General Election 4th July ...

[Disco down under]

So would you agree, if the working classes of England didn't benefit and were mostly used as fodder, they are also victims of the empire? And if mass immigration is to be viewed as a byproduct of the empire and the working class English oppose it, they're essentially being double-whammied?

There is hell to pay like.

I'd generally reserve the term victim for those who were colonised but as you are pushing for an answer, yes, I'm sure there were lots of British victims of the British empire just as there were many American victims in the Vietnam war and German victims in World War II. War is rarely neat.

I also try not to use the term double-whammied but that's a whole different thing.

And it's for the people who dislike immigration to decide, not me, but I would definitely suggest they think twice next time they sing Rule Brittania and puff their chests out. The thing they love almost certainly fuels the thing they hate.

 

[Disco down under]

. It wasn't connected with people living in the British Isles until about the 17th century. People got all excited about it during the 18th century Celtic revival movement (Welsh separatism etc).

That is the first I have ever heard of that!

 

[alcoauth]

I'd generally reserve the term victim for those who were colonised but as you are pushing for an answer, yes, I'm sure there were lots of British victims of the British empire just as there were many American victims in the Vietnam war and German victims in World War II. War is rarely neat.

I also try not to use the term double-whammied but that's a whole different thing.

And it's for the people who dislike immigration to decide, not me, but I would definitely suggest they think twice next time they sing Rule Brittania and puff their chests out. The thing they love almost certainly fuels the thing they hate.

I think my point has landed.

English is an ethnicity, everybody has an ethnicity, if people want a sensible conversation about the deconstruction of ethnic groups, we can start in alphabetical order, otherwise it's just actual racist animus from the usual suspects.

 

[alcoauth]

There's a great Emo band called Saves The Day, you guys should check them out.

Anyway, carry on.

 

[The Norton Cat]

That is the first I have ever heard of that!

It was another one of those things that was sparked by increasing interest in nationalism at around that time.

 

[Neil]

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I don't think Wikipedia is the best of references. It's getting better, but it's hardly authoritative

 

[Disco down under]

I think my point has landed.

English is an ethnicity, everybody has an ethnicity, if people want a sensible conversation about the deconstruction of ethnic groups, we can start in alphabetical order, otherwise it's just actual racist animus from the usual suspects.

I'm afraid you've made a connection to your point that I can't see and you've entirely lost me there.

I don’t, won't, and have never used English as my ethnicity. I use it as geographical indicator and an informal nationality that sits beneath British.

 

[alcoauth]

I don't think Wikipedia is the best of references. It's getting better, but it's hardly authoritative

That's funny because I'd argue it's getting worse.

 

[alcoauth]

I'm afraid you've made a connection to your point that I can't see and you've entirely lost me there.

I don’t, won't, and have never used English as my ethnicity. I use it as geographical indicator and an informal nationality that sits beneath British.

What is your ethnicity?

 

[Disco down under]

What is your ethnicity?

As I said earlier.

I just write white on forms, I've never written English. No one has told me I'm wrong and to my knowledge it has never caused any one any offence.

But this ethnicity/race conversation is starting to sound similar to the sex/gender debate and that is a rabbit hole that goes deep and dark and I am happy to be blissful in my ignorance of it.

 

[alcoauth]

As I said earlier.

I just write white on forms, I've never written English. No one has told me I'm wrong and to my knowledge it has never caused any one any offence.

But this ethnicity/race conversation is starting to sound similar to the sex/gender debate and that is a rabbit hole that goes deep and dark and I am happy to be blissful in my ignorance of it.

No, I'm not asking what your race is, if you're black or white etc I'm asking what is your ethnicity (ethnic group) is?

It's not a trick question.

 

[The Norton Cat]

No, I'm not asking what your race is, if you're black or white etc I'm asking what is your ethnicity (ethnic group) is?

It's not a trick question.

How are you defining ethnicity?

 

[sheepman]

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[Montysoptician]

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[Disco down under]

No, I'm not asking what your race is, if you're black or white etc I'm asking what is your ethnicity (ethnic group) is?

It's not a trick question.

I haven't done a DNA test and don't know/don't particularly care to find out what my ancestry is so my ethnicity is, I guess, either unknown or not applicable.

 

[alcoauth]

I haven't done a DNA test and don't know/don't particularly care to find out what my ancestry is so my ethnicity is, I guess, either unknown or not applicable.

Do you accept that if someone dug up your bones in 200 years time and used autosomal genealogical testing they could determine which ethnic group you belong to?

 

[Disco down under]

Do you accept that if someone dug up your bones in 200 years time and used autosomal genealogical testing they could determine which ethnic group you belong to?

I would think I would belong to several.

 

[alcoauth]

I would think I would belong to several.

Okay mate, I think I've ran out of things to say on this topic.

 

[The Norton Cat]

Do you accept that if someone dug up your bones in 200 years time and used autosomal genealogical testing they could determine which ethnic group you belong to?

Genetic testing can't identify your ethnicity. Ethnicity is a set of shared cultural and social characteristics that include language, religion, beliefs, customs, history, mythology, clothing, amongst other things. There is often an overlap with ancestry/genetics but ethnicity is not necessarily defined by it. There are various agencies through which individuals can change ethnic groups. Some anthropologists and social scientists regard ethnicity as a product of specific kinds of inter-group interactions, rather than an essential quality inherent to human groups.

 

[alcoauth]

Genetic testing can't identify your ethnicity. Ethnicity is a set of shared cultural and social characteristics that include language, religion, beliefs, customs, history, mythology, clothing, amongst other things. There is often an overlap with ancestry/genetics but ethnicity is not necessarily defined by it. There are various agencies through which individuals can change ethnic groups. Some anthropologists and social scientists regard ethnicity as a product of specific kinds of inter-group interactions, rather than an essential quality inherent to human groups.

Left wing wibble.