Off Topic What is a woke thing?

[gftiger]

You could also argue that certain musical artists have become victims of cancel culture - or at least censorship - in recent years. So for example, you will not hear the original versions of the following songs on the radio anymore, because the lyrics might offend someone:

Fairytale of New York - Pogues/ Kirsty

Oliver's army - Elvis Costello

Peaches - The Stranglers

There are probably loads of others but those three just sprang to mind. That said, censorship is nothing new to the BBC. In the 60's they would only show Elvis Presley from the waist up, and the Stones hit "Let's spend the night together" could only be played with the lyrics changed to "Let's spend some time together."
In the 70's they banned the Sex Pistols "God save the Queen" and in the 80's Frankie Goes to Hollywood, "Relax."

All goes back to freedom of speech / expression and who decides what we can say or hear

Freedom of speech doesn’t mean you’re free from the responsibility and consequences of offending or hurting someone.

Also, those examples from the 60s, 70s, and 80s show that things have actually become more relaxed over time, not stricter.

 

[tigerrev]

Freedom of speech doesn’t mean you’re free from the responsibility and consequences of offending or hurting someone.

Also, those examples from the 60s, 70s, and 80s show that things have actually become more relaxed over time, not stricter.

If people are constantly watching what they say in case they offend someone, then not a great deal will get said, as people can take "offence" at almost anything you or I say

 

[tigerrev]

Myth: American classics like Of Mice and Men and To Kill a Mockingbird have been banned from English literature GCSE.

It is nonsense to say any authors, books or genres have been banned. Exam boards have the freedom to include a range of set texts in their specifications, and teachers are as free to introduce children to the brilliant writing of Lee and Steinbeck , and other US writers, as ever.

What we have given exam boards the opportunity to do is broaden - not narrow - the range of books young people study for GCSE.

Our subject content for new English literature GCSE sets out simply the minimum pupils will need to study - a Shakespeare play in full, poetry from 1789 including the romantics, a 19th-century novel, and fiction or drama from the British Isles post-1914. Beyond this, exam boards have the freedom to design specifications so that they are stretching and interesting, and include any number of other texts from which teachers can then choose.

This means pupils will study a broader and demanding range of literature than ever before. We want to expose children to works that will engage and challenge them and give them a rigorous basis in the study of literature.

That article is certainly not being acted upon in the schools where my wife works. They have been told to find alternatives to the books in question.

 

[originallambrettaman]

That article is certainly not being acted upon in the schools where my wife works. They have been told to find alternatives to the books in question.

It's not an article, it's a statement from the Department of Education.

 

[originallambrettaman]

You could also argue that certain musical artists have become victims of cancel culture - or at least censorship - in recent years. So for example, you will not hear the original versions of the following songs on the radio anymore, because the lyrics might offend someone:

Fairytale of New York - Pogues/ Kirsty

Oliver's army - Elvis Costello

Peaches - The Stranglers

There are probably loads of others but those three just sprang to mind. That said, censorship is nothing new to the BBC. In the 60's they would only show Elvis Presley from the waist up, and the Stones hit "Let's spend the night together" could only be played with the lyrics changed to "Let's spend some time together."
In the 70's they banned the Sex Pistols "God save the Queen" and in the 80's Frankie Goes to Hollywood, "Relax."

All goes back to freedom of speech / expression and who decides what we can say or hear

Peaches was banned by the BBC 48 years ago, so can hardly be blamed on modern cancel culture. Elvis Costello has said he'll never perform Oliver's Army again and requested that it gets no radio play, so he's cancelled himself and Fairytale of New York is on the radio about once an hour over Christmas.

 

[Asterix]

Like you say, no proper support for the child. That kind of struggle with identity is a cry for help, and no-one seems to know what to do with it.
When I supported the Therian girl I never spoke about it off my own back, and she rarely did. I just offered acceptance. I encouraged the parents to remain calm and put some boundaries in around it. I just connected and listened. She needed to feel heard and made great progress. As her self-esteem grew, her need to put emphasis on labelling her own identity lessened. She was still curious about trying out identities, but it feels like it was more in keeping with the Autism diagnosis I helped her to get.

What a load of me me me ****e.
But that is what this thread is all about isn't it?

And I still have 3 or more pages to trawl through. Though, I must admit I am sort of multi tasking. Reading this, and remembering some of my favourite Chubby Brown jokes.

 

[eimaj]

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/local-news/yorkshire-parents-defend-woke-headteacher-19902187

 

[tigerrev]

Peaches was banned by the BBC 48 years ago, so can hardly be blamed on modern cancel culture. Elvis Costello has said he'll never perform Oliver's Army again and requested that it gets no radio play, so he's cancelled himself and Fairytale of New York is on the radio about once an hour over Christmas.

The latter with the words changed.

Someone had a song a few years back Celo Green? (probably spelt the name wrong and might have the wrong person). Original is F*ck you - radio plays it as "Forget you"
Beautiful South, "Don't Marry her, F*ck me" is the original and is changed to "Have me" on the radio.

 

[gftiger]

If people are constantly watching what they say in case they offend someone, then not a great deal will get said, as people can take "offence" at almost anything you or I say

Personally, I feel that if the words someone chooses to use regularly offend many people, then they should think about whether they they’re using the wrong words.

No one is perfect: we all say the wrong things, we’re shaped by the social norms of our youth, and times change.

However, if someone chooses to continue to use the same hurtful words with intent and awareness of the harm they cause then they should expect that to affect the way that people see them.

 

[tigerrev]

https://www.examinerlive.co.uk/news/local-news/yorkshire-parents-defend-woke-headteacher-19902187

That headteacher could be both a great headteacher, but wrong in this instance

 

[Off The Line]

What a load of me me me ****e.
But that is what this thread is all about isn't it?

And I still have 3 or more pages to trawl through. Though, I must admit I am sort of multi tasking. Reading this, and remembering some of my favourite Chubby Brown jokes.

TBF that's the first time I've talked about my work in that context, and maybe it was misjudged. I was just responding to a later comment essentially asking what I had done.

You can take this thread however you like. That's kind of why I like it, because it has the potential to throw up all sorts of views, and give insight into people's ways of thinking, which I'm always interested in.

 

[jhe10]

If people are constantly watching what they say in case they offend someone, then not a great deal will get said, as people can take "offence" at almost anything you or I say

That's just another way of saying 'you can't say anything nowadays!'. People who say that don't actually explain what's stopping them saying anything. Beyond a very limited legal framework around incitement to racial hatred or violence, there isn't anything stopping you saying anything, apart from the possible reaction of other people. If you want it to be a free country with free speech, then it should include the right for people to be offended, and the right for you to take no notice. It does seem like what people want is the right not to be criticised for being a dick.

 

[tigerrev]

That's just another way of saying 'you can't say anything nowadays!'. People who say that don't actually explain what's stopping them saying anything. Beyond a very limited legal framework around incitement to racial hatred or violence, there isn't anything stopping you saying anything, apart from the possible reaction of other people. If you want it to be a free country with free speech, then it should include the right for people to be offended, and the right for you to take no notice. It does seem like what people want is the right not to be criticised for being a dick.

Okay, I won't criticize you

 

[eimaj]

That headteacher could be both a great headteacher, but wrong in this instance

To be fair, I think he's a pretty decent guy in general. Not sure I agree with him on this, but I can certainly see the idea behind modernising figures being championed to be people relevant to kids today.

I'm sure the decision to pick Rashford aged well.

 

[tigerrev]

That's just another way of saying 'you can't say anything nowadays!'. People who say that don't actually explain what's stopping them saying anything. Beyond a very limited legal framework around incitement to racial hatred or violence, there isn't anything stopping you saying anything, apart from the possible reaction of other people. If you want it to be a free country with free speech, then it should include the right for people to be offended, and the right for you to take no notice. It does seem like what people want is the right not to be criticised for being a dick.

Seriously. though, yes people might be offended by things you or I say. But it isn't a crime to offend someone. Politicians on the opposite side of the house probably offend each other with their views on a regular basis - but that should never stifle open debate and free speech

 

[Asterix]

The thing that most people don’t consider about “cancel culture” is that it’s fundamentally a free-market, capitalist response.

For example, no one was saying Roy Chubby Brown couldn’t perform. In fact, the opposite is true because promoters and theatres booked him and gave him a platform. However, people didn’t buy tickets because there’s no demand, so they pulled the shows. Theatres don’t book performers that don’t fill seats. It’s not a moral decision, it’s a business one.

Another example is Kevin Spacey. No one is stopping him from being in films, he just doesn’t have enough star power for movie studios that want a name that sells tickets. Demand for films starring Kevin Spacey is too low. Again, not a moral decision, but a business one.

Then you have JK Rowling who, despite her transphobic views, still has an agent and publisher because Harry Potter is currently in demand and is extremely profitable. If “cancel culture” was a moral response and the “woke mob” had any tangible power she’d have been dropped years ago.

People complain about “woke lefties” on social media ruining careers, but really it’s management and executives making financial decisions in the name of profit.

To answer the original question of the thread, “woke” has become a term used by right wingers to disparage anything or anyone that has the decency to be compassionate to others.

Chubby Brown has nigh on 60 upcoming gigs this year. Far from being miffed about one council shutting him down, I would suggest it gives him more gags to throw out. And possibly bums on seats to hear them.

JK Rowling, yes it is dificult to cancel someone with billions. Or even the young starlets who made tens of millions from the film roles. No idea why they ran scared.

But, yes, times have moved on. 40 years ago, a guy in a frock entered the same changing room/toilet as my daughter, carnage would have ensued. Now?? I would be prosecuted for even politely reminding him those facilities are for women.

 

[tigerrev]

It's not an article, it's a statement from the Department of Education.

Fair enough - but it is not being interpreted in that way on the ground. And because educational establishments are not interpreting the DoE statement correctly, then teachers and others are at least getting the impression that the books in question have been cancelled

 

[balkan tiger]

Seriously. though, yes people might be offended by things you or I say. But it isn't a crime to offend someone. Politicians on the opposite side of the house probably offend each other with their views on a regular basis - but that should never stifle open debate and free speech

Not sure if this is genuine
In the house of commons an MP making a speech was constantly being interrupted by an opposition MP. After a while he had had enough and said to his oppo " you have the manners of a pig" The speaker of the house intervened and said you have to retract that comment. Hmmm he thought, then said " I am very sorry my right honourable friend does not have the manners of a pig"

 

[Ernie Shackleton]

The latter with the words changed.

Someone had a song a few years back Celo Green? (probably spelt the name wrong and might have the wrong person). Original is F*ck you - radio plays it as "Forget you"
Beautiful South, "Don't Marry her, F*ck me" is the original and is changed to "Have me" on the radio.

The Beautiful South recorded a Radio Edit vocal of Don’t Marry Her at the time of original recording as they knew it wouldn’t get airplay with the album lyrics. Nobodies changed the lyrics or cancelled the group latterly.

 

[originallambrettaman]

The latter with the words changed.

Someone had a song a few years back Celo Green? (probably spelt the name wrong and might have the wrong person). Original is F*ck you - radio plays it as "Forget you"
Beautiful South, "Don't Marry her, F*ck me" is the original and is changed to "Have me" on the radio.

You expect radio stations to play songs with '****' in the lyrics? They never did, they never will, it has absolutely nothing to do with 'cancel culture'.