Does anyone actually like the flat?
- Thread starter Bostonbob
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Evening all,yes those compressed handicaps run for the high street bookies really are a joke are'nt they.the biggest issue is the appalling prize money on offer,on the train back from lingfield a few months ago spent an enjoyable few hours with a owner of a few with s Dixon his horse ran second but when all the fees added up he actually made a loss.the all weather meetings the results are pretty much decided in the owners trainers bar before hand.straight forecast double and trebles on the tote were getting quite popular amongst the fiddlers
I appreciate the best of both Bob and don't care for the crap in both. Just for your benefit then, my one word answer is..
Yes.
Sorry for the delay. Had a problem removing one of the splinters.
I like it when I get the winner 
but in simple answer Yes altho give me a good day at cheltenham over a good day at Newmarket any day!
but in simple answer Yes altho give me a good day at cheltenham over a good day at Newmarket any day!
My summer consists of backing Tom O Brien on Dr Newland horses. I can say with confidence I'll not be changing tack this year unles Dawn Approach runs at a stupid odds against price.
Definitely NH for me. I find most of the flat pretty boring and even made a New Years resolution not to bet on the flat this year but didn't make it past the Lincoln. From a spectacle point of view I quite like the cavalry charge handicap sprints on a Saturday but complete waste of time from a punting perspective.
Ive made more on the flat in the last 10 days than I did the full jump season, its completely different class from the jumps.
who jumps best wins, no use to me im afraid.
who jumps best wins, no use to me im afraid.
I love the flat Bob......
When I think about a Group one race taking place in glorious sunshine, watching horses running at the fastest speeds possible with the complexion of the race changing all the way up the straight, horses looking for a gap, bursting through and running like the wind, and then some wet day with horses out on their feet being flogged up the soggy Chepstow straight at a pace that looks like slow motion.
Exaggeration aside what I dislike in both codes is like many have already stated which is poor quality racing. whether it is flat or jumps there is so much racing serving no one but the bookie. The trainers and owners complain about the prize money, the stands are empty, the real enthusiasts dislike it and so it serves only the bet on anything brigade which are the prey of the bookie chaps. The reason the prize money is so poor is that no one wants to watch it or sponsor it nor anyone with a real flat or jumps horse race their horse in it. I feel we should have 3 meetings a day which would concentrate everything with regard quality and prize money.
When I think about a Group one race taking place in glorious sunshine, watching horses running at the fastest speeds possible with the complexion of the race changing all the way up the straight, horses looking for a gap, bursting through and running like the wind, and then some wet day with horses out on their feet being flogged up the soggy Chepstow straight at a pace that looks like slow motion.
Exaggeration aside what I dislike in both codes is like many have already stated which is poor quality racing. whether it is flat or jumps there is so much racing serving no one but the bookie. The trainers and owners complain about the prize money, the stands are empty, the real enthusiasts dislike it and so it serves only the bet on anything brigade which are the prey of the bookie chaps. The reason the prize money is so poor is that no one wants to watch it or sponsor it nor anyone with a real flat or jumps horse race their horse in it. I feel we should have 3 meetings a day which would concentrate everything with regard quality and prize money.
****, I wouldn't!
However, good thread Bob. Most of the forum members are too young to remember Phil Bull, Timeform's founder, but, in all honesty, flat racing really was much better for the punter in those days. If you followed his guidelines (basically, to think for yourself from the ample stuff he gave his readers) then betting on the Flat was often rewarding, and a lot of fun too. Nowadays, as pointed out above, there are just too many horses in training, many of them no-hopers, and so horseracing is tilted very very much in the bookmakers' favour. Nothing new there. Also, there are more tips flying around from so-called professional journalists (many of dubious quality) than one would find in a dump for old billiard cues.
......but there's just nothing like the Cheltenham Festival, and for that reason alone, NH racing has it over the Flat?
I'm a jumps man all the way,there is way to much flat racing on and those pesky 5f handicapps are a mare as already mentioned on this tread.I think you will find the common man on the street who has a passing interest in racing will always be found in the bookies for chelts/aintree whereas you woudlnt get that for any of the big flat meetings.I also seem to find winners easier with the jumps too,not as many photo finishes!in summary national hunt is great,flat ok
Much prefer the flat, jumps is boring, don't want to watch a "race" where something wins by 29 lengths"
Obviously you dont want to include watching Frankel, and the demolition jobs he did, do you...??
Ask any jumps fan what they have seen in Sprinter Sacre this year and you can compare it to what Frankel has done on the flat... Just absolutely awesome from both... And not a 1 length victory in them all...!!! Very boring...
I'm sure that many on the forum prefer the jumps as you see far more of the forum's favourite, Mr Henderson, in that sphere.
I actually greatly enjoy both codes and think the great plus that the Flat has over the jumps is that it has a much more structured season with great races spread throughout the entire season. These days the NH campaign seems to be focused almost entirely around the Cheltenham and Aintree Festivals to the exclusion of almost everything else.
I actually greatly enjoy both codes and think the great plus that the Flat has over the jumps is that it has a much more structured season with great races spread throughout the entire season. These days the NH campaign seems to be focused almost entirely around the Cheltenham and Aintree Festivals to the exclusion of almost everything else.
Im with the general consensus on this thread that the jumps scene is better than the flat...
From a watching brief i do find it hard to appreciate something, say like a 6f race, that if your drawn anything outside the first 3 in the stalls, Chester for example, youve got next to no chance in winning the race... That sort of puts me off wanting to take it seriously, as we all know racing is a bookies benefit at the best of times, and some races/courses are tipped even further towards their satchels...
I can appreciate both, but i will always look for a jumps card before i even think about entertaining a flat one... Its horses for courses i suppose... but jumping is better...
From a watching brief i do find it hard to appreciate something, say like a 6f race, that if your drawn anything outside the first 3 in the stalls, Chester for example, youve got next to no chance in winning the race... That sort of puts me off wanting to take it seriously, as we all know racing is a bookies benefit at the best of times, and some races/courses are tipped even further towards their satchels...
I can appreciate both, but i will always look for a jumps card before i even think about entertaining a flat one... Its horses for courses i suppose... but jumping is better...
SBC - you make a good point about the NH season just geared towards the big 2 festivals, and to be honest the media and bookies know this and push it as much as they can...
We do need to get back to the top horses slugging it out against each other more than just the once over the year. Its no shame to have a history record without a 1 to your name, but i do feel that some trainers protect the records first than show what true ability these horses have at times... And that's in both spheres...
We do need to get back to the top horses slugging it out against each other more than just the once over the year. Its no shame to have a history record without a 1 to your name, but i do feel that some trainers protect the records first than show what true ability these horses have at times... And that's in both spheres...
True to an extent, but I do think the NH season has a good structure to it from November to May:
Early season highlights in Nov / early Dec like the Hennessey, Tingle Creek, Old Roan Chase, Betfair Chase, Fighting Fifth and of course the Open and International Meetings at Cheltenham --> plus lots of novices making their debut
The superb Xmas / New Year meetings at Kempton and Leopardstown, plus the Welsh National meeting
January / February has lots of the big prep races for the festival (Adonis, Dovecote, Game Spirit, Denman Chase, Irish Champion Hurdle, Festival Trials day at Cheltenham)
And then bang - bang - bang you have Cheltenham, Aintree, The Whitbread Gold Cup and the Punchestown festival
Nicely balanced with high class races throughout. The spring festivals being the highlight of course.