Off Topic Politics Thread

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Privileged Entitled Elite said:
Well, look who i being personal now…

Im not defending the system.

I can afford to send my children to private school, so if that is what I want, then I will. I dont see the issue with it being tax free, in so much as I already pay a ridiculous tax burden each year, and wont need my children going through the school system, therefore not using up my quota. So why cant people like me use the system.

Im not super rich, but i was pretty poor growing up and used that as one of my driving factors behind doing well as an adult by means of earnings. I had a ****e education, and didnt learn well in the state sstem, my learning style never does well in this system - yet you dont seem to want to cater for different educational needs which many people have.

You know nothing about me, yet assume I want to be ‘part of that world’ - twisted and deliberately biased view imo. Sending my children where I like is a personal choice, not me wanting to join some the illuminati.
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The issue is that the overwhelming majority of people are being left behind, you included, giving an unfair start in life to most people.

Like you I have done just fine for myself with a pretty dire state education, yet rather than just knowing it is a bit **** and trying to get away from it, I think more political capital should be directed towards improving the education for the many. Rather than those who escape relative poverty keeping the ladder just out of reach of everyone else.

If the tax revenue from adding VAT to private education goes in to the education budget to improve conditions for people then that would go some way to improving the current landscape. Your children would still get a top tier education but so would everyone elses who cannot afford it. Poor people want the best for their kids as well, as I am sure you prove testament too.

I also don't think you are a part of that world at all, I think you believe you are closer than you are. You have much more in common with the poorest than the richest.
 
I just want to point out that many of our negative attitudes towards teaching and education within the private system come from being educated in the 80s and 90s - before reforms came in and the education service became much more professional. For a good 15 years from the end of the 90s state education was on the up. The last 12 years or so it has started to slip, but there are still lots of incredible teachers in the system.

However, the attempt to damage the public’s view of state education is clearly an ideological one. The fact that Ofsted were instructed to move many schools down in rankings - and that hardly any Outstanding schools remain in many regions- should be enough for anyone to see that the tories want our public systems- all of them - to fail. They don’t believe in any socialist principles and only in greed. And head teachers and teachers are killing themselves as a result…
 
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EasyBreezer said:
The issue is that the overwhelming majority of people are being left behind, you included, giving an unfair start in life to most people.

Like you I have done just fine for myself with a pretty dire state education, yet rather than just knowing it is a bit **** and trying to get away from it, I think more political capital should be directed towards improving the education for the many. Rather than those who escape relative poverty keeping the ladder just out of reach of everyone else.

If the tax revenue from adding VAT to private education goes in to the education budget to improve conditions for people then that would go some way to improving the current landscape. Your children would still get a top tier education but so would everyone elses who cannot afford it. Poor people want the best for their kids as well, as I am sure you prove testament too.

I also don't think you are a part of that world at all, I think you believe you are closer than you are. You have much more in common with the poorest than the richest.
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Fair points and reasoned post, thank you.

I have zero interest in this world you talk of, I am a very private person, and have no interest in being part of anything. I dont relate to rich or poor, I really dont care, I live they way I see fit and have no interest in labels, that you and so many on here do.

Apologies I said what I said to you the other day about earning more money. I was genuinely shocked at the reaction I got, I asked a civil Q and didnt get a civil response from anyone (well, later I think Os did). I think generally people played the poster not the post.
 
Privileged Entitled Elite said:
Fair points and reasoned post, thank you.

I have zero interest in this world you talk of, I am a very private person, and have no interest in being part of anything. I dont relate to rich or poor, I really dont care, I live they way I see fit and have no interest in labels, that you and so many on here do.

Apologies I said what I said to you the other day about earning more money. I was genuinely shocked at the reaction I got, I asked a civil Q and didnt get a civil response from anyone (well, later I think Os did). I think generally people played the poster not the post.
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Understood regarding the labels and would probably agree, I am incredibly active politically and definitely get a buzz from it.

