Wayne Rooney, has he become a liability....discuss

[originallambrettaman]

This debate is getting very specific.

I don't think it should.

The fact is, we were outplayed, it wasn't a single players fault, we were simply beaten by a better team. Pirlo was better than anyone in our team, by quite some distance. Ironically, he played the Huddlestone role and it he did it better than Huddlestone could have done(though I think Huddlestone could probably have done better job than either Gerrard or Henderson managed last night).

We played some decent football last night, way better than 2010, but we still lost. Italy deserve some credit, they might not be brilliant individually, but they're a very good team.

Fortunately, Uruguay and Costa Rica weren't so good. In fact, Uruguay were ****e and made Costa Rica look way better than they are. Campbell looks a handful, but other than him, they look mediocre. Uruguay will probably have Suarez back for the next game, which will make them far more dangerous, but they're dodgy at the back and there's no reason why we can't stuff them both.

I just pray Woy learned from the opening game and goes with round pegs in round holes, if we don't get out of this group, I suspect it will be down to team selection, rather than lack of quality..

 

[Amin Arrears]

Suarez or no Suarez, Uruguay are really **** and have been for some considerable time. I've been saying it for ages, they're very lucky to even be at the World Cup, they only just scraped in through the back door.

Anything less than a comfortable win would be catastrophic.

 

[Chazz Rheinhold]

Suarez or no Suarez, Uruguay are really **** and have been for some considerable time. I've been saying it for ages, they're very lucky to even be at the World Cup, they only just scraped in through the back door.

Anything less than a comfortable win would be catastrophic.

We'll draw

 

[Happy Tiger]

This debate is getting very specific.

I don't think it should.

The fact is, we were outplayed, it wasn't a single players fault, we were simply beaten by a better team. Pirlo was better than anyone in our team, by quite some distance. Ironically, he played the Huddlestone role and it he did it better than Huddlestone could have done(though I think Huddlestone could probably have done better job than either Gerrard or Henderson managed last night).

We played some decent football last night, way better than 2010, but we still lost. Italy deserve some credit, they might not be brilliant individually, but they're a very good team.

Fortunately, Uruguay and Costa Rica weren't so good. In fact, Uruguay were ****e and made Costa Rica look way better than they are. Campbell looks a handful, but other than him, they look mediocre. Uruguay will probably have Suarez back for the next game, which will make them far more dangerous, but they're dodgy at the back and there's no reason why we can't stuff them both.

I just pray Woy learned from the opening game and goes with round pegs in round holes, if we don't get out of this group, I suspect it will be down to team selection, rather than lack of quality..

That's a pretty good assessment of the whole thing. Rooney needs to play in the middle up front if he's going to play.

Pirlo is just so effortlessly sublime. The Messis, Ronaldos etc will get all the attention and plaudits, but for me, Pirlo is just the best footballer at the tournament. He makes being awesome look so easy, it's like he's taking the piss.

The Italians are also an excellent tournament team, something we've never managed really, but seem to be getting better at. That was the first performance by and England team in a long time I've actually enjoyed, and it gave me hope that finally we might have a properly competitive team. We might go all the way in this world cup, but it's boding well for the next Euro's.

Despite my initial reservations, and the usual ****ty officials, this is turning into a bloody good World Cup, and no team should taken for granted.

 

[Carmine Galante.]

I said before the start of the tournament that Ashley Cole should have gone specifically for the Italy game.

He's the best defender in the country not great going forward but a great defender. When things are going wrong in that area of the pitch Woy is hardly going to bring Shaw on so why did he take him?
I think Cole, with his vast experience, would have done something about the lack of assistance being offered from the left mid position.

As for Pirlo?

I'd have sacrificed a player to man mark him out of the game, probably Milner.

And I wouldn't play Rooney on the left.

 

[Amin Arrears]

I said before the start of the tournament that Ashley Cole should have gone specifically for the Italy game.

He's the best defender in the country not great going forward but a great defender. When things are going wrong in that area of the pitch Woy is hardly going to bring Shaw on so why did he take him?
I think Cole, with his vast experience, would have done something about the lack of assistance being offered from the left mid position.

As for Pirlo?

I'd have sacrificed a player to man mark him out of the game, probably Milner.

And I wouldn't play Rooney on the left.

Agreed.

Me said for ages that Cole should have gone as first choice but got rubbished by all who claimed Baines and Shaw are better.

