Youth & Loanee Watch
- Thread starter DHCanary
- Start date
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Giant Christmas period roundup:
Josh Murphy: 78 mins vs Wednesday, then two goals in two games versus Forest and Cardiff, finished off with playing the full game versus Leeds.
Gary Hooper: Finally seems to have broken into the Wednesday first team. Scored as a sub vs MK Dons, and followed it up with a goal versus Wolves in the next game. Started two games since and played 90 minutes, only missing one game presumably as the squad was rotated.
Michael Turner: Missing from the Wednesday squad all over the Christmas period. It looks like their manager hurried him back from an injury layoff and had him play two games in 4 days, and that's caused his knee injury to flare up again.
Elliott Bennett: An ever-present for Bristol City, on the right of a 3-5-2. Unfortunately been on the receiving end of some heavy defeats of late.
Tony Andreu: Was missing from the Rotherham side for quite a while, but made a big impact when he came back. His first start since early November yielded 3 assists against Bolton, and he followed that up with a goal against Preston.
Harry Toffolo: Despite going straight into the Rotherham team when he first joined, he's not featured over Christmas, and not made the squad for the last 4 matches.
Jacob Murphy: Rested on a couple of occasions over Christmas, but was back with a bang in the new year, notching two goals and an assist as Coventry demolished Crewe.
Louis Thompson: Played every game for Swindon over the festive period. They've mixed up their formations a lot recently, which has seen him played in a flat midfield 4, and in a diamond at the base or on the right. Good minutes for him nonetheless.
Remi Matthews: Recalled to Colney because he's just been a bench warmer since September, 156 minutes of league football is all he's had, and his role as Burton's cup 'keeper is over as their out of both tournaments.
Cameron Norman: Been played at either LB or RB in all of Woking's recent fixtures, helping them to two clean sheets and they're unbeaten in 5.
Ricky van Wolfswinkel: Has actually got some minutes lately in the league, and scored twice in the cup as highlighted earlier, so not a terrible christmas.
Carlton Morris: Hamilton see enough in him to want to extend his loan, and he's scored twice in 5 games since mid-December. He's appeared in every league game this season which he's been fit for, so that should be doing him some good.
Josh Murphy: 78 mins vs Wednesday, then two goals in two games versus Forest and Cardiff, finished off with playing the full game versus Leeds.
Gary Hooper: Finally seems to have broken into the Wednesday first team. Scored as a sub vs MK Dons, and followed it up with a goal versus Wolves in the next game. Started two games since and played 90 minutes, only missing one game presumably as the squad was rotated.
Michael Turner: Missing from the Wednesday squad all over the Christmas period. It looks like their manager hurried him back from an injury layoff and had him play two games in 4 days, and that's caused his knee injury to flare up again.
Elliott Bennett: An ever-present for Bristol City, on the right of a 3-5-2. Unfortunately been on the receiving end of some heavy defeats of late.
Tony Andreu: Was missing from the Rotherham side for quite a while, but made a big impact when he came back. His first start since early November yielded 3 assists against Bolton, and he followed that up with a goal against Preston.
Harry Toffolo: Despite going straight into the Rotherham team when he first joined, he's not featured over Christmas, and not made the squad for the last 4 matches.
Jacob Murphy: Rested on a couple of occasions over Christmas, but was back with a bang in the new year, notching two goals and an assist as Coventry demolished Crewe.
Louis Thompson: Played every game for Swindon over the festive period. They've mixed up their formations a lot recently, which has seen him played in a flat midfield 4, and in a diamond at the base or on the right. Good minutes for him nonetheless.
Remi Matthews: Recalled to Colney because he's just been a bench warmer since September, 156 minutes of league football is all he's had, and his role as Burton's cup 'keeper is over as their out of both tournaments.
Cameron Norman: Been played at either LB or RB in all of Woking's recent fixtures, helping them to two clean sheets and they're unbeaten in 5.
Ricky van Wolfswinkel: Has actually got some minutes lately in the league, and scored twice in the cup as highlighted earlier, so not a terrible christmas.
Carlton Morris: Hamilton see enough in him to want to extend his loan, and he's scored twice in 5 games since mid-December. He's appeared in every league game this season which he's been fit for, so that should be doing him some good.
With the experience the murphy's are adding and the greater passion for the norwich cause, I honestly think by next season they may be a better bet than Redmond. In spite of his obvious promise and U21 star turns he just doesn't produce nearly often enough for us and I'm beginning to wonder if we are a round hole to his square peg?
The Murphy's might still be too raw next season but Redmond still looks that all too often still this one.
Bah!
The Murphy's might still be too raw next season but Redmond still looks that all too often still this one.
Bah!
End of season update
Josh Murphy: 42 games yielded 5 goals and 9 assists in the league, surely a contender for a place in the first team next season?
