Good on you nicky

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This isn't a criticism of Barmby or the team, just want to add the question into the mix of what's already been said.
Do you think Barmby might still have his playing head on and is still looking at the players as team mates and still feels part of that team spirit and is reluctant to change it?
 
rovertiger said:
This isn't a criticism of Barmby or the team, just want to add the question into the mix of what's already been said.
Do you think Barmby might still have his playing head on and is still looking at the players as team mates and still feels part of that team spirit and is reluctant to change it?
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team spirit is important, i think the problem maybe that weve got a real honest bunch of players who are playing as a team but maybe we need one or two to bit a little more selfish especially infront of goal
 
I too agree that the current system isn't working. Apart from the defense, there only seems to me to be 2 players who are suited to the way we currently play... McKenna and Koren. Koren is able to drop into space and then run at the defence and shoot. The problem is that our game plan now seems to revolve around giving the ball to Koren 20-25 yards out so he can have a dig. This wont work every game as shown last night.

We seem to be setting up the team to play the same way home or away and for me this system works best as an away formation, not a home formation against a team that havent kept an away clean sheet all season. Doncaster were rubbish last night, they were there for the taking and after 10-15 mins last night I felt quite confident but then all sense of urgency that the team had disappeared for the rest of the game as though they thought it would come without too much effort. (Please dont confuse this with me saying they didn't work had, I just meant there was no urgency in the passing and movement after the 1st 15 mins).

I thought Fryatt did well last night, yes he should have hit the target with the shot in the first half after having so much time to set himself but he is so isolated with the way we play at the moment.

I didn't boo yesterday and I personally didn't think it was right but I didn't particularly agree with Barmby when he said he was pleased with the players and thought they did well. Barmby as a player was all about being 100 miles an hour closing down the man on the ball and really pushing himself and others in the team but didn't demand the same as a manager last night. (See above urgency comment).

Also after being given a stat by Theo on twitter last night I believe Oli will be the first man to score from a corner in what will be over 120 attempts by the time it happens.
 
I think the opposite to this.

I said in the early part of the season when Mr. Personality was playing Koren wide on the wing, that if you are going to play Koren, you have to build your side around him. That is what Barmby has done.

Koren cannot tackle. Koren needs space. Accept that and adapt your side to it and you will maximise what Koren has to offer. Playeing 4-2-3-1 achieves this. When people talk about formations they have to uderstand you can have the most brilliant formation and plan in the world, but if you don't have the players to implement it, it will never work. We have the players to implement 4-2-3-1.................apart from one position; the lone striker.

All the other pegs are in the correct holes but we haven't got anyone at the club who is a natural at that lone striker role. That is why I was amazed that Barmby seemingly chose not to sign anyone in the transfer window.
 
It's not just Fryatt that doesn't fit, Stewart and mclean aren't working either, they aren't scoring and are not really creating.

I agree that this gets the best out of Koren but the rest of the team aren't chipping in with the goals. I would suggest that if Fryatt had a strike partner the goals tally would increase.

Is it a coincidence that two of or clearest chances came in the last 5-10 mind when the structure appeared to be more of a 442? McLean had gone up front, king and koren were out wide.
 
tekkerz said:
It's not just Fryatt that doesn't fit, Stewart and mclean aren't working either, they aren't scoring and are not really creating.

I agree that this gets the best out of Koren but the rest of the team aren't chipping in with the goals. I would suggest that if Fryatt had a strike partner the goals tally would increase.

Is it a coincidence that two of or clearest chances came in the last 5-10 mind when the structure appeared to be more of a 442? McLean had gone up front, king and koren were out wide.
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I must admit McLean is being shoehorned into the side at the moment because of his vigour and presence. He is a square peg in a round hole. Stewart is where he should be, it's just that he is out of form at the moment.


Tell you what look at this team. This, in my view is a team that matches the formation with everyon in their correct position:

Mannone

Rosenior Chester Hobbs Dudgeon

McKenna Evans

Brady Koren Stewart

Lambert.


Now I know we don't have Lambert but that not relevant to the point I am making. Lambert is a specialised lone striker. Fryatt is not. Brady and Stewart and fast skillful wide players who can both play on the right or left, Koren is the creator in the hole behind the striker. Don't confuse form with ability, I know Brady and Stewart are not playing well at the moment, this is about ability and use. That side would walk this league. Who is the player in that side we do not have? Answer : the lone striker and it is that that we need.

