Cricket One day series

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This says an awful lot more about an inability to manage a maverick/bit of a twat, than it does about the disruptiveness of our best batsman. It's a management failure. Think Gasgoigne, Best, Cantona. Hell, even Le Tiss. Management challenges one and all, but all touched by genius. You find a way to accommodate and manage these players.

Appallingly weak from the ECB.
 
Not every one can be managed. Sometimes it isn't worth the cost to the team. If he had set the world alight in the recent series in Australia, he probably wouldn't have been ditched, but if they are going to overhaul the team (which probably means a few seasons of mediocrity) they must have felt they might as well get rid of one problem. It's a shame because he can be brilliant, but is he brilliant frequently enough?

As for Bob Willis...how can a man so knowledgeable and sensible be so boring to listen to. I never know whether to slap myself awake or him.
 
Le Tissier's Laces said:
This says an awful lot more about an inability to manage a maverick/bit of a t**t, than it does about the disruptiveness of our best batsman. It's a management failure. Think Gasgoigne, Best, Cantona. Hell, even Le Tiss. Management challenges one and all, but all touched by genius. You find a way to accommodate and manage these players.

Appallingly weak from the ECB.
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You do LTL, but at some point you say "enough" we are moving on. If he had been 26-30, then maybe. But at 33 and although a good few years left in him, maybe they feel that the disruptiveness would now hold back the development of the next England era/team. This after all is the tail end of Strauss' team and KP saw him off.
 
fatletiss said:
You do LTL, but at some point you say "enough" we are moving on. If he had been 26-30, then maybe. But at 33 and although a good few years left in him, maybe they feel that the disruptiveness would now hold back the development of the next England era/team. This after all is the tale end of Strauss' team and KP saw him off.
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Okay, agreed, but I'd like to know what makes him so utterly unmanageable......and how this perceived disruptiveness takes shape. He's another 3-4 years of top level cricket in him otherwise.....
 
Le Tissier's Laces said:
This says an awful lot more about an inability to manage a maverick/bit of a twat, than it does about the disruptiveness of our best batsman. It's a management failure. Think Gasgoigne, Best, Cantona. Hell, even Le Tiss. Management challenges one and all, but all touched by genius. You find a way to accommodate and manage these players.

Appallingly weak from the ECB.
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So why has Osvaldo left saints then ?
 
Don't mind Cook trying to show some authority and to break away from this team being built by Strauss. It has to be rebuilt, even ignoring the KP situation.

Really don't understand why KP is suddenly getting sympathy for being a massive bellend. He's not even been a good cricketer recently to offset it.

He's had numourous chances and HE'S been the one to **** them up. **** him.
 
Number 1 Jasper said:
So why has Osvaldo left saints then ?
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There's a big (massive) difference between a fairly good international striker who headbutts teammates, and one of the leading run scorers ever across all formats for his country. Age is a pointless argument - Gooch scored 14 international centuries after the age of 34. Yes, he's out of form at the moment, but he's hardly getting backed by his country and management, so it's no wonder he's been off his game. He was also the leading scorer (not saying much) for this Ashes tour - if he goes, what about Cook, Bell etc etc.

Are you telling me the likes of Flintoff and Botham were easier to manage? I rather doubt it.

It's a bloody mess, but sacking the person who is still your best (and box office) player, to me smacks of weakness.
 
Le Tissier's Laces said:
There's a big (massive) difference between a fairly good international striker who headbutts teammates, and one of the leading run scorers ever across all formats for his country. Age is a pointless argument - Gooch scored 14 international centuries after the age of 34. Yes, he's out of form at the moment, but he's hardly getting backed by his country and management, so it's no wonder he's been off his game. He was also the leading scorer (not saying much) for this Ashes tour - if he goes, what about Cook, Bell etc etc.

Are you telling me the likes of Flintoff and Botham were easier to manage? I rather doubt it.

It's a bloody mess, but sacking the person who is still your best (and box office) player, to me smacks of weakness.
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I agree my point was rather extreme , but it is still a valid point IMHO . As for bell & cook , well Bell not sure , but I did say earlier that if Flower has gone and kp has gone , how on earth cook is still captain is beyond me .

Regards Dani , we know he head butted a team mate ( we were told so ) , we don't know what KP did , and there is the problem .

PS

REF Flintoff & Botham , difficult characters in so far as they Lived life to the full , but when were they ever criticised for not playing for the TEAM ?
 
Pieteresen is on another planet to Osvaldo in their respective sports. Pietersen is the equivalent to Messi or Ronaldo with the bat considering how he plays across all three formats. Evidence also stacks up against Osvaldo. There is no actual evidence Pietersen has done anything wrong at the moment.
 
RelentlessPressure said:
Pieteresen is on another planet to Osvaldo in their respective sports. Pietersen is the equivalent to Messi or Ronaldo with the bat considering how he plays across all three formats. Evidence also stacks up against Osvaldo. There is no actual evidence Pietersen has done anything wrong at the moment.
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At the moment .
 
RelentlessPressure said:
Pieteresen is on another planet to Osvaldo in their respective sports. Pietersen is the equivalent to Messi or Ronaldo with the bat considering how he plays across all three formats. Evidence also stacks up against Osvaldo. There is no actual evidence Pietersen has done anything wrong at the moment.
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No they are TEAM PLAYERS .
 
RelentlessPressure said:
Give me some actual evidence that Pietersen isn't a team player. He can earn four times as much in the IPL in 8 weeks than he can earn for England in a year. There's only ever hot air from people that don't like KP.

Re-worded this.
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Give me some evidence that he is !

Ref hot air from people , read Agnews comments & Boycotts and Vaughan ( sp ) though he ( MV ) changes his mind so often it's not true .
 
Seems Pietersen's biggest critic in the dressing room was Matt Prior - widely regarded by many in the game as one of the most egotistical bellends ever to play the sport.
 
Agnew and others are bang on to say that the only people who can really comment on KP are the people he has shared a dressing room with. We can form whatever opinions of him that we like, based on what we hear and read, but the fact that is we don't know. We haven't experienced KP first hand.

What I would say though is that, in my opinion, it's a strong indication that it will be Giles and Cook who lead us forward from here. Cook would have gone by now if he was going - possibly before Flower, but certainly before KP. And as for Giles, well the point about waiting for new coach to come in and give his views is a valid one. And it is strange that we've cut all ties with KP before that new coach has been appointed. Unless of coach, said new coach is already there, already part of the set-up.

(And the argument that we had no choice but to make a decision on KP this week, prior to the WC t20 squad being announced tomorrow is a slightly weak one, because we could have easily have just dropped him like any 'normal' player, but at the same time kept the door open for the summer if he were to play for Surrey and score runs).

Very big summer coming up for Cook now. Horrendous Ashes tour, no KP, Swann and (presumably) Trott. Unless his form returns, probably no Prior too. The knives are already out for him as captain, and the last 24 hours they've been sharpened even further. Great captains should be able to handle a variety of players, not just the easy to manage ones. Failure to produce decent results - and performances - against Sri Lanka and India could be the end for his captaincy. And even a strong showing from our t20 squad in the limited overs tour to WI and t20 WC over the next six weeks could harm him. After the Ashes ODI series, a strong showing from Broad as captain could see him taking Cook's ODI place as captain before too long. And as Flower, Strauss, and Vaughan have all showed in the recent past, once you lose or give up that overall control, it's often the beginning of the end.
 
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