General Election 2019

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General Election 2019

  • Labour

    Votes: 12 36.4%

  • Tory

    Votes: 9 27.3%

  • Lib. Dem

    Votes: 6 18.2%

  • Green Party

    Votes: 1 3.0%

  • Brexit Party

    Votes: 2 6.1%

  • SNP

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Plaid Cymru

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • None of the above

    Votes: 2 6.1%

  • My legs because they support me

    Votes: 1 3.0%
  • Total voters
    33
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Watching a compelling election launch by the Farage today. Honestly in a face to face with Boris he would kick him into touch ... or perhaps a ditch.

The man is a great speaker who talks the facts and with certainty and conviction. He is honest too.

He trashed Boris's Brexit deal in a way in which no one had been able to do so with the media presence needed.

Offering Boris a joint strategy which of course the Tory spokesmen are already condemning...

Making for a very interesting few weeks.
 
yorkshirehornet said:
Watching a compelling election launch by the Farage today. Honestly in a face to face with Boris he would kick him into touch ... or perhaps a ditch.

The man is a great speaker who talks the facts and with certainty and conviction. He is honest too.

He trashed Boris's Brexit deal in a way in which no one had been able to do so with the media presence needed.

Offering Boris a joint strategy which of course the Tory spokesmen are already condemning...

Making for a very interesting few weeks.
Click to expand...

Farage has been the outstanding politician of the last decade but he should now be consigned to the Lords to wake up the oldies.
The worst thing he could now do is to take votes away from Conservative candidates although I expect most Conservatives will take a pragmatic view and vote Tory.
 
yorkshirehornet said:
My position is that I will take my democratic right and vote tactically for the party that will keep the Tories out in my constituency.

The local Green Party has balloted its members on this today.

So as as clear remainer I will likely vote LibDem or Labour....
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Sad but necessary Yorkie. Unfortunately the Green Party may struggle this time but will hold onto Caroline Lucas's seat. Sad because we will probably never know how many potential Greens there are in the UK - every election there is some pressing reason to vote tactically.
 
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superhorns said:
The alternative system as put forward by the LibDems was theirs alone. The Tories only agreed at the time to hold the ballot in exchange for an agreement to change the constituency boundaries and reduce the number of MPs. The LibDems reneged on the deal once their plan to change the political system was roundly rejected by the electorate.

I am perfectly happy with the present system, I suspect most voters in England would agree.
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I can well understand why you oppose PR so stringently SH. A political system organized on that basis would consign the Tories to permanent opposition. As it is the majority of the country votes for left of centre parties but we end up with right wing governments. As long as you are honest enough to admit that this is an undemocratic system but one which you like, and can live with that then ok. Many well known dictators would agree with you.
 
The more that Farage tells people that the Tories are not getting a proper Brexit, the more votes he could take. Look at the EU elections and the Tory vote was decimated. Of course this is a very different election, and one would have to ask what policies Farage has on other things. A one issue party seldom does well.
 
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oldfrenchhorn said:
The more that Farage tells people that the Tories are not getting a proper Brexit, the more votes he could take. Look at the EU elections and the Tory vote was decimated. Of course this is a very different election, and one would have to ask what policies Farage has on other things. A one issue party seldom does well.
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Sorry Frenchie, the Tories are a one issue party as well - they would love nothing better than to keep Brexit as the central issue of this campaign. However their manifesto needs more than just the repetition of 'Let's get it done'. The Tories are just hoping that the fact that people are tired of Brexit and just want it over will be enough to give them a majority for 5 years - if that isn't one issue party politics I don't know what is.
 
colognehornet said:
Sorry Frenchie, the Tories are a one issue party as well - they would love nothing better than to keep Brexit as the central issue of this campaign. However their manifesto needs more than just the repetition of 'Let's get it done'. The Tories are just hoping that the fact that people are tired of Brexit and just want it over will be enough to give them a majority for 5 years - if that isn't one issue party politics I don't know what is.
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I agree in many ways, but because they are currently in government people will see them as at least having some experience unlike Farage. We know full well that the get it done mantra is going down well, but of course it is nothing of the sort. This 3 years has only been about how we leave, and part two could go on for many more years than that.
 
superhorns said:
Farage has been the outstanding politician of the last decade but he should now be consigned to the Lords to wake up the oldies.
The worst thing he could now do is to take votes away from Conservative candidates although I expect most Conservatives will take a pragmatic view and vote Tory.
Click to expand...