Tony Andreu: Just 11 championship games with Rotherham, yielding 2 goals and 4 assists. Not played anywhere since the start of January. Injured?
Harry Toffolo: A disrupted season, 7 games in the championship with Rotherham, 7 in league 1 with Peterborough. Both teams seemed impressed with him though.
Jacob Murphy: 40 games, 9 goals, 10 assists. Dropped off a little after Christmas but then so did Coventry. Can he do the same in the championship?
Louis Thompson: 28 games for Swindon in league 1, yielding 3 goals and an assist. Hard to judge on raw stats
Remi Matthews: Recalled from Burton at Christmas after being firmly number 2 there, went to Doncaster in March and was virtually an ever-present, 2 clean sheets in 9 games, plus one at Burton.
Cameron Norman: Ever present for Woking in the national league since joining in October. Playing at too low a level to be considered for the first team you'd think, but might have earned a loan to a higher league.
Ricky van Wolfswinkel: 5 goals and 2 assists from 21 appearances. Not a regular at Betis.
Carlton Morris: 8 goals and 2 assists in 32 appearances in the SPL, including scoring the goal which guaranteed Hamilton top flight football again next season. Seems to have gone down well there though.
Jake Kean: 1 clean sheet in 6 league one games spread between Colchester and Swindon, played all of our U21 PL games I think.
Jamar Loza: 2 disappointing loans to leagues one and two, mainly with the U21's. Now over-age for that competition too.
Kyle Lafferty: One goal in 6 championship appearances for Birmingham.
James Maddison: 22 games, 3 goals and 3 assists for Coventry. Seemed to play whenever available, but missed several months.
Don't think I've missed anybody.
As repeated elsewhere, Josh, Jacob and Maddison are probably the only ones who have had strong enough seasons to stake a claim for the first team. Toffolo appears promising but has struggled for match experience this year so will probably need assessing. Thompson plays in a role which is hard to assess without really watching, so Neil Adams' report will be interesting.
Otherwise, Matthews and Norman are clearly a work in progress. Loza is probably the biggest disappointment for me, seems to have really struggled this season. Taking an over-age spot in the U21 team makes him staying harder to justify too. I'd probably let him go. Morris and RvW may well end up with the squad unless we sign some decent strikers?!
Josh Murphy: 42 games yielded 5 goals and 9 assists in the league, surely a contender for a place in the first team next season?
Tony Andreu: Just 11 championship games with Rotherham, yielding 2 goals and 4 assists. Not played anywhere since the start of January. Injured?
Harry Toffolo: A disrupted season, 7 games in the championship with Rotherham, 7 in league 1 with Peterborough. Both teams seemed impressed with him though.
Jacob Murphy: 40 games, 9 goals, 10 assists. Dropped off a little after Christmas but then so did Coventry. Can he do the same in the championship?
Louis Thompson: 28 games for Swindon in league 1, yielding 3 goals and an assist. Hard to judge on raw stats
Remi Matthews: Recalled from Burton at Christmas after being firmly number 2 there, went to Doncaster in March and was virtually an ever-present, 2 clean sheets in 9 games, plus one at Burton.
Cameron Norman: Ever present for Woking in the national league since joining in October. Playing at too low a level to be considered for the first team you'd think, but might have earned a loan to a higher league.
Ricky van Wolfswinkel: 5 goals and 2 assists from 21 appearances. Not a regular at Betis.
Carlton Morris: 8 goals and 2 assists in 32 appearances in the SPL, including scoring the goal which guaranteed Hamilton top flight football again next season. Seems to have gone down well there though.
Jake Kean: 1 clean sheet in 6 league one games spread between Colchester and Swindon, played all of our U21 PL games I think.
Jamar Loza: 2 disappointing loans to leagues one and two, mainly with the U21's. Now over-age for that competition too.
Kyle Lafferty: One goal in 6 championship appearances for Birmingham.
James Maddison: 22 games, 3 goals and 3 assists for Coventry. Seemed to play whenever available, but missed several months.
Don't think I've missed anybody.
As repeated elsewhere, Josh, Jacob and Maddison are probably the only ones who have had strong enough seasons to stake a claim for the first team. Toffolo appears promising but has struggled for match experience this year so will probably need assessing. Thompson plays in a role which is hard to assess without really watching, so Neil Adams' report will be interesting.
Otherwise, Matthews and Norman are clearly a work in progress. Loza is probably the biggest disappointment for me, seems to have really struggled this season. Taking an over-age spot in the U21 team makes him staying harder to justify too. I'd probably let him go. Morris and RvW may well end up with the squad unless we sign some decent strikers?!
Excellent summary DH. Josh, Jacob and Maddison have had impressive seasons, but I think Toffolo has potential in the Championship as back-up to Olsson as well. Last season he was competing for a place in a PL side, whereas now it's a Championship side which may well be without Brady as cover for Olsson.
I'll second both DH's post and yours RER.
