Noticed someone on CI had posted this video up: [video=youtube;piPrkoQFVqo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piPrkoQFVqo&feature=youtu.be[/video] Are you saying the KC atmosphere is better than that? ...and there are less fans there than at the KC! They also have fireworks and there is a lot of paper flying about mixing with flares - how many mass footballing disasters have there been in Greece due to flares? As BCC said, it's all about the authorities trying to take the fun out of going to football - the lad wasn't causing any trouble by letting off the flare. It's the same with going for a night out - soo many people don't bother anymore for similar reasons - I'm all for being well behaved, but people can't even sing or shout in the streets on a night out anymore without being classed as 'drunk and disorderly'.
Couldnt disagree more - the flare shows EXACTLY those elements for me, much more so than a **** with a plastic flag.
The reason your mate was let off was that flares in public are so rare as to be irrelevant. Let off a person for a flare at a match, and you set a precedent. Suddenly, every other precocious 15 year old will be doing it and you can then ramp up the deterrent. Acrid smoke isn't my idea of fun. Anyone that resorts to hyperbole to win this argument is missing the point. You can have a great, noisy atmosphere lawfully. Eradicate the idiots, and the rest of us will be left alone to have fun (and porbably have a little more discretion to push the limits by the stewards). The idiots make the stewards and police have to react, and just gives the fans a bad name. Some twisted logic, here.
I personally quite like the flares its just a bit of fun but they're banned for reasons. For example away at Posh some lad came and stood right next to me and set off a smoke bomb, it stunk of **** and I hated it took me ages to get the smell out my expensive jacket too, but had I took my lass who's got severe asthma she WOULD have had an asthma attack from that and then both of us would probably have had to miss the rest of the game. So yeah it might be harmless fun to some, but it can cause no end of problems for others, so they're right to be banned IMO, but to dish out a 3 year banning order is just overkill. Eject them from the ground at the time of doing it and fine them, that will soon stop people doing it.
Dida wasn't burnt, it hit him on his shoulder. So should we ban all coins being taken into stadiums because some idiots throw them at players?
I'm not looking at it from a health and safety view cause I agree health and safety at football had gone bonkers but I just don't get what it adds. We sing to support the players, I wear my scarf to support the players and call me naive but I'd like to think that when a player sees a bank of Black & Amber and hears us sing they get a lift and a buzz. When they see a flare go off I'd imagine their thoughts to be 'dick'. It might just be me, I just don't get it.
i.e. ban the idiots. Allow the rest to do as they like - they can be trusted to self regulate. Flares are illegal at football - deal with it. Whether banning them is right or not is a different argument. So is the length of the punishment.
Before all seater stadiums the atmosphere at English football matches used to be envied and copied by continental clubs. Now fans at every English club complain about the atmosphere and envy the continental clubs. Our game is dying from sterilisation and regulation and needs a turning point and injection of some of the continental ultra spirit so i'm completely in favour of flares and the fledgling ultra groups that a starting to appear. Save real football atmosphere, you'll all miss it when its gone.
Almost makes me want to stop going to football... Wasn't even a Real flare .... ****ing hell these Harmless things are let off in grounds all over the world and add to the carnival type atmosphere in my opinion... No flags ... No banging on advertising boards ... No standing up half the time ... Might as well **** off and watch Chess in silence ... Iv let Real Flares off on a boat and these smoke things are not flares . Grrrr I hope the lad appeals...
you make a brilliant argument against yourself! those halcyon days of standing stadiums and the atmosphere that created due to singing, chanting and fan camaraderie was absolutely naff all to do with flares!!! hoot an air horn, sing your heart out, wave your flag but smog me out and choke me up and you add nothing to my enjoyment and nothing to the buzz/atmosphere.
So lobby for flares to be legalised (good luck). Right now they are illegal, so the argument it is ridiculous to ban someone for setting one off is spurious. It is a choice to set one off, and you do so knowing the potential consequences. The next person to let a flare off knows the risks, now, and a fine wouldn't be much of a deterrent.
A lad I know just tweeted me and said he was stood near to this lad at that game and said the excessive ban was probably due to the fact the lad threw the flare directly at someone. So that makes more sense, he was stupid with it.
PS - I'm with you on the need for fantastic atmosphere. I prefer no laws, and people having the sense to know what is safe and reasonable. Sadly, football attracts half wits who spoil it for the rest. They are the people who you should direct your animosity towards. They are the ones that always spoil everything for the rest of us. A bit like putting alcohol prices up to stop alcoholics - you punish the moderate drinker to pay for the idiots who spoil it for the rest. The Circle will be better for banning orders, and it is the only way the kid supporters of the future are going to to feel safe turning up. (not sure where the gang violence, stadium disasters, Eupropean bans and bigotry is in the nostalgia being articulated on here - very selective). Inernational Rugby Union has some of the most amazing atmospheres I have ever epxerienced. At Twickenham they don't even have turnstiles. Why? Fans know how to behave. In football, a small percentage are thugs and push the limits all the way.
Why is it? So there's one example of an idiot throwing a flare and hitting a player. There are hundreds of incidents of people throwing coins at players. In light of this, which is more appropriate to ban then?
A complete twat let one off at bellend rd when we whipped them earlier this season and I'm surprised the ****wit got out alive. The smoke was acrid and anyone within 50 yards of him could hardly see or breathe, the rest of us spent 20 minutes with scarves/shirts over our face trying not to pass out. It screams "I'm a cock" just as much as turning up with a drum
Still, in a packed out stand, these things can cause health problems. They may look good and be a bit of fun, but the person next to you might have health issues and be forced to leave the game or worst case be put in hospital from it, like I said my lass has bad asthma and something like that would cause huge complications. So is it really fair to be setting them off?
So lets ban people taking coins into a game: ****ing god help us, if you take coins into a game you might just fancy buying a pint or pie, if you take a flare what are you going to do with it except let it off / it won't buy you many pies. Get a grip with your logic.
