Warnock Out

[FORZA LEEDS]

I was against signing Diouf initially as I, like Simon, (although not as strongly as him I must admit), despised Diouf for all his indiscretions in the past, but Elmo has put across such a well constructed argument (without resorting to personal insults) that I'm actually prepared to give Diouff the benefit of the doubt and support him as a Leeds United player. After all we were all behind the despicable Bowyer and he didn't have the 'cultural difference' excuse. He, like Joey Barton and others of similar ilk, are just lowlife, pure and simple, and unfortunately it seems British society is gradually becoming more and more populated with this type of scum, born and raised in this country, while people from so-called Third World countries overtake us in morals, manners, and how to behave in everyday life in general.

 

[Simon21-LUFC]

As for the "cultural differences" argument, it should be noted that Diouf moved to France when he was a teenager.

 

[Farsleyexile]

Elmo i said ease down that`s all,heck i`ve had 2 heart attacks and a by-pass jobbie,i wasn`t jumping on your back at all,heck this is football not the end of the world.

 

[666 & Elmo]

Just because someone lives in a country does not mean their upbringing is the same as the white westernized majority in that country. It certainly is not the case for immigrants who arrive in Britain - they mainly end up in enclaves and communities that mirror what they came from rather than where they have come to. I don't think yours is a relevant statement in this regard Simon

 

[666 & Elmo]

Elmo i said ease down that`s all,heck i`ve had 2 heart attacks and a by-pass jobbie,i wasn`t jumping on your back at all,heck this is football not the end of the world.

And I am having a debate (or trying to) in an objective manner while having to contend with very forceful and sometimes downright nasty slurs and comments. Yet you tell me to ease down. You aim your comments at the wrong person imo

I don't have any heart problems

 

[Simon21-LUFC]

Just because someone lives in a country does not mean their upbringing is the same as the white westernized majority in that country. It certainly is not the case for immigrants who arrive in Britain - they mainly end up in enclaves and communities that mirror what they came from rather than where they have come to. I don't think yours is a relevant statement in this regard Simon

He moved to France to play football, so he'll have spent a very large portion of his time amongst French people.

And for what it's worth I don't think anything you've said so far is relevant.

Can I ask if you also think Suarez's claim that he wasn't being racist because he comes from a different culture is legitimate?

 

[Simon21-LUFC]

And I am having a debate (or trying to) in an objective manner while having to contend with very forceful and sometimes downright nasty slurs and comments. Yet you tell me to ease down. You aim your comments at the wrong person imo

Do you mind if I ask you to point these out?

 

[Danger Fox]

I was against signing Diouf initially as I, like Simon, (although not as strongly as him I must admit), despised Diouf for all his indiscretions in the past, but Elmo has put across such a well constructed argument (without resorting to personal insults) that I'm actually prepared to give Diouff the benefit of the doubt and support him as a Leeds United player. After all we were all behind the despicable Bowyer and he didn't have the 'cultural difference' excuse. He, like Joey Barton and others of similar ilk, are just lowlife, pure and simple, and unfortunately it seems British society is gradually becoming more and more populated with this type of scum, born and raised in this country, while people from so-called Third World countries overtake us in morals, manners, and how to behave in everyday life in general.

LiE - Elmo has indeed argued eloquently, passionately and with measured decorum

However, I think most peoples and probably your own initial feelings of detest towards this man is his continued re-offending - Everyone makes mistakes, everyone has done something which if discussed openly would not make them proud, but I argue that it is the very nature of our shame over previous incidents which sets us apart from this serial loathsome offender against human decency

 

[I used to be john fallen]

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The leader of the national union of sewer rats has called out all his members in protest after being associated with diouf.. shop steward ben said ..." no more s h i t gets eaten until this slur is withdrawn. " " None of our rodents with handle any stools coming from warnock or bates"... "and thats an awful lot of crap, I can tell you"....

 

[666 & Elmo]

He moved to France to play football, so he'll have spent a very large portion of his time amongst French people.

And for what it's worth I don't think anything you've said so far is relevant.

