Neil Warnock

[Oldsparkey]

@Sparky, who is the best person to keep us up? I would suggest it is NW for a number of reasons.

I do believe NW can keep us up, if the players keep the faith. We have consistently over-achieved under NW, why shouldn’t that continue?
There is a gulf in class to the top teams, but we should be able to compete with those around us in the mini-league.
We have had an awful start to our season and the only way is up, unless we run out of games...

@taffthefish................. Quite.

Listen Taff, I'm not for sacking Warnock now for one minute. I'm just raising the issue if and when it becomes apparent that we are not "able to compete with those around us in the mini league" as you put it.

It may be OK for some, but I don't go to the CCS to marvel at how good the opposition sides are and watch my team lose. FFS, there has to be some fcking pride in the club to address the poor results being obtained this past 2 months.

I'm not saying Warnock isn't the right guy, just that if it becomes increasingly apparent that we are going nowhere but down, then someone in authority has a decision to make.

Whether that decision turns out to be the right one only time will tell, but at least we'd have made that decision instead of accepting the inevitable.

 

[taffthefish]

@Sparkey. My apologies, I don't mean to imply you want NW sacked. It's more to highlight a possible scenario that we're better off maintaining the status quo. Even if we are cut adrift is that a good enough reason to seek a new team manager? Given all the reasons I have already mentioned, I suspect not.

 

[Oldsparkey]

@Sparkey. My apologies, I don't mean to imply you want NW sacked. It's more to highlight a possible scenario that we're better off maintaining the status quo. Even if we are cut adrift is that a good enough reason to seek a new team manager? Given all the reasons I have already mentioned, I suspect not.

It's a quandry Taff, that's for sure.

If we are still bottom or thereabouts but not necessarily "cut adrift" by the time January comes around, there'll be some very important decisons to make at that time,

Stick or twist? Tan/Dalman/Choo have to consider all options, not just hope for the best.

 

[DaiJones]

Just hope we don't do a Swansea and sack our manager every year

 

[Oldsparkey]

A great debate on this thread during this barren football fortnight and so interesting to hear other's opinions on the club.

OK - maybe a simple question for you but probably a much more difficult answer..........

Why are we bottom of the table?

 

[remote]

Why are we bottom of the table?

We're not good enough at either end of the pitch.
The usual bits of bad luck / rub of the green.

If Colin can get comfortable with a formation and a starting line up I feel we will win a few games. Big if though.

 

[Oldsparkey]

We're not good enough at either end of the pitch.
The usual bits of bad luck / rub of the green.

If Colin can get comfortable with a formation and a starting line up I feel we will win a few games. Big if though.

I'd agree with that remote, but why are we not good enough at either end of the pitch is the real question. Were we too complacent in the summer relying on basically what we had at either end of the pitch and it's costing us?

Interestingly, the area we all complained about last season was the middle of the park - the acquisition of Arter and Camarasa seems to have sorted that to a degree and now we're fcked at the front and back.

The "bad luck/rub of the green" argument is a bit of an old chestnut though. Justifying failing to take maximum points off 10 man Newcastle and Huddersfield, and then getting nothing out of our home game with Burnley wasn't down to that - we should have 9 points on the board right now not 2.

 

[Statto]

I hope the fact we have had a really tough opening fixture list is part of the reason. Playing 5 of last years top 7 in our first 8 games must have been one of the toughest starts any team had (I haven't checked!). We all seem to agree that we could/should have had something more from 2 of the other 3 games so maybe we aren't quite as bad as it looks?

I agree we need to get a settled side. We seem to have changed the line up every game so far.

 

[ninian opinion]

OS
Where do you start?

For me the root of the problem is simple. The lack of thought pre season to create a squad capable TO A MAN to compete at this level.

There has been too much loyalty to players who got us promoted. Don’t forget it was an amazing achievement and in reality a squad that overachieved but the management should have realised those players were simply unlikely to succeed and cope at this much higher level.

To give them this opportunity was all good and well but it needed to be looked at with a more hard nosed attitude and realistically.