In answer to you last point, in the last 5-10 minutes of games when substitutions occur and games become strtched as players tire, formations become blurred player find more space. So, Yes, I think a seeming 442 formation providing more clear cut chances is a coincidence. I think they happen for different reasons.
 
God's teeth, we are top 6, why are people moaning? January 4 seasons ago was W1, D1, L1 and in February W2 D3. It wasn't until March 2008 we came to life.

The fix for the goals is not in the transfer market (note Torres and Carroll) but on the training ground and in the player's heads. McLean and Fryatt are both proven goalscorers, Simpson can play when he wants to, Brady and Stewart are still learning their trade. We have good forwards going through a lean patch, it won't last. The lean patch will end sooner with the fans behind them instead of on their backs. I totally back what Nick Barmby said on the radio after the game.

Keep the faith.
 
Imahappypsycho said:
God's teeth, we are top 6, why are people moaning? January 4 seasons ago was W1, D1, L1 and in February W2 D3. It wasn't until March 2008 we came to life.

The fix for the goals is not in the transfer market (note Torres and Carroll) but on the training ground and in the player's heads. McLean and Fryatt are both proven goalscorers, Simpson can play when he wants to, Brady and Stewart are still learning their trade. We have good forwards going through a lean patch, it won't last. The lean patch will end sooner with the fans behind them instead of on their backs. I totally back what Nick Barmby said on the radio after the game.

Keep the faith.
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Problem is, dont think Barmby wants him to!
 
Imahappypsycho said:
God's teeth, we are top 6, why are people moaning? January 4 seasons ago was W1, D1, L1 and in February W2 D3. It wasn't until March 2008 we came to life.

The fix for the goals is not in the transfer market (note Torres and Carroll) but on the training ground and in the player's heads. McLean and Fryatt are both proven goalscorers, Simpson can play when he wants to, Brady and Stewart are still learning their trade. We have good forwards going through a lean patch, it won't last. The lean patch will end sooner with the fans behind them instead of on their backs. I totally back what Nick Barmby said on the radio after the game.

Keep the faith.
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No, they're not!

As for the Torres Carroll comment, well are you saying that nobody has ever signed a striker in a transfer window that has proved to be a success??? If not, I don't see what your point is. For every expensive flop there is an expensive success: Demba Ba, Wayne Rooney, Aguero, Suarez, Drogba etc etc etc.
 
Circa said:
You don't have to even like football to know that goals usually gets you wins but only two teams in the league have won more games than we have and we've not been scoring much from day 1 this season. We're in for a season of 1-0's maybe 2-1's but so be it. I know that everyone's thinking " if only we scored more, with the defence we have, we're sorted" but it's very hard to get that balance. All teams above us have conceded more goals and all teams below us. More goals would most likely mean having to concede that fact. I'd rather have 1-0 wins ( which obviously means you risk losing 1-0 or drawing 0-0 more often) than winning 3-1 one week and getting tonked 1-4 the next... Some may see it as more entertaining but being consistently solid is more important imo.
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Bollocks. We can create 15 chances while keeping a clean sheet, so I don't see why converting 2 or 3 of them would mean we suddenly can't defend.

It's not rocket science really, the reason we don't concede goals is because we have a great goalie, defence and midfield. The reason we don't score goals is because we have crap strikers. If we didn't create chances I'd say we have a crap midfield but as we do create them and it's just finishing them that's the problem it's pretty obvious that the blame lies with the strikers.

StrovolosTiger said:
I must admit McLean is being shoehorned into the side at the moment because of his vigour and presence. He is a square peg in a round hole. Stewart is where he should be, it's just that he is out of form at the moment.


Tell you what look at this team. This, in my view is a team that matches the formation with everyon in their correct position:

Mannone

Rosenior Chester Hobbs Dudgeon

McKenna Evans

Brady Koren Stewart

Lambert.