But face it, he campaigned for a full on hard Brexit... .which many Tories , including you, say you want.

So for those who wanted that and not the fudge that is going to be exposed about the Boris option, they will be a choice... ad he has alos admitted he will campaign in Labour remain areas primarily..

Makes for a compelling month head
 
colognehornet said:
Sorry Frenchie, the Tories are a one issue party as well - they would love nothing better than to keep Brexit as the central issue of this campaign. However their manifesto needs more than just the repetition of 'Let's get it done'. The Tories are just hoping that the fact that people are tired of Brexit and just want it over will be enough to give them a majority for 5 years - if that isn't one issue party politics I don't know what is.
Click to expand...

Apart from honouring the referendum the Tories have majored on the NHS, Schools and Police. This is a potent message to the electorate, very clever. The opposition is so weak I'm sure this will be enough to secure victory. Labour is tearing itself apart, not looking a very good option for remainers or leavers.
 
yorkshirehornet said:
My position is that I will take my democratic right and vote tactically for the party that will keep the Tories out in my constituency.

The local Green Party has balloted its members on this today.

So as as clear remainer I will likely vote LibDem or Labour....
Click to expand...
And that is my position... though there will be fewer than 30 tories in the HoC if my constituency changes colour. Bit of a pipe dream, TBH, unless the LD's step aside.
 
yorkshirehornet said:
But face it, he campaigned for a full on hard Brexit... .which many Tories , including you, say you want.

So for those who wanted that and not the fudge that is going to be exposed about the Boris option, they will be a choice... ad he has alos admitted he will campaign in Labour remain areas primarily..

Makes for a compelling month head
Click to expand...

The Brexit Party could help the Conservatives by taking votes from Labour in many Northern constituencies. I'm sure Farage will not let the Marxists in by the back door by default.
 
superhorns said:
I doubt Corbyn and Mcdonnell would deny they are Marxists. There are also many amongst the Momentum infiltrators.
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Actually McDonnell, in answer to the question ''Are you a Marxist'' replied ''I believe there's a lot to learn from reading 'Kapital', yes of course there is, and that's been recommended not just by me but by many others, mainstream economists as well''. Corbyn, by his own admission never got past page one. I also have read Marx, and consider we have a lot to learn from it - but I am not a Marxist. I have read the Koran but I am not a Muslim, and I am a feminist without being a woman ! The renationalization of a few industries does not make you a red blooded Marxist - it's only a return to the Keynesian mixed economy ideology which most countries had in the 60s. Keep on hurling the cliches and the one liners and some unthinking sods will listen. The Labour Party is a broad church - it also has a Christian Socialist Society within it - but would you describe the whole party as Christian ? This is, I believe, what Frenchie meant by sloganizing, and it has no place in a debating thread.
 
colognehornet said:
Actually McDonnell, in answer to the question ''Are you a Marxist'' replied ''I believe there's a lot to learn from reading 'Kapital', yes of course there is, and that's been recommended not just by me but by many others, mainstream economists as well''. Corbyn, by his own admission never got past page one. I also have read Marx, and consider we have a lot to learn from it - but I am not a Marxist. I have read the Koran but I am not a Muslim, and I am a feminist without being a woman ! The renationalization of a few industries does not make you a red blooded Marxist - it's only a return to the Keynesian mixed economy ideology which most countries had in the 60s. Keep on hurling the cliches and the one liners and some unthinking sods will listen. The Labour Party is a broad church - it also has a Christian Socialist Society within it - but would you describe the whole party as Christian ? This is, I believe, what Frenchie meant by sloganizing, and it has no place in a debating thread.
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Corbyn, Mcdonnell and many of the controlling Momentum bods have been described many times as Marxists or Trots by their own colleagues in the Labour Party. I'm sure they are better able to judge than outsiders. Mcdonnell himself declared in 2003: " Look, I'm straight, I'm honest with people: I'm a Marxist"
I'm not sure Corbyn has the intelligence to understand anything challenging but is just a figurehead for the hardliners from Momentum.
 