The squad needed serious improvement and PL experience all over the pitch. NW bought in 2 decent loan players to enhance midfield but that wasn’t enough. He bought in a potential star in Murphy but Reid has been disappointing. Cunningham is a decent 2nd tier player.

The failure especially to have 2-3 decent strikers is hurting City. The ones they have got hardly set the Championship alight.

The defence is clearly not good enough.

And off the pitch? The 2 coaches with NW (like him) are tried and tested at Championship level but none have succeeded at PL level. That should have been addressed.

The fans IMO have been short changed and the club is the subject of national ridicule. It was so avoidable with not a difficult degree of hindsight.

Incidentally IMO City have been lucky to get 2 points. Those points were garnered against teams with ten men; it’s likely they’d have lost against eleven men over 90 minutes.

 

[taffthefish]

Last season we had one of the tightest defences in the league. So I guess the thinking was it would be good enough for the premier league, given the need to get some midfielders in. Perhaps the powers that be thought strengthening the midfield was enough to help any deficiencies that may be highlighted after a few games in the premier league.
An inability to take maximum points against 10 men suggests we do not have the players that can take a grip of a game or lack the tactical abilities needed to change mid-game. Perhaps both.

 

[Oldsparkey]

OS
Where do you start?

For me the root of the problem is simple. The lack of thought pre season to create a squad capable TO A MAN to compete at this level.

The fans IMO have been short changed and the club is the subject of national ridicule. It was so avoidable with not a difficult degree of hindsight.

This is what I find so embarrassing and avoidable. The summer player recruitment showed an absolute ignorance of what was required to compete at this level - It's as though we were sleep walking into the Prem.

Reliance on those that got us up to keep us up demonstrates a complete ignorance of life at the top, or worse, a lack of ruthlessness in the managment of the club to prepare for life on a different planet.

Could be Tan has got it wrong again. He was "done" by Malky who went on a spending spree with his money, and this time in his own belief that Warnock & Co could walk on water and do it with effectively loose change.

To say to the media 6 weeks after the start of the season that he hopes to bring in 2 or 3 players in January is as good as an admission that this season's preparation for the Prem has been a complete balls up.

 

[Hilts24]

I think its obvious the plan was to bring in players who would make us strong to go again. If we stay up its a bonus.

We are going down.

But we wont be in the mess we were last time.

Chill. We will be a strong Championship side next season.

 

[Oldsparkey]

I think its obvious the plan was to bring in players who would make us strong to go again. If we stay up its a bonus.

We are going down.

But we wont be in the mess we were last time.

Chill. We will be a strong Championship side next season.

Can't understand that at all. So the club having got up adopts a deliberate policy to go back down and be stronger next season in the Championship - are you serious?

The club (manager, players and fans) fought tooth and nail to get where we are and has completely botched our chances of staying here in the belief that Warnock and his cohorts can work miracles at this level on a shoestring.

The "going back down and we'll be stronger next season" drivel is an excuse for a total cock up in our dealings in the summer. Excessive budget restraints, bad management of what we did have, or a combination of both has shafted us.

We've attracted capacity crowds who have been conned into the ground only to be ridiculed by the media for our naive on-pitch performances and the "there's a great bunch of lads in the dressing room" post-match utterings from Warnock. The bloke is starting to piss me off. We deserve more than that.

 

[william5551]

Long live the championship,keep on getting promoted from the championship take the money and run get relegateted from the premier,in the mean time we get out of debt and with the money we get can slowly get players in that can live in the premiership,and also a change of management as I don't see the ones we have keeping us there.Going for a lie down now as thers no soccer on this weekend so ive told my wife to wake me up next weekend.

 

[Oldsparkey]

Long live the championship,keep on getting promoted from the championship take the money and run get relegateted from the premier,in the mean time we get out of debt and with the money we get can slowly get players in that can live in the premiership,and also a change of management as I don't see the ones we have keeping us there.Going for a lie down now as thers no soccer on this weekend so ive told my wife to wake me up next weekend.

