Off Topic So, what now?

[BCFCRob]

Again, it's a fair point but even if you don't know what their policies are, the parties do at least tell you what they plan to do with their policies. In this instance … The Conservatives and Labour both stated they would implement Britain leaving the EU if this was the result of the referendum.

This is true but that wasn't the point either of us were making. That's not the point he was making. He compared the referendum to a GE and I merely pointed out the distinction. In a GE you have a rough idea of what you're voting for, but in the referendum nobody really knew what leave looked like. And please don't tell me that everybody voted for a hard Brexit because it's simply not true.

 

[AshtonRed]

This is true but irrelevant. That's not the point he was making. He compared the referendum to a GE and I merely pointed out the distinction. In a GE you have a rough idea of what you're voting for, but in the referendum nobody really knew what leave looked like. And please don't tell me that everybody voted for a hard Brexit because it's simply not true.

As you rightly pointed out Rob, no one knew what leave looked like , the vote wasn’t about specifics it was about a principle, people aren’t stupid they realised that.

 

[BCFCRob]

As you rightly pointed out Rob, no one knew what leave looked like , the vote wasn’t about specifics it was about a principle, people aren’t stupid they realised that.

That's absolutely fair enough mate. But if they realised that then they must surely realise that a No Deal Brexit is physically impossible until the Irish border issue is solved. And not a single person has found a solution for that yet on either side.

 

[bcfcredandwhite]

Corbyn’s refusal to play a part in shaping the ‘Plan B’ is interesting and rather petulant in my opinion.
Of course May isn’t going to rule out a ‘No Deal’ - neither would anyone trying to negotiate.
At least the other parties are talking to her - even wee Jimmy’s, so if it comes to the crunch he will be outvoted.

 

[AshtonRed]

That's absolutely fair enough mate. But if they realised that then they must surely realise that a No Deal Brexit is physically impossible until the Irish border issue is solved. And not a single person has found a solution for that yet on either side.

I realise the Irish border has to be resolved , but if there is no deal then what? . The problem doesn’t go away, it will still have to solved.

A large part of Ireland’s exports are to the UK , not the EU . So deal or no deal the Irish border issue has to be resolved.

 

[ClevedonRobin]

There are a couple countries who would wish to leave,, it would have been easy for them as the EU would not have to pay half their budget to support them! it would then have been a precedent we had to follow not a furrow to be ploughed . The EU is losing a positive contributor in the UK, WE GET BACK LESS BY A LARGE DEGREE OF WHAT WE PUT IN
This means that the outgoings to prop up the likes of Italy, Greece, Spain etc will be shared by the likes of the top remaining top 10 countries … and bearing in mind that they also get less back than going in their gov's are going to need to raise more/ pay more!
Should we just pay out to those that get the funding from EU now from our coffers, we / the gov: would be in profit! and able to fund something/someone else like NHS OR...…….

JUST completed 3 hours on the box! PMQ's + 2 hours .
Listened to the parrot disrespectful Corbollocks [ after lying about what he said under his breath re TM, HE WAS THE ONLY LEADER OF ANY PARTY OR GROUP THAT DID NOT CONCUR WITH THE CONDOLENCES FOR THE DEAD BRIT AND OTHER VICTIMS IN NAIROBI, instead went straight in on his aim to get a GE at any cost ]…. and O M G WHAT a terrible threat we are under should he EVER get in power, I don't know how many GE's I have survived but 2 stand out and both Labour.
A victim of MAGGIES reign, although I had no problems with it, I WAS ONE OF 3.25m UNEMPLOYED OUT OF A 50M POPULATION and at the time agreed with it as it got us out of the s**** dumped on us by a labour Gov. I voted labour some GE's later, sucked in buy the smooth talking stutter of BLIAR, as I thought it was a time for change, and he promised more than was on offer ….. = D I S A S T E R, …….. £ trillions, a lot of trillions, of oil revenue evaporated, gold, where is it? and a note [ mentioned today by the one that left it to the incoming chancellor ..sorry no money left!], he dumped on Brown, who then left us in the deep deep deep ****e of £trillions of debt …..
Has he respect for people of the uk? no and wont list the 20 or more things he has distastefully been linked with , let alone the fibs he spins to seem like he is a friend of all ………..
todays debate .. well we will just need to wait and see …………. a GE, one part of me says NO, a smaller part says yes ..but hope there is a confirmed majority for Conservatives. The risk they all [MPs] take IS THEY GET THEIR SEAT a few first time labour MPs did so with rather tight against the odds votes …. SNP make me ashamed to be part 50% Scots, the only interest in Brexit is it is ann argument to get independence ….. hang on, they voted to stay part of the UK …….
What happens next FN

John, The question was what do you think will happen not can you give us an essay on your personal opinion of politics. Have another go mate and this time - what do you think will happen?