I'd love to see the more promising youngsters given a chance, but at the same time, I hope the recruitment drive for at least one CB and one striker is in full swing!!!!
Serious question. Anyone know if Olsson has played as a winger.
Not wing back, though he's fine with that.
If there is to be a 'void' on the left, I'm trying to visualise Toffolo LB with Olsson ahead of him.
Should there be a 'void' on the right, Pinto with Josh in front could prove lively?
Not wing back, though he's fine with that.
If there is to be a 'void' on the left, I'm trying to visualise Toffolo LB with Olsson ahead of him.
Should there be a 'void' on the right, Pinto with Josh in front could prove lively?
Serious question. Anyone know if Olsson has played as a winger.
Not wing back, though he's fine with that.
If there is to be a 'void' on the left, I'm trying to visualise Toffolo LB with Olsson ahead of him.
Should there be a 'void' on the right, Pinto with Josh in front could prove lively?
Can't find fault with either of your suggestions!!! Do you fancy becoming AN's advisor Cromer????
Serious question. Anyone know if Olsson has played as a winger.
Not wing back, though he's fine with that.
If there is to be a 'void' on the left, I'm trying to visualise Toffolo LB with Olsson ahead of him.
Should there be a 'void' on the right, Pinto with Josh in front could prove lively?
In about 2010 he was seen as more of a winger by Blackburn, only playing LB when Gael Givet was injured. He said he enjoyed playing further forwards. So he has done it.
I'm pretty sure Josh predominantly plays on the left? So I'd imagine him playing with Olsson at LB is more likely. Toffolo has also played a more advanced role. Should both Brady and Redmond leave though I'd expect another wide midfielder to sign.
On the right, Pinto plus Jacob may terrify opposing RBs, but I think they'd leave a lot to be desired defensively. Finding a balance will be crucial, and I suspect the strength of our CB pairing will dictate how comfortable we are with attacking full backs. Without Klose, I'd want pretty defensive ones currently!
Josh is definitely a left-sided player. Naismith can also play on the left, as can Wes of course and Jarvis is comfortable on either wing. If Redmond leaves, RW is where we need another option. Jacob can play there, but I'm not sure AN would feel he's ready for the Championship yet.
Interesting read on the goals of our academy, from the recent Academy blog on the official site:
"By 2022 we aim to have 10% of league minutes played by Academy graduates.
Why 2022? The Academy first achieved Category One Status in 2012, and therefore was able to extend its player recruitment outside of the previous 1.5 hour rule. An Academy cycle takes 10 years, from bringing a player in aged nine to 12, and that player being ready to break into the first team.
Why 10%? In 2014-15, the average minutes played by Academy graduates for a Premier League club was 8%. Two clubs achieved over 20%, but several clubs also had 0% of minutes played. Norwich City had 0.01% of minutes played in 2012-13 (a substitute appearance by Chris Martin), and this number has steadily grown over the past four years. In 2013-14 it was 0.43%, 2014-15 was 0.85% and last season, due to Declan Rudd’s run in the team, saw Academy graduates play 2.6%.
For 2016-17 we are targeting 4% of league minutes to be played by Academy graduates. This is another steady step forward towards our long-term goal of 10%."
I think we've currently got 4 academy graduates around our first team? Josh, Jacob, Toffolo and Morris. 4% is probably around 25 full games between them this season? Be interesting to see if we hit that.
"By 2022 we aim to have 10% of league minutes played by Academy graduates.
Why 2022? The Academy first achieved Category One Status in 2012, and therefore was able to extend its player recruitment outside of the previous 1.5 hour rule. An Academy cycle takes 10 years, from bringing a player in aged nine to 12, and that player being ready to break into the first team.
Why 10%? In 2014-15, the average minutes played by Academy graduates for a Premier League club was 8%. Two clubs achieved over 20%, but several clubs also had 0% of minutes played. Norwich City had 0.01% of minutes played in 2012-13 (a substitute appearance by Chris Martin), and this number has steadily grown over the past four years. In 2013-14 it was 0.43%, 2014-15 was 0.85% and last season, due to Declan Rudd’s run in the team, saw Academy graduates play 2.6%.
For 2016-17 we are targeting 4% of league minutes to be played by Academy graduates. This is another steady step forward towards our long-term goal of 10%."
I think we've currently got 4 academy graduates around our first team? Josh, Jacob, Toffolo and Morris. 4% is probably around 25 full games between them this season? Be interesting to see if we hit that.
Just a shame that Chrissy Martin has his temperamental issues, he could have been brilliant for us!
Just a shame that Chrissy Martin has his temperamental issues, he could have been brilliant for us!
I'm not so sure, when we were promoted he was no PL striker and I still don't think he is. During our 3 year run in the PL his chances would have been limited and I think he would have been moved on.
I would contend he would have been bang average for us and played very little.
Bah!