No worries at all - I enjoy the hot natured debate of this kind of thing as much as many on here!

I don't think people would disagree with your broader sentiment of wanting the best for themselves and their family. But the nature of this kind of thing often results in starting at our furthest differences and working in towards a more agreeable position.
 
......loading...... said:
I just want to point out that I have been misrepresented if I am the teacher Os is talking about. I actually said Private Schools are a con, not that state schools are bad. State schools are chronically underfunded- by successive Tory governments- as they send their children to private schools (which are ‘charitable’ and tax free).

This is the issue some of you are side-stepping. A two-tiered system may be somewhat inevitable, but we currently have a drastic disparity of opportunity between both. The rich are getting rich faster than ever and the poor are more stuck than any point since WW1.

The whole ‘well we made it so why can’t we send our kids to private school’ would be all well and good if the incoming nouveau riche upheld working class values AND SYMPATHY for those they left behind. This is not what happens. Absorbed into the elite, the old hatred of the ‘lazy’ and ‘drunken’ poor - propagated by the elite since at least the Victorian period - is quickly adopted by those lucky enough to make it.

Private education leads to snobbery, but more importantly it is the worst magnifier of social injustice that exists in our country. That 7% of people attend them, but over 50% of CEOs did and 93% of judges is a terrible indictment on our society. They should not exist. Just as the monarchy should not exist. We need to work on loving our neighbours and vowing to actually make education work for everyone.

One last thing. The reason state schools are bad is because the children in them see no hope of a better life. Their parents had bad / no jobs and so did their grandparents. Fix the country, give these kids hope, remove the symbols of class worship:.. and schools would get better.
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I feel your pain here and I agree with much of what you’ve said.

However I feel your anger is misdirected. You seem to hate the wealthy and blame them for the problems.

I have mentioned it on here a few times now, but I feel the problem is the broken money system.

You are 100% correct - we need a society that encourages and rewards people for creating businesses and being successful, whilst at the same time rewarding hard work.

The problem is the fact that money is created from thin air and distributed to those closest to the money printer. It leads to this massive wealth gap we are seeing.

The wealthy pay a massively disproportionate amount of tax. The problems you are talking about are caused by useless governments and not evil rich people in my opinion.

www.wtfhappenedin1971.com

The other thing you fail to consider is that human nature means people will ALWAYS favour friends and family. Which means even if you abolish private schools, you will still get a network effect of friends helping friends.
 
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Just seen the coronation thread has been closed, obviously itching to do that since it was put up. How strange to close the last thread to be posted, on only Wednesday. So I just had a look back over past threads to see how many had been closed. What a surprise, practically none, even match threads from the beginning of the season still open. And before you say, this one is off topic and it's run it's course, there's one from LTL posted on the 31st May 2022 and last commented on in June 2022 and still open. Wonder why this one is different? Pretty obvious really, rather just upholding the boards rules and regulations, personal / political beliefs dictate what can stay and what gets locked or removed.
 
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It's Only A Game said:
Just seen the coronation thread has been closed, obviously itching to do that since it was put up. How strange to close the last thread to be posted, on only Wednesday. So I just had a look back over past threads to see how many had been closed. What a surprise, practically none, even match threads from the beginning of the season still open. And before you say, this one is off topic and it's run it's course, there's one from LTL posted on the 31st May 2022 and last commented on in June 2022 and still open. Wonder why this one is different? Pretty obvious really, rather just upholding the boards rules and regulations, personal / political beliefs dictate what can stay and what gets locked or removed.
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Probably because I was boring the pants off everyone, sorry if true!
 
