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I’ve got family who are going though this very thing, if you knew the absolute crap and stress that family are going through you wouldn’t say this kind of thing.
Most of what you say is ignorant as **** (probably some deep seated fears you have), but at the end of the day sport is about providing a fair playing field for athletes to compete on and I just don’t think it will be fair to women who to compete against another women who is physically stronger because of going through puberty.
I have long intense discussions, about all kinds of issues, with my son who's a radical church going Christian amongst many other things. We disagree on various issues which is a good thing because we'll always carefully consider the opposing point of view.
One concept we've come to agree on is that life isn't fair and no one ever said it should be because it can't be.
If you're 'born into the wrong body' in a1700's Australian transit camp, for criminals, deported from England that wasn't fair. But you'd crack on, because you had to, and make the best life you could. There were no hormone replacement courses, no series of operations or a variety of wigs to choose from.
If you're 'born into the wrong body' in 2022 England you can be a hero, pump the NHS for treatment and pump them again if you decide you want to switch back.
Sorry, I don't go along with all that.
I was born in a shytehole pit house, fostered when my parents couldn't cope with another mouth to feed and dressed in hand-me-downs or charity from the Salvation Army. I had the happiest childhood you could imagine because we just accepted that's how things were.
We made the best of the cards we were dealt and played them as best we could. We didn't settle for what we had but we didn't whine about what we hadn't.
Sometimes you just have to accept that life isn't fair. Not because you're being deprived of your human rights or being persecuted ... just that it's how life can be.
Children, every day, are born with defects, Downs syndrome, Autism, Tourettes, and a million other conditions that may never be cured. They just accept their situation and get on with life. Why can't men who'd rather be a girl, girls who'd rather be men or gays who'd rather be straight just get a grip and get on with their lives.
Yeah, life isn't fair, too bad.
One concept we've come to agree on is that life isn't fair and no one ever said it should be because it can't be.
If you're 'born into the wrong body' in a1700's Australian transit camp, for criminals, deported from England that wasn't fair. But you'd crack on, because you had to, and make the best life you could. There were no hormone replacement courses, no series of operations or a variety of wigs to choose from.
If you're 'born into the wrong body' in 2022 England you can be a hero, pump the NHS for treatment and pump them again if you decide you want to switch back.
Sorry, I don't go along with all that.
I was born in a shytehole pit house, fostered when my parents couldn't cope with another mouth to feed and dressed in hand-me-downs or charity from the Salvation Army. I had the happiest childhood you could imagine because we just accepted that's how things were.
We made the best of the cards we were dealt and played them as best we could. We didn't settle for what we had but we didn't whine about what we hadn't.
Sometimes you just have to accept that life isn't fair. Not because you're being deprived of your human rights or being persecuted ... just that it's how life can be.
Children, every day, are born with defects, Downs syndrome, Autism, Tourettes, and a million other conditions that may never be cured. They just accept their situation and get on with life. Why can't men who'd rather be a girl, girls who'd rather be men or gays who'd rather be straight just get a grip and get on with their lives.
Yeah, life isn't fair, too bad.
I get where ya coming from and it’s hard for some generations to come to terms with this stuff, and “getting a grip” is a nice easy way to deal with it but you just have to these days.
a person doesn’t have to live their entire life a lie. I bloody love this age for that.
a suicidal teenager who’s known for a good few years that they don’t feel right as their born gender luckily doesn’t have to just be told to “get a grip”. They can start to tackle this now and do something about it.
I’m very close to this in my family and I’m very much behind them as ya can see.
We probably won’t agree on the core of this subject but ya right life isn’t fair, and it’s up to you to bloody balance the fecker as much as you can until you are happy as you can be and not just settle.
I don't want anyone to live a lie mate.
But if I'm born a midget and never get more than a yard high that's just too bad.
You can't just demand medical science sorts it out at every turn.
As a midget I'd rather money was put into kids dying of cancer.
I just think its selfish to want money to be spent on changing men into women who may decide, at some later date, that they'd quite like to change back.
As I said in my rant,
We made the best of the cards we were dealt and played them as best we could. We didn't settle for what we had but we didn't whine about what we hadn't.
Born x in a y body just doesn't really pass muster for me.
If you're y, you're born y.