Will - I much prefer the Championship myself to being subjected to this "Premier League whipping boy" tag we've picked up. Getting out of debt is a great target and an essential for future growth, but Tan has already capitalised the majority of his loans and has promised to do the same with the remainder.

With this year's Prem income, being debt free was within our grasp this season and staying here for another season would have cemented that. Going back down is just a bloody lottery.

Apart from the excitement and expectations of Championship football, this is the place build your club. Bournemouth. Burnley and Brighton are all doing that - why can't we?

 

[Hilts24]

Can't understand that at all. So the club having got up adopts a deliberate policy to go back down and be stronger next season in the Championship - are you serious?

The club (manager, players and fans) fought tooth and nail to get where we are and has completely botched our chances of staying here in the belief that Warnock and his cohorts can work miracles at this level on a shoestring.

The "going back down and we'll be stronger next season" drivel is an excuse for a total cock up in our dealings in the summer. Excessive budget restraints, bad management of what we did have, or a combination of both has shafted us.

We've attracted capacity crowds who have been conned into the ground only to be ridiculed by the media for our naive on-pitch performances and the "there's a great bunch of lads in the dressing room" post-match utterings from Warnock. The bloke is starting to piss me off. We deserve more than that.

No one has said theres a deliberate policy to go back down.

We could have spent massively and still got relegated. We decided not to throw big cash at survival. I back this policy.

No one is being conned. There is great backing from the fans. No/ very little unrest.

For years under poor management on and off the pitch we put the long term future of the club at risk with over spending.

Thats in the past.

Delighted with the way the club has acted myself this summer.

 

[Oldsparkey]

No one has said theres a deliberate policy to go back down.

We could have spent massively and still got relegated. We decided not to throw big cash at survival. I back this policy.

No one is being conned. There is great backing from the fans. No/ very little unrest.

For years under poor management on and off the pitch we put the long term future of the club at risk with over spending.

Thats in the past.

Delighted with the way the club has acted myself this summer.

Fair enough - it must just be me then.

The poor managment of the past is not in question so I suppose giving ourselves a better chance to stay up with some astute purchases was a non starter in case we got it wrong again.

Supporters turning up to marvel at the opposition and see their team getting beaten is just what we wanted and are not being let down at all as it's all in the long term interests of the club.

The club (Tan/Dalman/Choo/Warnock) knew exactly what they were doing in the summer and we are all delighted with it.

 

[suprimir]

Funny. Before a ball was kicked at the start of the season, many felt the squad would compete well enough to get above 18th. I guess the club did too. Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

Perhaps a bit too much assuming that the club put little effort into the summer. I suggest Hilts as the right of it. We chased players, we didn't want to overspend, and here we are.

I take some heart from our last outing. I think the players will get better as the season goes. Couple of good results over the next 4 games and we will all feel better. If not, well, no point sulking about it for the rest of the season. It can't be changed now.

 

[Hilts24]

Fair enough - it must just be me then.

The poor managment of the past is not in question so I suppose giving ourselves a better chance to stay up with some astute purchases was a non starter in case we got it wrong again.

Supporters turning up to marvel at the opposition and see their team getting beaten is just what we wanted and are not being let down at all as it's all in the long term interests of the club.

The club (Tan/Dalman/Choo/Warnock) knew exactly what they were doing in the summer and we are all delighted with it.

Marvel at the opposition. This isnt happening either.!!!!

Hated the Man City game myself but i doubt anyone else will do that to us.

I was also glad we are not an IPL equivalent of a football club like Man City.

 

[Oldsparkey]

Marvel at the opposition. This isnt happening either.!!!!

Hated the Man City game myself but i doubt anyone else will do that to us.

I was also glad we are not an IPL equivalent of a football club like Man City.

Didn't attend the Man City nor Burnley games Hilts - I was away for the fortnight and glad I was.

I totally agree about being a Man City lookalike as being that last thing I want my club to become. but as the old saying goes, there's a difference beween scratching your arse and tearing flesh.

Having said that, there is a middle route but we've missed the turning. (IMO)