The ballot...

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They’ll still convince themselves that they won though
It’s how they think
The only way to change that is immediately start protesting again as soon as the new scam is in place

The Trust need to get working on their response to the result whichever way it goes, the next battle is all about the media coverage.
Unless of course announcing the result is delayed, then it will be the name change on April 2nd or the up and coming fan consultation on the logo.
 
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It would seem that they've set nothing up for corporate members to vote.

We don't have a reference number on our passes, so I asked this morning how I was supposed to vote and this afternoon, they've sent me a number to use.

I've asked if every corporate member who wants to vote, has to email them and ask them for a number first. No response yet.

Assuming they do, they can start with the a number for junior.

Usual farce.
 
I am sorry, Fez, but you are wrong, when the OSC agrees with the club, it also stays silent. We do not issue press statements for instance. We dismantled that side of the organisation completely.

Yep, it encouraged me to revisit your site and it is transformed. Thanks for your correction. <ok>
 
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It would seem that they've set nothing up for corporate members to vote.

We don't have a reference number on our passes, so I asked this morning how I was supposed to vote and this afternoon, they've sent me a number to use.

I've asked if every corporate member who wants to vote, has to email them and ask them for a number first. No response yet.

Assuming they do, they can start with the a number for junior.

Usual farce.
You rich bastards don't need concessions...

:bandit:
 
It's damed if you do, damed if you don't.

I voted for concessions. I don't have kids or elderley relatives, but I'm voting for the principle of concessions.

It's going to be a 22% rise, but I'm trying to think of the future of the club.

I spoke to a few people on Saturday and lot have said they're voting for no concessions. Because they don't want to pay more. Which I get, but I think it's a slightly backwards way of thinking.
 
It's damed if you do, damed if you don't.

I voted for concessions. I don't have kids or elderley relatives, but I'm voting for the principle of concessions.

It's going to be a 22% rise, but I'm trying to think of the future of the club.

I spoke to a few people on Saturday and lot have said they're voting for no concessions. Because they don't want to pay more. Which I get, but I think it's a slightly backwards way of thinking.

Even if peoope think that way, the west and east stands apart from the very corners will all go down in price even for adults.
 
It's damed if you do, damed if you don't.

I voted for concessions. I don't have kids or elderley relatives, but I'm voting for the principle of concessions.

It's going to be a 22% rise, but I'm trying to think of the future of the club.

I spoke to a few people on Saturday and lot have said they're voting for no concessions. Because they don't want to pay more. Which I get, but I think it's a slightly backwards way of thinking.
Slightly?
FFS.
 
Even if peoope think that way, the west and east stands apart from the very corners will all go down in price even for adults.
What?
Will they ****!

No person in East Stand that takes kids will find their group price ‘go down in price’...not one...at all
Many people in East Stand that take young uns will find their costs go up

Some ****ing concessions !

EDIT- I don’t go in East Stand anymore by the way...so it’s not ‘alright jack ’ or moaning about price ****...but I did used to stand there, so they’re still my people

Concessions my arse
 
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It would seem that they've set nothing up for corporate members to vote.

We don't have a reference number on our passes, so I asked this morning how I was supposed to vote and this afternoon, they've sent me a number to use.

I've asked if every corporate member who wants to vote, has to email them and ask them for a number first. No response yet.

Assuming they do, they can start with the a number for junior.

Usual farce.

Got Ya, will E mail them.
 
What?
Will they ****!

No person in East Stand that takes kids will find their group price ‘go down in price’...not one...at all
Many people in East Stand that take young uns will find their costs go up

Some ****ing concessions !

EDIT- I don’t go in East Stand anymore by the way...so it’s not ‘alright jack ’ or moaning about price ****...but I did used to stand there, so they’re still my people

Concessions my arse

Apart from the corners, East and West were Zone 3 (£39 a month for everyone) and under the new scheme will be zone 2 (monthly prices £36/£27/18) so it's cheaper for everyone in there.
 
