In The Hole?
- Thread starter Dr.Stanley O'Google, HCFC
- Start date
Agreed - against Ipswich/Peterboro(?) he seemed to be able to handle the job.
We're in something brown and sticky that's fallen out of Nigel Pearson's hole. Does that count?
As you're not the first person to say that this week, Reading? (the location, not the activity)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/paulfletcher/2012/03/roberts_revels_in_readings_ris.html#305070
that article I've linked to said:
this week has shown just how reliant we are on koren, 4-4-2 was ****e without him 2nd half v saints, so was today...only guy who can make something happen im afraid.
Without Koren and two good forwards and wingers who get to the byline we really don't have the side to play 4-4-2. Nicky B won't change formation.
Spot on. The problem we have is we will need to change some personnel to do it. Mckenna isnt mobile or strong enough for 4-4-2. Thats why the 4-2-3-1 worked not only for Koren but for him and Evans too. As neither are dominant enough in the vein of Ash, Derry or Trotter at Millwall
Phil Buckingham has tweeted that the team look tired and have run out of steam. Does anyone who was at the game agree with that? How did Cullen play when he came on.
i dont agree with that really, cairney, king, brady, fryatt, mclean etc have all had plenty of time on the bench..
reality is koren has probably been involved in 75% of our goals, with either direct or indirect assists, and without him we look slow, predictable and hate to say it but very average..
cullen didnt do much, either wrong or right as our defence had the ball for most of the last half hour and it was hardly anywhere near our box, when it did get up there it usually got crossed out of play or into the keepers arms..
if the squad are tired, then its up to be barmby to be a litlte bit cuter in his selection as one of his favourite sayings goes...olifinjana/garcia/simpson are all there to be used.
I wouldn't say we looked tired today, we just had acres of space to run into and draw a man but insisted on going sideways. Evans and Cairney didn't play well at all, we need to look at someone like Brady to play in that hole. There was not enough movement, but Fryatt and the wingers looked so isolated. It is ridiculous how much we missed Koren.
I don't entirely agree. I don't think the problems we'd have with 442 are any different to the problems we currently have. Based on previous promotions 442 works best when you've got one tackler, and a box to box midfielder who'll get stuck in as well, while the other 4 of the front 6 are told to do what ever they want.
In D3 Ash had Keates alongside him most games. In L1 he had either Green or Lewis alongside him. Our two best midfield lineups that season were Green, Ashbee, Lewis, Elliott, or France/Price, Green, Ashbee, Holt (I don't have the figures but about this time that year I was arguing wih someone about why Green should go out wide rrather than in the middle and got carried away trying to prove it). That first one won't be a surprise, but even with Elliott's form that season, the results were better with Holt there offering more steel in the midfield than they were with Elliott there getting almost a goal a game. Then in the Championship we had Ashbee alonside Marney more often than anyone else. When Okocha played in the middle it helped that Pedersen could play defence as well so could tackle, or Hughes was naturally a central midfielder so he crowded out the opposition a bit when we defended.
With us we can manage the midfield just as easily. McKenna clearly holds, then either Evans plays the Marney/Keates role and we give the wingers and two strikers total freedom. Or Koren playes in the middle with Dudgeon playing wide. Koren gets more freedom with Dudgeon having more responsibility to defend.
The problems with that are that Evans doesn't get forward enough, and once the wingers get a cross in they're still trying to pick out players miles shorter than the defenders marking them. The only difference is we'll have two strikers on the pitch that can't get on the end of a cross instead of one. If we solved those problems then we wouldn't need to change formation anyway.
EDIT: No I can't explain the Lewis as a box to box midfielder thing. He was definitely in more of a sitting role than an attacking role though so I counted him as having defensive duties even though I couldn't work out what they were, and that's how we got results (that was also better than having Green and Ashbee and two wingers)
Ash did a lot more than just defend. Mckenna doesnt hold he plays as a centre half in front of Chester and Hobbs and never gets forward. Evans may have an engine but he isnt really a midfield player he s more of a defender.
There's two key problems, i rate Mckenna highly but not as highly as i did Ashbee, i think Ashbee offered a more all round game. I hate to say it but neither Evans nor Cairney are good enough to play in a 4-4-2, they don't offer enough going forward. If we had Koren in that system like he played for WBA then maybe. I think our wingers can't really defend and thats an issue, however Brady does give you an outlet.
However that does leave us with the fact we still only have two players who actually score goals.
Ashbee also did a lot of just sitting in front of the defence protecting them, the majority of his forward play was in that D3 season because Keates was just as capable of snapping a player or two so they could take turns in going forwards. After that he sat more because his partners were less able to do that side of things and it was vital someone did if the attacking players were going to have the freedom they did.
Evans plays on the wing at international level doesn't he?
EDIT: I'm not saying McKenna is as good as Ashbee in the role, I'm saying he can play the role to an acceptable standard and it's the other positions we have the deficiencies in.
Christ i thought Evans was touted as a CB and RB!! I think he is just a tidy neat player whop does the Man U drills well but there is no inspiration in him.
Yes Ash did sit, but he also drove the team forward and set the tone for the team. Mckenna cant play further forward like Ash could and did, he isnt physical enough. He also chipped in with i think 4 goals in the promotion season. Dangerous at corners too.
The CM role is vital, Mckenna is a neat tidy player who doesnt inspire or drive forward. Watch him when we attack he is on the halfway line.
As DJ said 5 mins to go and he is passing back to the back four not pushing forward.