Now I know we don't have Lambert but that not relevant to the point I am making. Lambert is a specialised lone striker. Fryatt is not. Brady and Stewart and fast skillful wide players who can both play on the right or left, Koren is the creator in the hole behind the striker. Don't confuse form with ability, I know Brady and Stewart are not playing well at the moment, this is about ability and use. That side would walk this league. Who is the player in that side we do not have? Answer : the lone striker and it is that that we need.

In answer to you last point, in the last 5-10 minutes of games when substitutions occur and games become strtched as players tire, formations become blurred player find more space. So, Yes, I think a seeming 442 formation providing more clear cut chances is a coincidence. I think they happen for different reasons.
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I agree entirely with everything in this post.
 
StrovolosTiger:2207809 said:
I must admit McLean is being shoehorned into the side at the moment because of his vigour and presence. He is a square peg in a round hole. Stewart is where he should be, it's just that he is out of form at the moment.


Tell you what look at this team. This, in my view is a team that matches the formation with everyon in their correct position:

Mannone

Rosenior Chester Hobbs Dudgeon

McKenna Evans

Brady Koren Stewart

Lambert.


Now I know we don't have Lambert but that not relevant to the point I am making. Lambert is a specialised lone striker. Fryatt is not. Brady and Stewart and fast skillful wide players who can both play on the right or left, Koren is the creator in the hole behind the striker. Don't confuse form with ability, I know Brady and Stewart are not playing well at the moment, this is about ability and use. That side would walk this league. Who is the player in that side we do not have? Answer : the lone striker and it is that that we need.

In answer to you last point, in the last 5-10 minutes of games when substitutions occur and games become strtched as players tire, formations become blurred player find more space. So, Yes, I think a seeming 442 formation providing more clear cut chances is a coincidence. I think they happen for different reasons.
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I agree with a large part of that. I do think we needed to bring in another striker Fryatt isn't a lone striker and we don't have one at the club. (In my opinion Mclean is the nearest we have). Jason Roberts would have fit the bill but alas, it want to be.

The trouble is the one man who had the power to change that felt that there was no need. You, I and obviously a number of other people would disagree with him.

I like the theory behind or current system but I don't feel this theory is working in practice. I think it would be better suited to the PL.

I would like it better if one of McKenna or Evans was a but more attack minded and creative. We don't seem to have someone who can play a killer pass. I am hopeful that Oli can give a bit more of this if selected. But movement from the front 3 needs to be improved to create the space.
 
Funny how situations change in football, we were all fine with snatching a win against Reading, then Crawley beat our second string and suddenly we're all whinging again.

I looked on the BBC website and saw we created 20 chances last night, so i really can't see where you say we're not creating anything.

I could probably agree with the boo boys if we weren't creating chances, but we're on top of alot of games and the opposition keepers are usually far busier than ours.

In my opinion, it's just down to confidence and having a bit of bottle.

I don't know what's happening behind the scenes, ie, if Barmby is just being stubborn, or whether he truely believes in the likes of Fryatt & Mclean's scoring abilities or whether the Allam's haven't stumped up the money for further transfers, i haven't got a clue.

On further note- Dudgeon's missus is well fit and all.
 
I guess that depends on your definition of chances. We may have had 20 shots but I only recall us having 3 or 4 good chances. Granted that should have been more than enough to put them to bed.

It's all very well having lots of possession but if you have to rely on pot shots from 20-30 yards rather than creating clear cut chances you won't win that many games.

Stats don't always paint an accurate picture which was something that used to annoy me about Phil brown.
 
tekkerz said:
I guess that depends on your definition of chances. We may have had 20 shots but I only recall us having 3 or 4 good chances. Granted that should have been more than enough to put them to bed.

It's all very well having lots of possession but if you have to rely on pot shots from 20-30 yards rather than creating clear cut chances you won't win that many games.

Stats don't always paint an accurate picture which was something that used to annoy me about Phil brown.
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It's a bit hard to get 20 shots on goal, all of them from 6 yards out, when the opposition have 10 men behind the ball at all times.

Even the better teams find it hard to breakdown that.

Give them some credit for having a go. At least they're creating chances.
 
We all agree we're not scoring enough, I'm not denying that. I just think we should have sold if we wanted to change our strike force. We can't just keep adding players in hope! otherwise we could have 7/8 strikers and still not score.
As a manager I understand the logic behind sticking with what we have and try and make it work. Keep creating chances and we'll score eventually.
 
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