 

[AshtonRed]

That's absolutely fair enough mate. But if they realised that then they must surely realise that a No Deal Brexit is physically impossible until the Irish border issue is solved. And not a single person has found a solution for that yet on either side.

I misread your post Rob , of course a no deal brexit is possible without the border issue being resolved. At present if nothing else is agreed in the meantime we exit the EU at the end of March .

I realise this is unlikely as many MP’s are dead set against it , but in theory it’s possible, in fact legally at present it’s the default position if no deal is struck in the meantime , that was my point .

 

[AshtonRed]

John, The question was what do you think will happen not can you give us an essay on your personal opinion of politics. Have another go mate and this time - what do you think will happen?

Good luck with that one, I’ve already asked him several times .

 

[Cliftonville]

This is true but that wasn't the point either of us were making. That's not the point he was making. He compared the referendum to a GE and I merely pointed out the distinction. In a GE you have a rough idea of what you're voting for, but in the referendum nobody really knew what leave looked like. And please don't tell me that everybody voted for a hard Brexit because it's simply not true.

The general election had in its manifestos of is two leading parties a vow to uphold the result of the referendum and its binary choice … It was leave.

 

[wizered]

This is true but that wasn't the point either of us were making. That's not the point he was making. He compared the referendum to a GE and I merely pointed out the distinction. In a GE you have a rough idea of what you're voting for, but in the referendum nobody really knew what leave looked like. And please don't tell me that everybody voted for a hard Brexit because it's simply not true.

I've got to say this leaflet was delivered to every household in the UK from Cameron explaining the facts, we read it, understood it, paid for it and voted out.
https://assets.publishing.service.g...ean-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk.pdf

 

[ClevedonRobin]

No one knows what will happen next and that's what's spooking the financial and business markets and driving prophesies of medical and food supply issues along with transport and travel chaos. Apparently we might also see a return to the days of sectarianism in Ireland. Will any of these actually come to pass? I don't know. What do I think will happen next? I don't know either, but it seems that this whole topic has become an incendiary hot potato. Can you please 52% of the voters and ignore 48% without electoral and social ramifications? Almost definitely not. Given the certainty that there is going to be a severe backlash (what ever the outcome) I think that politicians will prefer to place the final decision back in the hands of the public and thus provide themselves with a new get out of jail card that offers someone else to blame for any disillusionment.

 

[RedorDead]

Think the world of you John, but you talk nonsense at times

At times?
Once he starts changing font colour or size I switch off

 

[AshtonRed]

At times?
Once he starts changing font colour or size I switch off

Most of his posts then Rod

 

[johngalleyfan2]

Once he starts changing font colour or size I switch off

R e a l L y

there are a few that don't know the simple basics of politics …. and the future reprocussions / repercussions that can unfurl as a result of their not being able to understand, and thus making a decision upon what they think they take it to be and not what it is … QT tonight had some classic examples … one was based on [ and it has been mentioned on here] what was the question?

 

[AshtonRed]

R e a l L y

there are a few that don't know the simple basics of politics …. and the future reprocussions / repercussions that can unfurl as a result of their not being able to understand, and thus making a decision upon what they think they take it to be and not what it is … QT tonight had some classic examples … one was based on [ and it has been mentioned on here] what was the question?

Thanks for that John I now fully understand your views on what will happen next........................not

 

[RedorDead]

R e a l L y

there are a few that don't know the simple basics of politics …. and the future reprocussions / repercussions that can unfurl as a result of their not being able to understand, and thus making a decision upon what they think they take it to be and not what it is … QT tonight had some classic examples … one was based on [ and it has been mentioned on here] what was the question?

