Immigration does need to be controlled, we're a small nation in geographical terms and can only take so many I suppose. But I don't really see why we can't address that from within the EU. It isn't just a UK issue, it has become a problem for the whole continent and needs to be addressed by everyone anyway. I imagine new strategies are in the pipeline already.
Ok. I can see the way that came across so I apologise. See my reply to Diego above.
The Little Englander jibe was meant to be towards certain public figures, not particular people on here. I think at every point I've tried to make a coherent argument for what I've said, and not just attack the person I was replying to.
I certainly wouldn't intentionally accuse anyone of racism without due cause.
Well I'm not one to insult people personally unless it's just a bit of banter. Like I said to Diego, it's fine when we're on about football but on a serious subject we don't win by calling each other names.Oh dont be sorry. Tbh what you said wasnt that bad. I think we are all grown up and mature enough not to be bogged down in insults. I just meant diegos sarcy post was just a direct retaliation. Some of the stuff being said about the brexiters in many of the european threads on not606 is pretty bad and insulting. Yours hasnt even been a touch on those
At least some things have improved then.
You know you've lost when you have to resort to smartarse replies in lieu of an actual argument.
Right - we've been through all this several times and I'm not doing it again. I'm not really into confrontational argument for the sake of it.
You vote your way and I'll vote mine, and on our own heads be it.
At least some things have improved then.
On the "validity" point. It's difficult when you look for authoritative and unbiased information on anything, because unless you know better yourself, you can still never be sure of any source. One of the previous links pointed to an article which said that a London university had calculated that the latest wave of European immigrants contributed 34% more than they took out of the economy. Can that be trusted? Unless you know exactly how this research was undertaken, and are sufficiently expert yourself to evaluate the method, you're still only going on what you're told.
A friend of a friend told said friend with great assurance that Romanians are responsible for 40% of all the crime in London.
I'm guessing that's a Daily Mail "calculation".
Like most people it seems, the mrs and I don't really know which way to vote since we haven't a clue whats what. Not to worry though, she had a genius idea! Since we both get a vote, we'll vote opposite ways to counter each other
Fair enough.
Childish banter is sort of expected when we're talking about football, but on an important issue like this I think we need a bit more than that.
I can understand you resenting being thought of as something you're not because of association - although I would draw a distinction between racism and xenophobia, btw.
Of course I'm generalising - none of us can do anything else because we can't know everyone else's motivation. We all have to make up our minds based on a lot of guesswork.
I'm sure there are those who genuinely feel we'd be better off outside, but all the high-profile arguments tend to be either highly simplistic ones about the economics of the situation (which are hotly disputed) or trying to play on people's fear of those different to themselves. I simply can't see Farage's camp motivated by anything other than a yearning for a rose-tinted "glorious" past.
For my own part, I'm not very nationalistic - by that I don't mean I'm unpatriotic, just that I don't feel a nationalist competitiveness that others seem to.
My extended family includes Africans and Brazilians, I have good friends (real ones- not internet or pub "friends"
I think many of the criticisms of the EU are fair, but that we'd be better off trying to solve them from the inside rather than turning our backs on it. I believe the evolution of global politics is one of incremental union rather than division. The past is gone and we need to move forward, not back.
What about the other 14%?