You can do just whatever the hell you want with that. Wear a skirt, wear trousers, shag men, shag women, shag men, women and goats. Y
ou can even get a sex change if that's something you want. Ans that's your right.
But born x in a y body is just indulgent waffle born of what we think a man and a woman should be and how they should act. It's ridiculous.
If you're y, you're born y.
You can do just whatever the hell you want with that. Wear a skirt, wear trousers, shag men, shag women, shag men, women and goats. Y
ou can even get a sex change if that's something you want. Ans that's your right.
But born x in a y body is just indulgent waffle born of what we think a man and a woman should be and how they should act. It's ridiculous.
Not getting into long drawn out on the subject, but if trans want to participate in sports just set up your own Olympics, football league, etc, and get on with your own way of living just as every other person rather than pressurising other to sort it out for you.
We have two at the golf club and that exactly what they have done. Both men are now playing as women and been excepted as golf becomes a level playing field with the handicap system, what the ladies don't like is sharing the changing room with them, my wife included.
We have two at the golf club and that exactly what they have done. Both men are now playing as women and been excepted as golf becomes a level playing field with the handicap system, what the ladies don't like is sharing the changing room with them, my wife included.
I haven’t got a clue what the right and wrong is in relation to sport and would hate to make that decision but I really hope we can find a way that adds to their happiness. Too many posts feel disrespectful and make trans people out to be weirdo’s. Whether it’s genetics, mental health, neurodivergence, inequality, sexuality whatever, that drives people into this movement it is what it is and we shouldn’t see people as annoying weirdo’s. I think this decision they made probably would have been mine but it’s important we find a way to let trans people feel like they belong in sport. I have a son 23 with autism, bi sexual who struggles with belonging and he thinks sports clubs are places he’d get judged and bullied. I just want him to stay physically fit and the knock on effects of being mentally well. He shouldn’t think going for a walk or a bike ride on his own is his only option.
So you don’t think they should be inclusive ? I understand the privacy issue but forcing ‘trans only’ and ‘trans free’ sports clubs would be illegal under the equality act and rightly so. Exclude a bunch of people from participation in the world instead of changing the bogs?
Read my post again, we have included trans at our golf club, that has work out okay other than some ladies do not like some of there antic in the changing room.
I have not mentioned inclusiveness as that is down to the individual, or organisations whether they except or not.
Lastly cannot the say, Olympic movement include trans within the Olympics, not a decision l as an individual can make sadly.
An Olympic athlete will have taken a decade to get to the standard where they can qualify ...
... after all that training and dedication it's clearly unfair is someone twice your size waltzes in and smashes qualification.
It's not just those they'd compete against, it's those they prevent from going.
Most sportspeople miss out on going to the Olympics, if a few transgenders miss out it's really not that big a deal.
What l was trying to alude too was, they could have their own games either within the umbrella of the Olympic movement or their own Olympics like the disabled athletes have.
It's not my decision to make, way above my pay grade or intellect.
Tennis is a primer example. I’m good friends with a lass who is a member of a tennis club in Surrey. They often have pro players there. She was chatting to the make rank 200 once and he said he regular plays against the women and, with the exception of the Williams sisters, he’d smash any rank easily. Mostly without losing more than 1 or 2 games.
I think organisations are making the right decision while they formulate some kind of policy here. Ultimately the risk is losing entire generations of biologically female athletes because all the training and dedication can be undone by someone who's been a man for a decade or more rocking up and smashing them due to the massive biological advantage they've had.
P
Prehab26
Guest
In reference to sport at all levels, fairness and safety simply trump's inclusion.
As it should.
As it should.
As a child, growing up in a Durham pit village, we were denied the right to compete in equestrian events ...
... 'cos we could never catch the pit ponies when they came up for a break
... 'cos we could never catch the pit ponies when they came up for a break
It common sense and is good it's getting established early. Its not a wild leap to suggest it could have lead to things like increased steroid use or at least the temptation by biological women trying to compete.
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I agree with all of that, it mirrors my own experiences of life. But I have some discomfort about the the bit I have highlighted.
If you are asking the question WHY, I supose their answer might be because they can.
Medical Science is, it seems to me, something of a two edged sword.
It has allowed billions to live who might previously have died.
But those same advances have made it possible to mess around with our very beings.
And this makes me, you and many others, very uncomfortable.
I suspect that our Great Grandchildren will accept all of this without any problem.