Apart from the corners, East and West were Zone 3 (£39 a month for everyone) and under the new scheme will be zone 2 (monthly prices £36/£27/18) so it's cheaper for everyone in there.
Ah
Ok
My mistake, apologies
I thought East was all zone 2 already
So it’s just the corners where everyone with kids will see their price go up then?
 
Ah
Ok
My mistake, apologies
I thought East was all zone 2 already
So it’s just the corners where everyone with kids will see their price go up then?

Simple stuff this...
...serves to emphasise the confusion many will have.
 
Apart from the corners, East and West were Zone 3 (£39 a month for everyone) and under the new scheme will be zone 2 (monthly prices £36/£27/18) so it's cheaper for everyone in there.
Kinell didn't realise that. It's going to be a mad scramble to get out of the corners.
 
HCST Statement...

Having taken time to understand Hull City’s proposed new pricing structure over the weekend, HCST would like to share our views on the proposal, the associated ballot and the implications its result may have.

The New Proposal

Firstly, the pricing structure itself. The proposed model was revealed by the club on Friday and had not been shown to the supporters’ committee beforehand, so in order to come to an agreement supporters are happy with, the club must now take on board feedback.

There are undoubtedly good points to the proposal. The fact it includes concessions of any sort is something that has been fought hard for and seemed very unlikely at times. The simplification of stadium zones and match categories is welcome. The change means that the East and West stands, excluding the corner blocks, are now entirely zone 2 and their monthly membership price has reduced for all fans as a result. Elsewhere in the stadium there are price increases for adults which was always to be expected when concessions were re-introduced. We acknowledge that some current prices are very cheap for adults.

On the other hand there are some big issues with the proposal. The restriction that only one junior ticket can be bought per adult ticket bought is draconian, unrealistic and simply wrong. Families should be able to take their children to football without being discouraged or priced out altogether by not being offered a reasonable child price. It is very obvious that the current attitude towards child prices has caused a huge drop in attendances and this will need to change for supporters to return in numbers. Furthermore many grandparents take their grandchild to football, and if they qualify for a senior concession they should still be able to take their grandchild on a child’s ticket. Quite simply every child should get a child’s price, regardless of who they attend with.

Another big problem is the lack of concessions for disabled supporters and finally, the absence of any discount for young adult supporters is an avoidable deterrent. This is the age where so many young supporters stop attending live games, and City should be trying to minimise these losses by offering them a reasonable discount from the full adult price.

Overall, the proposal is an improvement on the current arrangements. The significant drawbacks don’t make things any worse than the current situation of having no concessions at all, and the improvements over the current system are notable.

The Ballot Process

Focusing on the ballot, we appreciate that the club has included former members and season pass holders in the ballot process. This is something which was initially not going to happen but following feedback from the supporters committee the club have listened and we are keen to recognise that.

Whilst some supporters have expressed concern over the black and white nature of the poll, with some calling for a third option such as ‘neither’, we note that following the previous ballot ran by the club back in 2014, many people wanted a simple ‘yes’ or ‘no’ with no ambiguous options. In our view, a simple poll with only two options is the best way to establish a preference.

In order for this process to be democratic, votes can only be treated as what they are: an expression of preference between the two options. It doesn’t necessarily mean either is perfect and indeed, of all the feedback we have seen, no one has said they are really happy with either model.

Some supporters have expressed concerns that the result of the vote could have implications beyond the preference which they have explicitly stated in their vote. There are concerns that a vote for no change could be taken to mean ‘no concessions at all’ and that a yes vote could be taken to mean ‘no further changes are required’. If this was to happen it would be entirely wrong and an abuse of the democratic process. HCST’s ongoing work with the club will focus on ensuring that this does not happen, whichever way the vote goes.

It’s also important to note that this vote is not purely about whether or not supporters want concessions. It is beyond question that supporters absolutely do want concessions. This vote is about whether the club’s new proposal should be adopted to replace the existing scheme.

