Off Topic Politics Thread

[Beef]

A Labour MP backed calls to “relocate” Israel to America so that land “stolen” from Palestine could be returned, it has emerged.

Naz Shah, who was elected MP for Bradford West last May, shared a poster on Facebook proposing which argued the “transportation costs” would be worth it.

It went on to argue that Americans would “welcome Israelis with open arms” and that the relocation would bring peace to the Middle East by ending “foreign interference”.

Alongside the poster Ms Shah wrote “problem solved”, added a smiley face and suggested she would lobby David Cameron to adopt the plan.

Ms Shah has apologised for the messages, which were posted in 2014 before she became an MP, and said the proposal “does not reflect my views” today.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...el-to-america/

Here's me having a go at a Labour MP.....

I am sure she is only sorry she got caught. Even though it was before she became mp, it still is anti semitic and dumb.

 

[Beef]

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Skinner being Skinner.

 

[Saint Helen]

Talk about stupidity:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/election-2016-wales-36132140

Plaid Cymru candidate Arfon Jones defends 'bomb' tweet

 

[VVD]

A Labour MP backed calls to “relocate” Israel to America so that land “stolen” from Palestine could be returned, it has emerged.

Naz Shah, who was elected MP for Bradford West last May, shared a poster on Facebook proposing which argued the “transportation costs” would be worth it.

It went on to argue that Americans would “welcome Israelis with open arms” and that the relocation would bring peace to the Middle East by ending “foreign interference”.

Alongside the poster Ms Shah wrote “problem solved”, added a smiley face and suggested she would lobby David Cameron to adopt the plan.

Ms Shah has apologised for the messages, which were posted in 2014 before she became an MP, and said the proposal “does not reflect my views” today.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016...el-to-america/

Here's me having a go at a Labour MP.....

I am sure she is only sorry she got caught. Even though it was before she became mp, it still is anti semitic and dumb.

It's a weird proposal and obviously will never happen, but the Israeli/Palestinian conflict is a huge issue that seems to disappear from news for long periods due to other issues around the world.

 

[Onionman]

No, I think I get your point; you get offended when people are rude about the Tories. Duly noted.

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Wow. That's an interesting take on what I wrote.

I used these exact words in that post: "I'll happily do the same for extreme anti-Labour views" (I cut and pasted that to make sure I got it just right).

I've previously argued on here for:

A strong Labour party - because it would put a brake on the Tories
Proportional representation - so we could get a coalition of mid right and mid-left parties (earlier today)

Hardly the work of someone who's rabidly pro-Tory

I'm not offended when people are rude about Tories. I'm offended when people take rabidly anti-anyone views and deal with them as cartoonish stereotypes.

I'm arguing against politics being seen as black and white and that response is a perfect example of black and white posting. You couldn't make it up.

Vin

 

[SaintinSerbia]

I can't vote cos I've left the country but I like Jeremy Corbyn (so far) and find nothing to like about David Cameron. I've never understood the mentality of voting Tory because you earn 10 grand more than your neighbour and drive an Audi. YOU'RE STILL IN THE 99% OF PEOPLE WHO OWN **** ALL!

 

[Onionman]

I can't vote cos I've left the country but I like Jeremy Corbyn (so far) and find nothing to like about David Cameron. I've never understood the mentality of voting Tory because you earn 10 grand more than your neighbour and drive an Audi. YOU'RE STILL IN THE 99% OF PEOPLE WHO OWN **** ALL!

Interestingly, using Oxfam's data, around £500K of net worth gets you into the fabled world elite 1%. It includes housing assets. About 2.4 million people in the UK are in the 1%.

Vin

 

[Qwerty]

.

 

[ChilcoSaint]

Wow. That's an interesting take on what I wrote.

I used these exact words in that post: "I'll happily do the same for extreme anti-Labour views" (I cut and pasted that to make sure I got it just right).

I've previously argued on here for:

A strong Labour party - because it would put a brake on the Tories
Proportional representation - so we could get a coalition of mid right and mid-left parties (earlier today)

Hardly the work of someone who's rabidly pro-Tory

I'm not offended when people are rude about Tories. I'm offended when people take rabidly anti-anyone views and deal with them as cartoonish stereotypes.

I'm arguing against politics being seen as black and white and that response is a perfect example of black and white posting. You couldn't make it up.

Vin

We've had our disagreements Vin, but this is spot on. I posted something along the same lines a few weeks ago. Parliamentary yah-boo mutual slagging-off leaves me completely cold these days, and I would love to see a complete realignment of politics in this country with a national coalition working together, along the lines of the government during WWII. PR has to happen to bring that about though.

 

[SaintinSerbia]

Interestingly, using Oxfam's data, around £500K of net worth gets you into the fabled world elite 1%. It includes housing assets. About 2.4 million people in the UK are in the 1%.

Vin

Vin

there are 7 billion people in the world. If 2.4 million Brits are in the top 1%, that's 0.03 % of the worlds population

 

[Qwerty]

.