Fair enough, if that is how you prefer to debate. Again, I fear that shows a closed mind to the possibility of other angles to an issue.

Can I ask if you also think Suarez's claim that he wasn't being racist because he comes from a different culture is legitimate?

To tell you the truth I have not followed it closely. My view is that if someone uses someone else's colour to denigrate someone, it is racism. The key thing is what the punishment should be. My view is that Suarez should have asked for help to allow him to integrate better and understand the standards that Britain and the FA clearly want from him - if he had done that, he may have got a much easier ride. As he is still complaining about it (in the papers in his home country recently I believe) it is clear that he still does not accept there are different standards he should be trying to adhere to.

But if there is no educational angle to helping all these people coming in to our country from different ones, the FA and the clubs should be taken to task.

Do you mind if I ask you to point these out?

Take a look at the list of quotes I provided in response to Farsley on page 5

 

[Simon21-LUFC]

Fair enough, if that is how you prefer to debate. Again, I fear that shows a closed mind to the possibility of other angles to an issue.





To tell you the truth I have not followed it closely. My view is that if someone uses someone else's colour to denigrate someone, it is racism. The key thing is what the punishment should be. My view is that Suarez should have asked for help to allow him to integrate better and understand the standards that Britain and the FA clearly want from him - if he had done that, he may have got a much easier ride. As he is still complaining about it (in the papers in his home country recently I believe) it is clear that he still does not accept there are different standards he should be trying to adhere to.

But if there is no educational angle to helping all these people coming in to our country from different ones, the FA and the clubs should be taken to task.





Take a look at the list of quotes I provided in response to Farsley on page 5

Ah right, thought you meant people were personally attacking you.

Of course, all those comments are perfectly relevant as it is Diouf's character we are discussing.

 

[Best Fans]

This is my view on Diouf:

- When he was a young player starting out in England, he had a few on pitch incidents and altercations with fans (the spitting things). His actions then were stupid and unpleasant. We don't actually know what, or if something was said to provoke him, although that doesn't justify his actions.
- He has been accused of beating his wife. Obviously if this is true, it's disgusting.
- He drank drive and paid his punishment for it. Something that Fabian Delph did but I never read any Leeds fans calling for his departure.
- The Jamie Mackie thing was in the heat of the moment.
- He 'threatened' Anton Ferdinand.
- He was in a fight at a club.

I'd say what I wrote earlier in this thread. He's nowhere near as bad as people make him out to be. Everyone's talking about him and whether Warnock can 'control' him. I'm sure he's probably fine behind the scenes and at training, no different from another player and lots of players have been involved in disputes with team mates before. He has a short fuse, and probably has lots of people insulting him, especially if he's out at a club or bar, which is what led to a fight and I doubt he was out himself looking for fights with people.

He's just one of these players who the media have latched onto and turned into a hate figure - similar to Terry, Cole etc. - and people swear that they 'hate' him. It's all about perception. There's plenty of players who will have done the same stuff as him, but it won't be reported. Lots of these accusations haven't been proven either.

I'm not saying he's a nice guy, I don't really know, but some people have over the top reactions to someone they don't know. It's all media perception.

He's a good player. Look at the way he stood out at the game against Doncaster last season. He will provide some creativity and spark that we are short on at the moment.

 

[FORZA LEEDS]

LiE - Elmo has indeed argued eloquently, passionately and with measured decorum

However, I think most peoples and probably your own initial feelings of detest towards this man is his continued re-offending - Everyone makes mistakes, everyone has done something which if discussed openly would not make them proud, but I argue that it is the very nature of our shame over previous incidents which sets us apart from this serial loathsome offender against human decency

Danger basically it doesn't affect my life one way or the other whether Diouf is a Leeds United player or not, and I'm certainly not going to get myself worked up over it. Ive had the misfortune to spend this weekend in the hole that is Croydon, lowlife scum aplenty there, where an innocent 12 year old girl was murdered by a member of her own family, a drug dealing waste of space, and I guess it put into perspective the 'crimes' of Diouf for me. If all I have to do is watch Diouf turn out for Leeds once or twice a week, I can live with that. It's the people you have to walk the streets with, not knowing what the hell they get up to behind closed doors, I'm more concerned with.

