Scotch Independence - the countdown

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Should Scotland be an Independent Country?

  • Yes

  • No

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Voters south of the Border want a cut to Scottish annual public spending of almost £1,400 per person if there is a No vote
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^^^^

The consequences of voting No.
 
Both sides are full of rhetoric and bluster with no substance.

The papers have been well the papers.

Britain and Scotland in particular deserved better than this charade by both sides.

Someone also wants to tell Salmond that this vote is not just for "scots" as he always puts it.
 
ERINBLACK said:
Both sides are full of rhetoric and bluster with no substance.

The papers have been well the papers.

Britain and Scotland in particular deserved better than this charade by both sides.

Someone also wants to tell Salmond that this vote is not just for "scots" as he always puts it.
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That's a tricky one ER - you can't really ask the whole of the UK to determine the future of one constituent part as it's completely disproportionate. If every person in Scotland wanted independence and voted accordingly they'd still not get it if voters in England disagreed - that would be totally unjust. On the other hand, the cries of "it's none of Nigel's f**ing business" that we keep hearing (not necessarily in those specific terms of course) are nonsense. The idea that Scottish independence will have no impact on the rest of the UK is folly.

The No camp has not helped in that regard as they've made no efort to try and spell out what will happen for the rest of us if there is a yes vote. I'm not against Scottish independence in principle but am very worried that we appear to have no plans to deal with it if it happens.
 
Dan Starkey said:
That's a tricky one ER - you can't really ask the whole of the UK to determine the future of one constituent part as it's completely disproportionate. If every person in Scotland wanted independence and voted accordingly they'd still not get it if voters in England disagreed - that would be totally unjust. On the other hand, the cries of "it's none of Nigel's f**ing business" that we keep hearing (not necessarily in those specific terms of course) are nonsense. The idea that Scottish independence will have no impact on the rest of the UK is folly.

The No camp has not helped in that regard as they've made no efort to try and spell out what will happen for the rest of us if there is a yes vote. I'm not against Scottish independence in principle but am very worried that we appear to have no plans to deal with it if it happens.
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I think ER means non-Scots resident in Scotland.
 
Tina's Prolapsed Anus said:
I think ER means non-Scots resident in Scotland.
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Ah fair enough.
I still stand by the rest of it though. In fact I wouldn't be surprised to see the yes campaign put out an ad saying "Nigel's a c**t and we're going to tell him just that on 18September"... In the interests of balance, it wouldn't be altogether surprising to see the No campaign produce a video showing the electorate how to get to the polliong station, how to open the door, what to say to the officials, the correct way to walk into the booth, how to lift the pencil and then how to actually cast the vote.
 
Dan Starkey said:
Ah fair enough.
I still stand by the rest of it though. In fact I wouldn't be surprised to see the yes campaign put out an ad saying "Nigel's a **** and we're going to tell him just that on 18September"... In the interests of balance, it wouldn't be altogether surprising to see the No campaign produce a video showing the electorate how to get to the polliong station, how to open the door, what to say to the officials, the correct way to walk into the booth, how to lift the pecncil and then how to actually cast the vote.
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<confused>
 
ERINBLACK said:
Both sides are full of rhetoric and bluster with no substance.

The papers have been well the papers.

Britain and Scotland in particular deserved better than this charade by both sides.

Someone also wants to tell Salmond that this vote is not just for "scots" as he always puts it.
Click to expand...

NO the NO side is full of rhetoric and Bluster with NO substance.

There is no sensible case for staying with the Union if there was they would have presented it by now.

On the No side:

The Establishment, The Wealthy, The Landowners, The Fearful, The Ignorant.
 
Originally Posted by Hornet-Fez View Post
"It seems that people living in Scotland can't lose, whichever way the vote goes, with politicians in Westminster promising them the earth if they vote no and the SNP promising them a new golden age if they vote yes! For me, the word politician means lying, cheating, thieving confidence trickster so I doubt that it will make much difference which way they vote, they will still be screwed by those they vote into government.

We live at present in something called The United Kingdom, i.e. a union of Nations. Why is it that only one (relatively) small part of this Kingdom is being allowed to vote on whether or not to dissolve the union? Where's my say? Personally I'd vote yes, if only so that the BBC wouldn't have to report on their useless third rate football teams!"

To quote onme edson from the Spurs thread I reckon this is the opinion which most closely matches mine except that I remain in favour of the Union. It's also the one comment you answered, regardless as to whether I agree with your overall opinion or not, with a somewhat unsatisfactory response. As I've taken the time to trawl through 8 pages of debate, perhaps you might give this a bit more of a considered answer rather than just a critique of the voting options in England?
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This is the classic England centric view and and a source of greivance among some of my Scots friends. You will need to set aside your England hat for the moment and consider what this referendum is about.

Should Scotland be an Independent Country?

This is a question for the people of Scotland, those that live and work there. Yes it will effect the rest of the UK but nevertheless it is not for them to decide Scotland's future.

Let's look at another example:

Cameron says he will have a referendum on 'IN OUT for the UK in the EU' This will effect the rest of the EU but you would not expect Germany or France or Belguim, etc to have a vote in this referrendum would you?

Scotland is a Country, it is not a region of the UK. Scotland being able to make it's own decisions is what this is all about.
 
Spurf said:
NO the NO side is full of rhetoric and Bluster with NO substance.

There is no sensible case for staying with the Union if there was they would have presented it by now.

On the No side:

The Establishment, The Wealthy, The Landowners, The Fearful, The Ignorant.
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And the Yes Vote is all fingers crossed and Pie in the Sky that they cannot substantiate. Now as well as automatic admission to the EU is not a given straight away neither is membership of NATO (and quite rightly so). Scotland will have to get in line under Independence.

As I say both sides have been shockingly inept at delivering facts from which the residents can base an informed decision. Even ST and I agree on that one.
 
Spurf said:
Originally Posted by Hornet-Fez View Post

This is the classic England centric view and and a source of greivance among some of my Scots friends. You will need to set aside your England hat for the moment and consider what this referendum is about.

Should Scotland be an Independent Country?

This is a question for the people of Scotland, those that live and work there. Yes it will effect the rest of the UK but nevertheless it is not for them to decide Scotland's future.

Let's look at another example:

Cameron says he will have a referendum on 'IN OUT for the UK in the EU' This will effect the rest of the EU but you would not expect Germany or France or Belguim, etc to have a vote in this referrendum would you?

Scotland is a Country, it is not a region of the UK. Scotland being able to make it's own decisions is what this is all about.
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It's part of the Union as it stands you ****in ignoramus. Yes it is Britain as it stands.

****in muppet.
 
Jocks won't have the balls to go it alone, no self respect.

I predict at least 65% for NO.
 
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