 

[PLT]

Cole didn't play all season though did he?

They played a right back instead. He's obviously not as good as he was if he's not getting picked any more. Baines and Shaw on the other hand were both excellent last season, two of the best fullbacks in the PL in fact.

If Cole had been picked, people would moan that Roy picked the old guard, not giving youth a chance like Germany do, we should be more like Germany etc etc. As it turns out Germany took Klose and ours is a very young squad so people will now probably say we should go for experience like Germany, they know what they're doing them Germans.

 

[originallambrettaman]

Cole didn't play all season though did he?

Four games for England and 26 games for Chelsea.

 

[PLT]

Four games for England and 26 games for Chelsea.

But Azpilicueta was picked over him for most of the second half of the season.

I may have worded that poorly but the point is he wasn't getting picked at club level, Mourinho preferred to use a RB instead in the second half of the season, so he obviously wasn't that good when he was playing. There are two left backs who were first picks for their clubs and performed really well all season. Both have been looked at by bigger clubs as a result.

 

[TheCasual]

Elmo did Ashley Cole three times in the first 10 minutes in the Chelsea home game. Elmo is nippy, but he's no speed merchant.

The problem was the balance of the side and the fact that Roy failed to react to it quick enough.

In the last 40 minutes you had plenty of possession, but couldn't break them down.

 

[bigfattiger]

Elmo did Ashley Cole three times in the first 10 minutes in the Chelsea home game. Elmo is nippy, but he's no speed merchant.

The problem was the balance of the side and the fact that Roy failed to react to it quick enough.

In the last 40 minutes you had plenty of possession, but couldn't break them down.

Saturday wasn't about pace, it was about personnel and positioning. Cole would have been tearing a strip of Wazza and his CB's about needing more cover and protection.
Every pundit at HT said Baines was exposed, 5 minutes into the 2nd half, boom, Baines exposed, we're 2-1 down and lose the game.

That's 100% Roy's bag.

 

[Willson]

I don't think a more defensive full back was needed, but rather the opposite. We had no width down the left going forward as Baines was not overlapping enough. He has been the same in the warm up games as well, I'd play Shaw instead. In a 2 sitting midfielders formation it is the responsibility of the left sitting player to help cover the left flank and vice versa, so it was Gerrard who should have been offering the main protection but I thought both he and Henderson failed to do that.

 

[Fez]

I don't think a more defensive full back was needed, but rather the opposite. We had no width down the left going forward as Baines was not overlapping enough. He has been the same in the warm up games as well, I'd play Shaw instead. In a 2 sitting midfielders formation it is the responsibility of the left sitting player to help cover the left flank and vice versa, so it was Gerrard who should have been offering the main protection but I thought both he and Henderson failed to do that.

It was a battle of the midfield and theirs were better than ours; they knew Rooney was limited in covering back and they knew that Baines could not cover it on his own.
There were different occasions when different players failed to support Baines, compounded by the fact Baines does not yet read the game well at this level - he was teased out of position by canny seasoned players who knew how to run into the space it will immediately create and then the next space they imagined it would - class tells.
But we were barely beaten, we were not a push over and we (collectively) learnt a great deal about what we need to do against opposition who will struggle to show that level of focus and in/on conditions that may better suit our style.
I don't always agree so adamantly with Shearer, but, just as we at Hull City have known for seasons, it was all down (despite what has already been said) to the missed chances - Rooney's would have brought us a point and robbed them of two, and then there were others which, in play-back, certain players will cringe at what should have been. Get the right players in the right shape, sharpen up on finishing and we can take six points from six.

 

[originallambrettaman]

I was listening to 5Live at lunchtime, they had some sports journos on and they all seemed to think Rooney would be moved to the middle, with Sterling moved out wide.

 

[GLP]

The centre halves were poor v Italy. This was an Italy side without their first choice keeper playing a centre half at left back (He started his career at left back) but is seen very much as a centre half.

We were naive against a wily Italian side, we should have been capable of winning or drawing given the chances we created. England learnt nothing from a Pirlo inspired victory last time out!

 

[The FRENCH TICKLER]

FFS, Give Rooney a break. He should be played down the middle with Welbeck and Stirling on the flanks.

For the Uruguay game we should go 4 - 1 - 3 - 2 imo. Bring in Lallana or Barkley. Win or bust England now.