 

[Onionman]

Vin

there are 7 billion people in the world. If 2.4 million Brits are in the top 1%, that's 0.03 % of the worlds population

Your maths is correct and says that 0.03% of the world's population is British people who are also in the top1% of the world's population ranked by net assets. I'm not certain that's a number that tells us much.

What might be more useful is that Britain comprises about 1% of the world's population yet contains 3.4% of the worlds richest people (defined as the 1%).

Vin

 

[Onionman]

If I remember rightly those Oxfam numbers were based on total assets minus liabilities - fine for billionaires but makes me (with around £20k student debt) one of the poorest people in the world.

Found it: http://blogs.ft.com/ftdata/2016/01/18/three-reasons-to-question-oxfams-inequality-figures/ (FT so it might be paywalled).

If you have any net assets, you're richer than the poorest 2 billion people. You're definitely better off then Jerome Kerviel, who owes the €5.7 billion he lost at Societe General bank.

Excellent take on it (as always) in More or Less from the BBC. Well worth a listen: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p03fj84x

Vin

 

[SaintinSerbia]

OK - put it this way - when I bought my first house (in Wales) a derelict Railwayman's cottage for £50,000 the owner of the land was Prince Charles. The adjacent building site was being built on land formerly owned by Prince Charles. Every time a field is sold in Wales to put up a hundred houses it's sold to Prince Charles. Is he just selling the family silver in an onward downward spiral? of course not - his millions of acres of fields aren't making him any money. My point is that because someone has a house in London worth £500K means absolutely nothing against a man who can flog a few fields worth that every week (and owns half of Wales). The British gentry were so clever to give us yokels a bit here and there and avoided the peasant revolutions and rises of fascism and communism that the rest of Europe had a hundred years ago - and it's still working!

 

[tiggermaster]

So Mr Jeremy Hunt is now arguing that public opinion shouldn't deflect the government who have a mandate that was in their manifesto, never mind it was unfunded. This is clearly from the same 'Prime Minister' who said prior to the previous election and I quote, 'There will be no top down reorganisation of the NHS'. Then came Andrew Lansley's disastrous top down reorganisation. Mandates from pre election promises seem to be at best a moveable feast, at worst lies. The Junior Doctors are looking out for us. I've dealt with two junior doctors recently as I have very elderly parents (102 and 97), and both were distraught at what they perceived they were being driven to, but felt they had no choice. I truly believe this is a fight that goes to the heart of what for 65 years I have believed were given values in British Society. It used to be free health care and free education facilitating social mobility/advancement. Now it's just a dream some of us had. If our political system cannot underpin the benefits of promoting equality then even though I might disagree with Vin in terms of our political leanings I can entirely sympathise with his notion of reorganising how our 'democracy' is structured.... It even might give The Greens a chance, mind you Farage might be licking his lips.. I guess I'll just have to carry on drinking last years Damson Vodka...

 

[Piebacca]

The Conservatives must have destroyed the NHS at least a dozen times by now.

 

[TheSecondStain]

The Conservatives must have destroyed the NHS at least a dozen times by now.

And it keeps getting put back together again. Tbf, the Conservatives don't destroy the NHS. They chip away at it, in the name of efficiency. There's only so much efficiency one can reach before the quality of care starts to degrade as morale falls.

 

[Archers Road]

On Mrs Thatcher's watch, the Tories effectively removed dental and optical treatment from the NHS. Then they put the ancillary services out to tender, in the dogmatic belief that introducing an "internal market" would lead to improved efficiency (as well as creating an opportunity for investors to turn a profit). But even Mrs T didn't manage to oversea such a breakdown in trust between government and service providers that junior doctors felt they had no other option than to vote overwhelmingly to go on strike.

It's worth remembering that the conservatives opposed the introduction of the NHS in the first place. But don't worry, it's now safe in their hands (even though the current Health Secretary once co-authored a paper calling for it's complete privatisation).

 

[Piebacca]

Yep. They destroyed it twice in the last parliament.

Maggie Thatcher did it 7 times.

 

[TheSecondStain]

On Mrs Thatcher's watch, the Tories effectively removed dental and optical treatment from the NHS. Then they put the ancillary services out to tender, in the dogmatic belief that introducing an "internal market" would lead to improved efficiency (as well as creating an opportunity for investors to turn a profit). But even Mrs T didn't manage to oversea such a breakdown in trust between government and service providers that junior doctors felt they had no other option than to vote overwhelmingly to go on strike.

It's worth remembering that the conservatives opposed the introduction of the NHS in the first place. But don't worry, it's now safe in their hands (even though the current Health Secretary once co-authored a paper calling for it's complete privatisation).

Yep. They destroyed it twice in the last parliament.

Maggie Thatcher did it 7 times.

Well you guys seem to have kept a closer eye on these things than me then.

Tbf, I know professionals within the NHS who talk about Conservatives attempting to destroy the NHS in similar terms to you.