superhorns said:
Corbyn, Mcdonnell and many of the controlling Momentum bods have been described many times as Marxists or Trots by their own colleagues in the Labour Party. I'm sure they are better able to judge than outsiders. Mcdonnell himself declared in 2003: " Look, I'm straight, I'm honest with people: I'm a Marxist"
I'm not sure Corbyn has the intelligence to understand anything challenging but is just a figurehead for the hardliners from Momentum.
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Taken from the BBC


Mr Corbyn was never a member of Militant, although he fought against their expulsion in the 1980s.
And Momentum - the grassroots organisation set up to support Mr Corbyn - is clearly a very different beast, operating as it does in an open fashion.
Mr Watson has said he does not believe that the "vast majority" of Labour members that have joined the party are "all Trots and Bolsheviks".
But like many Labour MPs, he sees signs of entryist tactics at work, even though it is sometimes very difficult to get a handle on the allegiances and motivations of the British hard left.
"The followers of Leon Trotsky, like those of Jesus Christ, may all believe in the teachings of the same man, but they have rarely been united," writes journalist Michael Crick in his 1984 book on the rise and fall of Militant.
The book was republished earlier this year with a quote from Mr Watson on the front cover describing it as a "must-read for Labour activists".
He has now written to Mr Corbyn asking him to take action against members of The Socialist Party, and another group, the Alliance for Workers Liberty, which he claims are using the Labour Party "as a vehicle to achieve their revolutionary aims".
He even claims some Momentum members are using Mr Crick's book as a manual on how to take control of local Labour parties. The row is clearly not going to go away.
 
superhorns said:
Corbyn, Mcdonnell and many of the controlling Momentum bods have been described many times as Marxists or Trots by their own colleagues in the Labour Party. I'm sure they are better able to judge than outsiders. Mcdonnell himself declared in 2003: " Look, I'm straight, I'm honest with people: I'm a Marxist"
I'm not sure Corbyn has the intelligence to understand anything challenging but is just a figurehead for the hardliners from Momentum.
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I can see there is going to be a lot more of this over the next coming weeks - in the absence of real arguments or real policies then concentrate on handy slogans to describe everyone who is against you. When challenged in the past by myself you have failed to demonstrate any knowledge of either Marx or Trotsky - yet apparently you feel qualified to hurl labels of this sort. Apparently someone is a Marxist, because they have read Marx and incorporated some of his ideas - I have read him and could be a Marxist - together with a lot of other -ists, because I have taken ideas from many sources. Judge them by their actions, not by what some of their enemies have said about them - read Marx, and then decide for yourself if there is any connection. Otherwise try to debate without this sort of mud slinging.
 
superhorns said:
Taken from the BBC


Mr Corbyn was never a member of Militant, although he fought against their expulsion in the 1980s.
And Momentum - the grassroots organisation set up to support Mr Corbyn - is clearly a very different beast, operating as it does in an open fashion.
Mr Watson has said he does not believe that the "vast majority" of Labour members that have joined the party are "all Trots and Bolsheviks".
But like many Labour MPs, he sees signs of entryist tactics at work, even though it is sometimes very difficult to get a handle on the allegiances and motivations of the British hard left.
"The followers of Leon Trotsky, like those of Jesus Christ, may all believe in the teachings of the same man, but they have rarely been united," writes journalist Michael Crick in his 1984 book on the rise and fall of Militant.
The book was republished earlier this year with a quote from Mr Watson on the front cover describing it as a "must-read for Labour activists".
He has now written to Mr Corbyn asking him to take action against members of The Socialist Party, and another group, the Alliance for Workers Liberty, which he claims are using the Labour Party "as a vehicle to achieve their revolutionary aims".
He even claims some Momentum members are using Mr Crick's book as a manual on how to take control of local Labour parties. The row is clearly not going to go away.
Click to expand...
How many people are claimed to be members of Momentum, and how many are in the Labour Party ? You will find there is a ratio of about one to twenty. Try concentrating more on your own house - what numbers of new Tories are there over the last year or so and why have they joined the party - entryism is much more of a problem for them because of the far lower membership numbers.
 
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