging with what I have written.
I get really pissed off when people think they are irreplaceable.
Bankers saying that unless they get big bonuses they'll bugger off overseas and stars saying that unless the tax regime is changed in their favour then they'll be off.
As far as I am concerned they can all pack their bags and f** off now.
There are plenty of people waiting to take their jobs.
So if our footballers are unhappy then they too can bugger of including Morgan (but please don't tell you know who that I said that).
If we wake up tomorrow morning and the President of the USA, the Prime Minister of GB and the Queen are all dead I can assure you the world will still go on.
Not one single person in the world is irreplaceable except maybe to their close loved ones.
Morgan, Lovren, Lallana, Shaw et al can all f** off and Southampton FC will still be here.
The club will outlive them and it will outlive me.
Bankers saying that unless they get big bonuses they'll bugger off overseas and stars saying that unless the tax regime is changed in their favour then they'll be off.
As far as I am concerned they can all pack their bags and f** off now.
There are plenty of people waiting to take their jobs.
So if our footballers are unhappy then they too can bugger of including Morgan (but please don't tell you know who that I said that).
If we wake up tomorrow morning and the President of the USA, the Prime Minister of GB and the Queen are all dead I can assure you the world will still go on.
Not one single person in the world is irreplaceable except maybe to their close loved ones.
Morgan, Lovren, Lallana, Shaw et al can all f** off and Southampton FC will still be here.
The club will outlive them and it will outlive me.
Bang on Godders, well said.
"It's not the name on the back of the shirt that's important, but the name on the front."
"It's not the name on the back of the shirt that's important, but the name on the front."
Bless you Godders - you have always written what you believe and at times you have upset others; as far as I am concerned (which matters little) I have always appreciated you views and frequently agree with the sentiment you express!