Finally, as part of our feedback to the club we will be looking for reassurance over the transparency of the ballot. Following the previous ballot in 2014 we have concerns that the result is entirely controlled and announced by the club and supporters have no way of verifying the outcome.

The Vote and Next Steps

We are confident that views across the fanbase are closely aligned on this issue. It appears that the only real split is around which option is more likely to be misinterpreted by the club to mean something more than it explicitly says. With this in mind, our next steps write themselves. If there is a verdict for no change, we will continue our campaign to introduce a real concessions model which is acceptable to supporters. If there is a verdict for adopting the new proposal, we will campaign for further changes to improve upon the negative parts of the scheme. Either way, we are confident that this debate will continue following the vote and hopeful that the club will listen.

We’re aware that some supporters are looking to us for guidance on which way to vote. We don’t believe it’s right for a trust to tell supporters which way to vote. We campaign for what supporters tell us they want, rather than telling supporters what they should want.

That said, our opinion as a trust board of directors is that voting for the new proposal to be implemented is the best option. We believe the new proposal is an improvement (albeit limited) on the existing scheme. We also believe it can be used as a first step towards a much better end goal which can be achieved in the long-term through dialogue and gradual improvement.

http://hullcitysupporterstrust.com/hcst-statement-concessions-ballot/

This is well written, but some of the thinking is puzzling:

The New Proposal - most things are covered, except for the fact that the proposal is highly divisive and unacceptable on that basis.

The Ballot - the votes have been worded by the club and if they are accepted and voted upon, then that is democratic. If you don't like them reject them. Once the vote has taken place the majority vote will represent the majority view of those who voted; the Trust's on going work mustn't seek to tamper with this process that they advocate.

16500 is the key number I have seen mentioned as the potential electorate; is this agreed?

Abstention is not dealt with or considered as an option; there is no thought given to offering an out and out rejection of the loaded offer.

The Vote and Next Steps - the Trust clearly say that they favour a vote for the new way, so why dress that up by saying they don't believe they should tell voters which way to vote, yet they give their view, which is tantamount to advising voters seeking advice.
 
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Ah
Ok
My mistake, apologies
I thought East was all zone 2 already
So it’s just the corners where everyone with kids will see their price go up then?

It's proposed that 80% of the East and over 50% of the West is being switched from Zone 3 to Zone 2.

If you were in the East or West (Zone 3) with a kid last season it cost you £78 a month, now it would be £54 a month with an U14, or £63 a month with a 14 to 17 year old (the cost saving obviously increases the more kids you take, though it messed up a bit with the daft restrictions on seniors taking kids etc).

The six half blocks that were already Zone 2 go up, from £27 to £36, so an adult with a kid in there who previously paid £54 a month, now still pays £54 a month with an U14, or sees it increase to £63 a month with a 14 to 17 year old (again it gets messier with multiple kids or seniors, due to the daft restrictions). It's actually quite a small number of seats that fall into this category.

It's lone adults who will see the main increases, rather than people with kids (which is what you'd expect with the reintroduction of concessions).

If they got rid of the daft restrictions on the number of kids and seniors with kids, things would look significantly better.
 
This is well written, but some of the thinking is puzzling:

The New Proposal - most things are covered, except for the fact that the proposal is highly divisive and unacceptable on that basis.

The Ballot - the votes have been worded by the club and if they are accepted and voted upon, then that is democratic. If you don't like them reject them. Once the vote has taken place the majority vote will represent the majority view of those who voted; the Trust's on going work mustn't seek to tamper with this process that they advocate.

16500 is the key number I have seen mentioned as the potential electorate; is this agreed?

Abstention is not dealt with or considered as an option; there is no thought given to offering an out and out rejection of the loaded offer.

The Vote and Next Steps - the Trust clearly say that they favour a vote for the new way, so why dress that up by saying they don't believe they should tell voters which way to vote, yet they give their view, which is tantamount to advising voters seeking advice.

How do you reject them?
 
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