Off Topic BREXIT

[brownbagtiger]

Yes this is True.
Should it be the case though.
We have Bi elections locally

AS I remember, the last attempt at getting people to agree to electoral reform failed quite badly, so good luck trying to get that through given the current mess that's now got to be addressed.

 

[Edelman]

But, unless you're from their constituency, not one you voted for.

If Cameron had pegged it during the last government Clegg would have become PM.

Yes i know but should this be the case ??

 

[Chazz Rheinhold]

It's an opinion, if you don't like it then don't agree, simple as. There's no lack of awareness at all, I simply made an observation based on what I saw in front of me and invited others to do the same to see if it matches up. Look it up for youself, most of the brexit people interveiwed on Tv were working class, middle aged people. That doesn't mean everybody who voted out falls into that category, nor does it mean everybody in that category voted out, it just seems strange that everybody I've seen interviewed for the out campaign is clearly working class from a working class town. Those that voted in that I've seen seem to be professionals such as teachers, doctors, surveyors etc.

I can only go on what I've seen, if you think I was making a sweeping generalisation then fine, that's how you've taken it, that isn't my problem. I don't need telling whether or not my opinion needs defending, that's up to you. However, if you think I'm arrogant enough to assume the country is simply split into two demographics, then you need to have a think.

Trying to influence the situation? controlling it polarising things.

 

[City Man]

I voted remain but I'm getting a little fed up with seeing all of the sanctimonious whining from some of my remain comrades online, particularly young people. I'm worried about leaving the Tories to run everything in the short term

Seen similar sentiments expressed in general by Remain voters.
Why would anyone trust foreigners to run our affairs in our interest better than Britons?
The lack of self-belief and self-loathing in the Remain camp is startling.

 

[Edelman]

So, a left win eurosceptic heads a campaign to keep us governed by capitalists, while the right wing here oppose him.

After a democratic vote, we choose to separate from the capitalists, but those that supported the left wing guy, want a fascist stype selection system because they've heard right wing views on telly, but ignore other comments from people that voted to stop a man that ouldn't be a leader becoming one , even though that left us ruled by unelected capitalists that we can't vote out.

Maybe all decisions should be by coin toss.

I'll have an icecream cone with raspberry syrup on but hold the raspberry syrup.

 

[Old Tige]

That's called Communism and it has aready been tried and tested and shown to be total bollocks.

You don't know what you are talking about.

If you think you do, why not tell me where you think it has been tried and shown to be bollocks?

I was describing direct democracy.. It has rarely been tried in practice primarily as the established powers fear it so mutch. Whenever it has been established, it is promptly stamped upon by state powers who fear their own populations realising that they don't need to tolerate the dictatorship of an exploitative state governed by a self serving elite. .

See Spain 1936 when the establishment of no state, direct democracy resulted in improvements in many aspects of life for the population before it was wiped out by the totalitarianism of Franco. Ably assisted by the Nazis while the rest of the so called democracies of Europe turned a blind eye to the slaughter.

 

[Fez]

Try that in English and I'll give it another go.

Seriously? I posted it off my phone and in a poor place but the gist is easily taken. Have you got exclusive insight to what any negotiated restrictions will be?

 

[Fez]

No, I think there's nobody with any plan at all as everyone thought Remain would win and now we'll get Boris taking over and he was just having a laugh, he didn't actually want to win the ****ing thing.

Again, seriously? You think Boris did not want to win? Let's see what happens.

 

[Barchullona]

You don't know what you are talking about.

If you think you do, why not tell me where you think it has been tried and shown to be bollocks?

I was describing direct democracy.. It has rarely been tried in practice primarily as the established powers fear it so mutch. Whenever it has been established, it is promptly stamped upon by state powers who fear their own populations realising that they don't need to tolerate the dictatorship of an exploitative state governed by a self serving elite. .

See Spain 1936 when the establishment of no state, direct democracy resulted in improvements in many aspects of life for the population before it was wiped out by the totalitarianism of Franco. Ably assisted by the Nazis while the rest of the so called democracies of Europe turned a blind eye to the slaughter.

Which party was in charge in the USSR, China, Cambodia...

Awaits the usual, ah but that wasn't communism cop out. It is what you get when a load of people seine power in the name of communism. Maybe their followers were easily lead, lied to and deceived?

 

[Fez]

It's an opinion, if you don't like it then don't agree, simple as. There's no lack of awareness at all, I simply made an observation based on what I saw in front of me and invited others to do the same to see if it matches up. Look it up for youself, most of the brexit people interveiwed on Tv were working class, middle aged people. That doesn't mean everybody who voted out falls into that category, nor does it mean everybody in that category voted out, it just seems strange that everybody I've seen interviewed for the out campaign is clearly working class from a working class town. Those that voted in that I've seen seem to be professionals such as teachers, doctors, surveyors etc.