It's Only A Game said:
Just seen the coronation thread has been closed, obviously itching to do that since it was put up. How strange to close the last thread to be posted, on only Wednesday. So I just had a look back over past threads to see how many had been closed. What a surprise, practically none, even match threads from the beginning of the season still open. And before you say, this one is off topic and it's run it's course, there's one from LTL posted on the 31st May 2022 and last commented on in June 2022 and still open. Wonder why this one is different? Pretty obvious really, rather just upholding the boards rules and regulations, personal / political beliefs dictate what can stay and what gets locked or removed.
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It’s an outrage
 
It's Only A Game said:
Just seen the coronation thread has been closed, obviously itching to do that since it was put up. How strange to close the last thread to be posted, on only Wednesday. So I just had a look back over past threads to see how many had been closed. What a surprise, practically none, even match threads from the beginning of the season still open. And before you say, this one is off topic and it's run it's course, there's one from LTL posted on the 31st May 2022 and last commented on in June 2022 and still open. Wonder why this one is different? Pretty obvious really, rather just upholding the boards rules and regulations, personal / political beliefs dictate what can stay and what gets locked or removed.
Click to expand...

Well done for finding that. Good work.
 
......loading...... said:
I just want to point out that I have been misrepresented if I am the teacher Os is talking about. I actually said Private Schools are a con, not that state schools are bad. State schools are chronically underfunded- by successive Tory governments- as they send their children to private schools (which are ‘charitable’ and tax free).

This is the issue some of you are side-stepping. A two-tiered system may be somewhat inevitable, but we currently have a drastic disparity of opportunity between both. The rich are getting rich faster than ever and the poor are more stuck than any point since WW1.

The whole ‘well we made it so why can’t we send our kids to private school’ would be all well and good if the incoming nouveau riche upheld working class values AND SYMPATHY for those they left behind. This is not what happens. Absorbed into the elite, the old hatred of the ‘lazy’ and ‘drunken’ poor - propagated by the elite since at least the Victorian period - is quickly adopted by those lucky enough to make it.

Private education leads to snobbery, but more importantly it is the worst magnifier of social injustice that exists in our country. That 7% of people attend them, but over 50% of CEOs did and 93% of judges is a terrible indictment on our society. They should not exist. Just as the monarchy should not exist. We need to work on loving our neighbours and vowing to actually make education work for everyone.

One last thing. The reason state schools are bad is because the children in them see no hope of a better life. Their parents had bad / no jobs and so did their grandparents. Fix the country, give these kids hope, remove the symbols of class worship:.. and schools would get better.
Click to expand...
Doesn't Finland have the highest educational standards, and what percentage of Finns are privately educated?
 
......loading...... said:
I just want to point out that many of our negative attitudes towards teaching and education within the private system come from being educated in the 80s and 90s - before reforms came in and the education service became much more professional. For a good 15 years from the end of the 90s state education was on the up. The last 12 years or so it has started to slip, but there are still lots of incredible teachers in the system.

However, the attempt to damage the public’s view of state education is clearly an ideological one. The fact that Ofsted were instructed to move many schools down in rankings - and that hardly any Outstanding schools remain in many regions- should be enough for anyone to see that the tories want our public systems- all of them - to fail. They don’t believe in any socialist principles and only in greed. And head teachers and teachers are killing themselves as a result…
Click to expand...
I have been out of the education system for quite a few years now, but back in the day, teachers studied for a three year certificate and for a Bachelor of Education over four years! I am not sure this kind of training exists any more and teachers are fast tracked into the procession. And if certain statistics are to be believed, fast track out of it within a few years. If.this is so, it is no surprise that state education is struggling!
 
It's Only A Game said:
You're not asked to do much in your job as moderator, being unbiased is the least the posters should expect. If that's too much for you, maybe you should consider retirement.
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Being unbiased is not, and never has been, a requirement of a moderator. You’re quite welcome to disagree with any of my views, and I am of yours.
 
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ChilcoSaint said:
Being unbiased is not, and never has been, a requirement of a moderator. You’re quite welcome to disagree with any of my views, and I am of yours.
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Your views are not the problem but allowing them to influence your decision making as a moderator is.
 
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