 

[Danger Fox]

Danger basically it doesn't affect my life one way or the other whether Diouf is a Leeds United player or not, and I'm certainly not going to get myself worked up over it. Ive had the misfortune to spend this weekend in the hole that is Croydon, lowlife scum aplenty there, where an innocent 12 year old girl was murdered by a member of her own family, a drug dealing waste of space, and I guess it put into perspective the 'crimes' of Diouf for me. If all I have to do is watch Diouf turn out for Leeds once or twice a week, I can live with that. It's the people you have to walk the streets with, not knowing what the hell they get up to behind closed doors, I'm more concerned with.

Fair point LiE

RIP little Tia

 

[Norwayleedsforever]

Danger basically it doesn't affect my life one way or the other whether Diouf is a Leeds United player or not, and I'm certainly not going to get myself worked up over it. Ive had the misfortune to spend this weekend in the hole that is Croydon, lowlife scum aplenty there, where an innocent 12 year old girl was murdered by a member of her own family, a drug dealing waste of space, and I guess it put into perspective the 'crimes' of Diouf for me. If all I have to do is watch Diouf turn out for Leeds once or twice a week, I can live with that. It's the people you have to walk the streets with, not knowing what the hell they get up to behind closed doors, I'm more concerned with.

That is a fair point
We tend to forget about this kind of things in our little world of football. So I have to agree with you on Diouf If he plays for us, then so be it. I will always support the team no matter what.

 

[Simon21-LUFC]

Since when was it necessary to like every player in order to support your team. If people believe we would be better off without Diouf then surely trying to get him out of the squad is supporting the team?

 

[Best Fans]

Since when was it necessary to like every player in order to support your team. If people believe we would be better off without Diouf then surely trying to get him out of the squad is supporting the team?

If by 'trying to get him out of the squad' you mean booing, like some people did yesterday, then no, that's not supporting the team. Anyone who boos a Leeds player in his FIRST appearance for the club based on a media perception are not the kind of supporters we need.

 

[Simon21-LUFC]

If by 'trying to get him out of the squad' you mean booing, like some people did yesterday, then no, that's not supporting the team. Anyone who boos a Leeds player in his FIRST appearance for the club based on a media perception are not the kind of supporters we need.

But, as I've tried to say, it's not about how he plays, it's about letting him know he's not fit to wear our shirt, which he isn't. And by "media perception" I'm assuming you mean them reporting his wife beating, spitting, racism, club brawls and multiple driving offences?

 

[Best Fans]

But, as I've tried to say, it's not about how he plays, it's about letting him know he's not fit to wear our shirt, which he isn't. And by "media perception" I'm assuming you mean them reporting his wife beating, spitting, racism, club brawls and multiple driving offences?

No. I mean his media perception in the way that they report things to do with him and not other players. Look at the way Suarez has been portrayed by the media, and now he's a hate figure. Same with Ashley Cole. Same with John Terry.

You can choose to believe some of the allegations against him and activity boo him at games. The spitting incident happened nearly 10 years ago, let it go. Plenty of people have driving offences, including Delph (was he fit to wear the shirt?). The club brawls, you actually know nothing about who started them or where involved in them (what if McCormack was the instigator last season in the tunnel fight?).

The wife beating thing is horrible. I agree with you on that, although again it was a while back, maybe the guys changed. I'm not saying that I'm going to be chanting Diouf's name, but to boo him is stupid and detrimental to Leeds' chances.

My point is, you don't know him and you don't know whether these things about him are true. He's a Leeds player and could be a good one for us. So don't boo. Unless you booed Lee Bowyer and Woodgate after they beat up an Asian kid?

 

[Josh-LUFC]

Feck me Farsley - have you read the things that these people are saying about a Leeds United player, and while I debate that he is hardly different from anyone else and should be given a chance, you tell me to ease down? Beggars belief!

You need to read a bit more instead of jumping on my back

There is no possible way you could disagree with any of those comments you picked from mine and Simon's responses