I can only go on what I've seen, if you think I was making a sweeping generalisation then fine, that's how you've taken it, that isn't my problem. I don't need telling whether or not my opinion needs defending, that's up to you. However, if you think I'm arrogant enough to assume the country is simply split into two demographics, then you need to have a think.

I didn't agree. You quoted me and asked a direct question. I answered it. The rest is bollocks, opinion or not. I only read the first sentence as I'm busy.

 

[Edelman]

No, I think there's nobody with any plan at all as everyone thought Remain would win and now we'll get Boris taking over and he was just having a laugh, he didn't actually want to win the ****ing thing.

He looked like a scared rabbit caught in the headlights yesterday.
Lets hope sense is seen and his own members dont elect him.

 

[Barchullona]

You vote for an MP local to you, not a PM.

Maybe he thinks we are in a country where you vote for a president not a party.

 

[Edelman]

Which party was in charge in the USSR, China, Cambodia...

Awaits the usual, ah but that wasn't communism cop out. It is what you get when a load of people seine power in the name of communism. Maybe their followers were easily lead, lied to and deceived?

That sounds familiar

 

[brownbagtiger]

Again, seriously? You think Boris did not want to win? Let's see what happens.

I don't think he did. I think it was a cynical position taken in the belief that Remain would win, but Cameron would be undermined enough for a leadership contest and Boris would have positioned himself as prime candidate for leadership of the Tory party.

Now it's a poisoned chalice, as whoever is leader has to negotiate us out of Europe and will end up being blamed by all sides. No-one will be satisfied with what we come out with - the Remainers who never wanted to leave in the first place and the Brexiters who do not get everything they thought they voted for.

 

[Barchullona]

Yes this is True.
Should it be the case though.
We have Bi elections locally

We have elections for bis? What about the lesbians, gays and transgenders? Or asexuals?

 

[C'mon ref]

I've been trying to remember the times before all of this EU thing, 1970/71 when I travelled to Holland, Germany and Spain and all I can remember is that we had to show our passports at their immigration points, in the case of Germany we travelled by train from Rotterdam and there was a change of guard at the borders so it was show passports to the Dutch then German people. Then it was duty frees with only so much booze and cigs that could be taken home as they were cheaper, but today its totally different as the booze is as cheap here as it is there so we don't bother to bring any home now. As for cigs, well I'm a none smoker anyway so it doesn't bother me and what I did bring home was for other people, so in essence that is all I can remember pre-EU times, if that's the way to say it. There was still the E111 form, a piece of paper for medical stuff if you needed it and that was it.

 

[Edelman]

I don't think he did. I think it was a cynical position taken in the belief that Remain would win, but Cameron would be undermined enough for a leadership contest and Boris would have positioned himself as prime candidate for leadership of the Tory party.

Now it's a poisoned chalice, as whoever is leader has to negotiate us out of Europe and will end up being blamed by all sides. No-one will be satisfied with what we come out with - the Remainers who never wanted to leave in the first place and the Brexiters who do not get everything they thought they voted for.

Sounds very much like what we already have and have always had.

 

[City Man]

I've been trying to remember the times before all of this EU thing, 1970/71 when I travelled to Holland, Germany and Spain and all I can remember is that we had to show our passports at their immigration points, in the case of Germany we travelled by train from Rotterdam and there was a change of guard at the borders so it was show passports to the Dutch then German people. Then it was duty frees with only so much booze and cigs that could be taken home as they were cheaper, but today its totally different as the booze is as cheap here as it is there so we don't bother to bring any home now. As for cigs, well I'm a none smoker anyway so it doesn't bother me and what I did bring home was for other people, so in essence that is all I can remember pre-EU times, if that's the way to say it. There was still the E111 form, a piece of paper for medical stuff if you needed it and that was it.

Proper border controls in and out?

Bring it on !

 

[Barchullona]

Possibly because not everybody voted for the MP they got?

You mean to say that not every MP wasn't elected with 100% of the vote!

Anyone who votes and doesn't know who the other candidates were or who got in doesn't deserve any further votes. Seems you are one of those who votes for a party because your dad did. And his dad before him...Who the candidates are being irrelevant. Explains how the likes of Prescott keep getting elected.

 

[Old Tige]

Which party was in charge in the USSR, China, Cambodia...

Awaits the usual, ah but that wasn't communism cop out. It is what you get when a load of people seine power in the name of communism. Maybe their followers were easily lead, lied to and deceived?

You can wait on then.

I despise state communism as much as I do state capitalism.

Are you really as dim as you seem?

Direct democracy means no one in charge. No state. The examples you give were state dictatorships. But I doubt even then that their populations were as gullible, or as uninformed as you.

No gods, no state, no masters.... get it?