Thanks for that John I now fully understand your views on what will happen next........................not

So what you were basically saying, when asked what happens next is “You was going to watch QT”

 

[BCFCRob]

I misread your post Rob , of course a no deal brexit is possible without the border issue being resolved. At present if nothing else is agreed in the meantime we exit the EU at the end of March .

I realise this is unlikely as many MP’s are dead set against it , but in theory it’s possible, in fact legally at present it’s the default position if no deal is struck in the meantime , that was my point .

Just because it's legally what we're supposed to do, that doesn't make it possible. We all know a hard border in Ireland is not going to work.

So how do we do a no deal Brexit, keeping the Irish border open, while stopping European people freely entering our country and while ensuring tariffs are correctly applied?

It's impossible.

The general election had in its manifestos of is two leading parties a vow to uphold the result of the referendum and its binary choice … It was leave.

I've got to say this leaflet was delivered to every household in the UK from Cameron explaining the facts, we read it, understood it, paid for it and voted out.
https://assets.publishing.service.g...ean-union-is-the-best-decision-for-the-uk.pdf

Guys, this isn't my agenda or anything. You're either accidentally or intentionally missing my point.

All I'm saying is that in a GE the parties make it clear what they are planning to do. In the referendum, leave did not do this, because it was not possible. Some were saying a hard Brexit, some were saying we would stay in the EU customs union, no one really knew. I was on the leave side and I didn't know. I'm not saying it's wrong to vote leave, I'm genuinely not saying this from my own Brexit opinion. But oneforthebristolcity said that it was the same decision as in a General Election and I'm just pointing out how it is quite a bit different.

Cliftonville you mention the manifestos but we're not talking about any particular General Election whatsoever. It's irrelevant to our discussion.

My own views are not part of that comment.

 

[AshtonRed]

Just because it's legally what we're supposed to do, that doesn't make it possible. We all know a hard border in Ireland is not going to work.

So how do we do a no deal Brexit, keeping the Irish border open, while stopping European people freely entering our country and while ensuring tariffs are correctly applied?

It's impossible.





Guys, this isn't my agenda or anything. You're either accidentally or intentionally missing my point.

All I'm saying is that in a GE the parties make it clear what they are planning to do. In the referendum, leave did not do this, because it was not possible. Some were saying a hard Brexit, some were saying we would stay in the EU customs union, no one really knew. I was on the leave side and I didn't know. I'm not saying it's wrong to vote leave, I'm genuinely not saying this from my own Brexit opinion. But oneforthebristolcity said that it was the same decision as in a General Election and I'm just pointing out how it is quite a bit different.

Cliftonville you mention the manifestos but we're not talking about any particular General Election whatsoever. It's irrelevant to our discussion.

My own views are not part of that comment.

There are lots of things that would need sorting out if a no deal Brexit happened the Irish border being one, however that won’t stop it happening if nothing else is agreed , or if legislation to stop it isn’t put in place , because at present it’s set in Law.

 

[BCFCRob]

There are lots of things that would need sorting out if a no deal Brexit happened the Irish border being one, however that won’t stop it happening if nothing else is agreed , or if legislation to stop it isn’t put in place , because at present it’s set in Law.

Absolutely but I highly doubt the others are blockers, just inconveniences. The Irish border issue is a complete and utter blocker. And nobody has an answer for it I'm afraid.

 

[AshtonRed]

Absolutely but I highly doubt the others are blockers, just inconveniences. The Irish border issue is a complete and utter blocker. And nobody has an answer for it I'm afraid.

There is an easy answer Rob, a hard border, that’s the dilemma, no one wants it,

There are others equally important, but its irrelevant , it will happen if nothing is agreed , or legislation is put in place to stop it .

That was my point , if we leave without a deal we will need to sort something out or there will be a hard border , Eire knows that too. Therefore why not sort it out before and therefore prevent a no deal Brexit.

The EU at the moment are gambling that we will at all costs want to avoid no deal to force us to accept their version of brexit , which includes no hard border, there is no need for the backstop because neither side want a hard border.

I believe the present deal will get through , and I watched all the speeches in parliament before the vote, if the backstop to be removed. Speaker after speaker made this point.

The problem with the Irish border has to be resolved either way , deal or no deal, so why not resolve with a deal because ultimately a deal is better both for the EU and the Uk