It doesn't matter how many votes the leave campaign got. The remain campaign is right
Off Topic EU deabte. Which way are you voting ?
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I understand their concern, but democracy has spoken and they lost, if they had won, I would have accepted it
But your telling everyone to accept it - basically to follow that logic then - after the last campaign then all other parties should have stopped campaigning and just accepted Tory ideology because they 'won'. There should have been no disagreements because the Tory's 'won'. In the same way that Leave 'won' so there can be no disagreements afterwards.
Sorry democracy doesn't work like that - we need to campaign to minimise the damage and negatives.
No i think that some Remainers are just terrified of the consequences and pissed off that all of the sweeping promises made have all been broken within 72 hours of the referendum!
Sir Nigel, actually gave a speech (thinking leave had lost) saying exactly the same thing. I would have done the same. I believe in democracy
Is it his principles or a concerted effort by his opponents and the well oiled machine of the media that will never see his party elected.
Don't get me wrong, I think he has perhaps gone too far left at times, even if not on policy, certainly in his tone and delivery. But I'm also a great believer that if you have the courage of your convictions you find a way of getting into power without jettisoning them.
Tbh the more I get into this the more undecided I am about Corbyn's situation. On the one hand I want a Labour party that turns its back on austerity for the most vulnerable and poorest in society, but at the same time everything in the real life political
world tells me his position is untenable. It really is a hard one.
What confounds things even further is there really is **** all other viable candidate.
Who said all the 350M would go to the NHS, I thought only some of it would?
But if the Inners had not come out with the bullshit WW3 would start and an emergency budget etc, you would have won.
Just dissolve the Labour party. It's ****
Just dissolve the Labour party. It's ****
Thats happening, I see 2 labour type parties starting
That's how the vast majority of the people in the country behave. But the shouty people don't accept that. They will keep shouting and demand more elections in the hope that they will win one eventually.
It's funny in Scotland. The SNP say it's not fair because a majority of people in Scotland voted for the UK to remain in the UK. Somehow the SNP translates that to mean that Scotland voted to remain in the EU. They didn't - they voted for the UK to remain in the EU but they lost.
When Sturgeon is asked whether that means they want another referendum on Scottish independence she back tracks and says that she will ask for that when the time is right. She knows that the Scottish people are worried about who will pay their bills if the rest of the English don't. The EU is never going to accept Scotland into the EU until they can support themselves.
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The problem with his argument is that working class people also voted to remain. Nobody in this 'debate' holds the "working class" card.
I don't know I'm sure I saw it somewhere, maybe on a train somewhere... or was it on a bus?
I never said people shouldn't have stopped discussing issues. I think they shouldn't demand a rerun of elections because they dont like the result. It's the politics of the madhouse to just keep having elections or referendums because one side doesn't like the result.
I still don't see why if Labour loses an election means all Labour supporters should become Tories. What I was saying was that if you lose a vote the default position should not be to demand another vote.
It certainly wasn't the government.
And it's the government who will make that decision once we leave the EU.
This pic
It does not say 350M to the NHS
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I don't remember all of the non-conservative voters on the streets campaigning for another election. Or did I miss that?
I don't think they'd elect him if he was stuck in a giant nutshell no!
But yes I do think he'd win an election - certainly the only Labour candidate who has a chance. My only issue is that no leader has been elected in the last 30 years without the backing of Murdoch and the main papers and they are all staunchly right wing/neo-liberal. So there's only two ways around it 1) accept that the Tories are going to win and have an even worse version of the 80s. I say this as its been proved that when Labour go right wing to appeal to the press/Tory supporters they lose huge numbers of their core support (see Scotland - lost 40 out of 41 seats, Wales have lost a large number of seats to UKIP and Plaid and Tories), also why vote for Tory-lite when you can have the real thing by voting Tory? So this plan didn't work in 2010 and 2015, in fact it was disastrous!
The only other way I see around it is with a strong, democratic, grassroots movement - ala Bernie Sanders and Podemos which will inspire the populace and drive home a strong anti-austerity message. It's already working for corbyn. Unheard numbers of people are flocking to the Labour party and joining the membership - 360k at last count. He's got the backing of the unions and other left parties. There is talks of the SNP, Plaid, Greens, SWP and others including even the Lib Dems uniting behind him to form a sort of coalition. There's massive rallies across the country in support of him (see Momentum) which is unheard of in levels of support for a leader - usually they get booed.
So in short (but not in a nutshell) I do think he can get elected.
Aye, he has certainly struck a chord with very many. I appreciate your reply and humour, I will watch things develop with interest. I will be astonished if Corbyn is ever Prime Minister, but I certainly wouldn't rule out a mini-me in the future. I will admit to finding him a fascinating and intellectually challenging person, although I admit to needing to give him more focus. I will.
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