An inside forward is probably how he would be described for most of his career we didn't have strikers as such, or at least we didn't use the term. The norm, in fact the only way we set up was 5 forwards, 3 half backs amd 2 full backs. Teams of course, ,like they do now, do not always play in their starting formation. I think it's true to say that the great Dutch side of Cruyff and Neeskens really broke the mold although managers like Alf Ramsey and his wingless wonders always tried new formations.
International Stuff
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An inside forward is probably how he would be described for most of his career we didn't have strikers as such, or at least we didn't use the term. The norm, in fact the only way we set up was 5 forwards, 3 half backs amd 2 full backs. Teams of course, ,like they do now, do not always play in their starting formation. I think it's true to say that the great Dutch side of Cruyff and Neeskens really broke the mold although managers like Alf Ramsey and his wingless wonders always tried new formations.
The thing that gets me is that, to be blunt, there's some far more impressive goalscoring records in international football when you look at the context
Roberto Carlos scored 11 goals in 125 internationals, despite being a left back
Sinisa Mihaijlovic scored 10 goals in 61 internationals, despite being a centre back
rafael Marquez scored 15 goals in 127 internationals, despite being a centre back
Ronald Koeman scored 14 goals in 78 internationals, mostly played as a sweeper
Lothar Matthaus scored 23 goals in 150 internationals, mostly played as a sweeper
Jose Luis Chilavert scored 8 goals in 74 internationals, despite being a goalkeeper
Some of the stats on that list are more impressive when you consider the opposition: three of Chilavert's goals were against Argentina, Matthaus scored against the Italy and Holland, while Koeman scored against West Germany (twice) and England.
Roberto Carlos scored 11 goals in 125 internationals, despite being a left back
Sinisa Mihaijlovic scored 10 goals in 61 internationals, despite being a centre back
rafael Marquez scored 15 goals in 127 internationals, despite being a centre back
Ronald Koeman scored 14 goals in 78 internationals, mostly played as a sweeper
Lothar Matthaus scored 23 goals in 150 internationals, mostly played as a sweeper
Jose Luis Chilavert scored 8 goals in 74 internationals, despite being a goalkeeper
Some of the stats on that list are more impressive when you consider the opposition: three of Chilavert's goals were against Argentina, Matthaus scored against the Italy and Holland, while Koeman scored against West Germany (twice) and England.
It is a great achievement for various reasons. 50 goals too is a huge number. Few have surpassed that - only Villa from Spain, only Klose and Muller from Germany, only Henry from France (who he'll pass soon), only Batistuta from Argentina, nobody from Holland or Italy... and only 3 Brazilians (Pele, Ronaldo, Romario).
If it was as easy as just turning up as some are suggesting, then Sir Bobby's record wouldn't have stood for so long (45 years!!). Whether he's better or worse than Charlton or Lineker is an impossible comparison to make. They played in different eras, with different teammates, against different opposition, in different formations and - perhaps most significantly- in different positions.
And Rooney now has career 300 goals at 29 and will pass the overall scoring records of both Charlton and Lineker soon. He probably passed Lineker's assists record when he was about 19 (not that those stats were recorded in the same way).
Pretty sure there's more than just those players. Robbie Keane and Cristiano Ronaldo have scored more international goals than Rooney haven't they?
@lennypops 1)" There is only one reason in this world to question Peter Crouch's footballing ability - he looks funny. For the majority of his career he was someone who would improve literally any BPL team outside the top four and, frankly even one or two of them from time to time. He certainly wasn't a bad signing for us and has been a superb performer for England - absolutely no question."
Can't let that passIt's not about him looking funny lenny it's about his often poor ball control and the effect he causes in a team that simply start playing long balls to him.
You and I won't agree on this because our views are polar opposite. I expect Peter is a very nice guy and full marks to him for effort he never shirks or hides away (difficult) but I wouldn't have him anywhere near any team I picked because of the long ball syndrome I'm sure Graham Taylor loves him.
Poor ball control? I'm pretty sure the most used phrase when talking about Crouch was "lanky giant" but the second was almost certainly "good touch for a big man"
Here's the list. He's got a long way to go to catch with Ali Daei
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_footballers_with_50_or_more_international_goals
I think Lidls is just picking specific countries. Those countries probably have actual competition for places, though.
Keane's played for absolutely ages and has outscored Rooney by quite a bit. Ronaldo's up to 55 now, having been in a similar, unchallenged position.
Actually when you think about it this particular statistic (Goals Scored) just adds to the tendency to celebrate goalscorers to the exclusion of other team members who play an equal part. It's cheap glory and tbh I don't take it as a matter of great importance. We can celebrate great players like Greaves and Moore without the need of skewed figures. Gordon Banks for example was at least as important as Charlton to the team yet we don't have a shots saved list. Even if we did as others have pointed out there are goals and there are goals. Penalties are included in these figures and add to the faux glory. The reality of Rooney being the top England goalscorer of all time when in truth he has had a pretty indifferent England career just underlines my point.
I have seen Crouch play at Priestfield for 3 different sides QPR, Portsmouth and Norwich and the most frequently used phrase on those occasions were the shouts of 'Freek; everytime he touched the ball! He was however on all 3 occasions the best player on the pitch by some distance (this was in the championship)
Maybe I am being a little unfair to Crouch because I suppose he has to often deal with ariel balls, which are more difficult to control than ground hugging balls. however my main gripe of him being the cause of bypassing, often high quality, midfielders stands
And I will not be moved
And I will not be moved
Maybe I am being a little unfair to Crouch because I suppose he has to often deal with ariel balls, which are more difficult to control than ground hugging balls. however my main gripe of him being the cause of bypassing, often high quality, midfielders stands
And I will not be moved
That is the passer's or the manager's fault, not Crouchie's.
Gerd Muller - "Der Bomber" , for those who remember him. 68 scored in 62 games for West Germany!..
That's not a criticism of Crouch though, it's a criticism of ****ty, lazy teammates.Maybe I am being a little unfair to Crouch because I suppose he has to often deal with ariel balls, which are more difficult to control than ground hugging balls. however my main gripe of him being the cause of bypassing, often high quality, midfielders stands
And I will not be moved
I always like the Crouch/Defoe partnership, as I thought that it had something that's often overlooked in teams nowdays: balance.
The best ways to deal with one actually open you up to the strengths of the other.
I wonder how much time they shared on the pitch together for England? Little or none, at a guess.
Another overlooked thing, which often happens in international teams, unfortunately. Players having time together regularly.
Remember the George Graham defence at Arsenal? Why wasn't it picked for England?
Robbie Keane's only one goal behind him. He's only played about 80 more games, too!
Oh blimey let's not upset the Crouch fan club LOL
I an not blaming Crouch for being such an obvious target. I just don't want one. AS Clough said "If God had wanted us to play football in the clouds, he'd have put grass up there"
I remember Muller - an amazing goal scorer and alongside that international record he scored 398 goals in 453 matches for Bayern Munich which included 66 in 74 European matches when for the first time Bayern were the best in Europe, now that's a goal scoring record few can compete with!NowsufferinginSpain said:
