WAR! What is it good for?

[Star of David Bardsley]

I can't believe the amount of simping in here for Iran, I really can't, we reached new lows.

I wouldn’t say it’s simping for Iran but then I never got round to reading back last night so probably missed something. Just a misguided opinion Israel is somehow worse borne out of a naive level of sympathy for those under the control of its proxies. Israel has always punched above its weight when it comes to war and if it didn’t it wouldn’t exist. Obviously US backing helps but some of its operations have been exceptionally clever and efficient, saving lives against a regime with no regard for its own people and a literal countdown clock to Israel’s obliteration.

Boxing to Queensberry Rules when the other bloke is waving a flamethrower about isn’t really an option.

 

[Citizen Kane.]

I think the bottom line is the West was so scarred by its interventions in Iraq and Afghanistan (and Libya to a lesser extent) that its foreign policy is now a confused and nervous mess.

Trump, Macron, Starmer etc. talk a big talk but do **** all about any problems.

 

[Citizen Kane.]

As mentioned by Bwood, here is Iran's 'countdown clock', erected by the regime in Palestine Square (where else?) as part of a 2015 policy speech committing the country to destroying Israel by 2040.

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Pinkie, Fosse, Archers and the usual suspects will conveniently ignore the slightly uncomfortable detail that Iran unveiled this policy a few months after signing Obama's precious JCPA agreement.

Regimes like Iran's drink deeply from collective Western stupidity.

 

[brb]

I wouldn’t say it’s simping for Iran but then I never got round to reading back last night so probably missed something. Just a misguided opinion Israel is somehow worse borne out of a naive level of sympathy for those under the control of its proxies. Israel has always punched above its weight when it comes to war and if it didn’t it wouldn’t exist. Obviously US backing helps but some of its operations have been exceptionally clever and efficient, saving lives against a regime with no regard for its own people and a literal countdown clock to Israel’s obliteration.

Boxing to Queensberry Rules when the other bloke is waving a flamethrower about isn’t really an option.

Fair enough mate. Tbph I've never looked at the weaponary of Iran and Israel, and probably thought Iran would be too much for Israel to take on. Sort of Tel Aviv being a sitting duck surrounded by lions (due to the base of the main strikes). I often struggled to understand why we weren't taking on the military regime of Tehran, because as long as they went untouched, the problems would just get bigger.

The other thing I was going to say yesterday, but I left it alone because everyone seems sensitive at the mo, I wonder what part Putin plays in all this, because I can't belive that Trump hasn't discussed it with him, I can see Russia quietly giving him (Trump) the nod, because I've not seen a murmur from them (Moscow), since attentions changed to Iran.

 

[PINKIE]

Fair enough mate. Tbph I've never looked at the weaponary of Iran and Israel, and probably thought Iran would be too much for Israel to take on. Sort of Tel Aviv being a sitting duck surrounded by lions (due to the base of the main strikes). I often struggled to understand why we weren't taking on the military regime of Tehran, because as long as they went untouched, the problems would just get bigger.

The other thing I was going to say yesterday, but I left it alone because everyone seems sensitive at the mo, I wonder what part Putin plays in all this, because I can't belive that Trump hasn't discussed it with him, I can see Russia quietly giving him (Trump) the nod, because I've not seen a murmur from them (Moscow), since attentions changed to Iran.

Attacking Iran weakens Putin, because they are aligned. Which might be another reason why the US would support Israel on this

 

[Solid Air]

Yes and no.

Going for Iran from the beginning would have opened up four fronts for Israel to deal with simultaneously. Hamas to the west, Hezbollah to the north, Houthis to the south and Iran to the east. I think even with all the help in the world that would have been overwhelming for them. We forget that Israel is an absolutely tiny country, roughly the size of Wales.

I think Israel went about this in the right way. Cut off the tentacles one by one, then a limited but crucial foray into Iran back in October which appeared to target the Hezbollah brass but was actually much more about getting the measure of Iran's air defences and how to get around them. It was a highly successful reconnaissance mission that set up the stage for what we're seeing now.

I think it was counting on more western support in dealing at least with the various tentacles, but apart from limited activity against the Houthis and aid in shooting down Iranian ballistics, the west has done what it does best - **** all.

There was certainly good reason for more intervention. The Houthis should have been crushed the moment they started blocking global shipping lanes in the Red Sea in the name of 'freeing Palestine'. Similarly Hezbollah should have been crushed the moment that deadly explosion in Beirut showed just how lost Lebanon is as a sovereign state.

The overarching problem is that there are too many people out there with acute brain damage who lap up and turn a blind eye to every and any atrocity, as long as it is doing in the name of 'resistance to Israel'. It is peddled by the mainstream media and lapped up by weak western governments the world over.

So here we are. Israel is doing the world's dirty work for it.

 

[PINKIE]

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[PINKIE]

I swear this guy is employed by the IDF

 

[brb]

Attacking Iran weakens Putin, because they are aligned. Which might be another reason why the US would support Israel on this

Maybe, but I'm doubting that at the moment. I just think the two must have discussed it and Putin has remained incrediably silent. I know I read something about Putin wanting their uranium, maybe Putin could kill two birds with one stone here, get Trump to do the dirty work, then for Putin to step in at some point, and say I tell you what guys, let's stop this, but Iran this is what I need you to do, but saying it with a smile...soz imagination running wild now. I just think those two ****ers have cooked up some plan, and in return Trump is ignoring Ukraine, which certainly seemed to be the case yesterday.

 

[brb]

Yes and no.

Going for Iran from the beginning would have opened up four fronts for Israel to deal with simultaneously. Hamas to the west, Hezbollah to the north, Houthis to the south and Iran to the east. I think even with all the help in the world that would have been overwhelming for them. We forget that Israel is an absolutely tiny country, roughly the size of Wales.

I think Israel went about this in the right way. Cut off the tentacles one by one, then a limited but crucial foray into Iran back in October which appeared to target the Hezbollah brass but was actually much more about getting the measure of Iran's air defences and how to get around them. It was a highly successful reconnaissance mission that set up the stage for what we're seeing now.

I think it was counting on more western support in dealing at least with the various tentacles, but apart from limited activity against the Houthis and aid in shooting down Iranian ballistics, the west has done what it does best - **** all.

There was certainly good reason for more intervention. The Houthis should have been crushed the moment they started blocking global shipping lanes in the Red Sea in the name of 'freeing Palestine'. Similarly Hezbollah should have been crushed the moment that deadly explosion in Beirut showed just how lost Lebanon is as a sovereign state.

The overarching problem is that there are too many people out there with acute brain damage who lap up and turn a blind eye to every and any atrocity, as long as it is doing in the name of 'resistance to Israel'. It is peddled by the mainstream media and lapped up by weak western governments the world over.

So here we are. Israel is doing the world's dirty work for it.

I missed this comment somehow, I think it's where the forum hides some content to minmise the page count. Only noticed it because of @Solid Air 2 laughing, so not really sure if I need to read it now.

TLDR

 

[Archers Road]

It would be nice if we had a PM who stuck with important allies rather than trying to appease voters he’s lost if he spends the next four years on top of Big Ben in a keffiyeh.

It would be nice if our historically important allies weren’t governed by homicidal maniacs and mentally unstable narcissists, but you have to play the cards you’re dealt.

 

[Archers Road]

That was based on lies. I'm not attaching any fact that they have nuclear weapons to my reasoning in why they need dealing with, that's just an extension of. You know as well as I do Iran have been behind most the **** in Middle East, they can't be trusted, shouldn't be trusted and have needed reigning in for a long time but no one has had the balls to do it, or the moment wasn't right. All the grief we've had even with our shipping all goes back to the actions of Iran in one way or another. A rogue state. And I don't hold America in any high esteem, far from it, I just find it extremly odd that people are happy to condemn Israel but happy to accept Iran's military regime, happy to condemn Trump, but again not a bunch of raving lunatics that helped Assad, the future possibility of them having nuclear capabilities is horrifying. Was the astocities in Syria not enough for us. Nah sorry mate, they need dealing with. Everything we see today, links back to Iran, including 7th Oct.

Everything we see today links back to the fall of the Ottoman Empire, and the ensuing political order in the region, in which Britain, France, America and Russia were all complicit. Probably best if we learn the lessons of the past, and stay the **** out of trying to police the world.

 

[PINKIE]

Like we dealt with Iraq and Libya you mean? Because that went so well…

Iraq, Libya, Afghanistan, Syria.

And what happened there…the US tried to install their own puppets or left a vacuum for extremist factions to fill.

We might not like Assad, Gaddafi, Hussein, or Khamenei and they were and are horrible pieces of work who dealt in death and persecution, but in every situation, the US and the west left those countries in a worse position and increased the threat of extremist factions around the world

it beggars belief that people are swallowing the lies again about nuclear weapons. Israel want to reshape the Middle East, it is their expansionist agenda which is driving this and you can see what they have done to the people of Gaza to get an idea of what little regard they have for anybody who is perceived to be standing in the way of that agenda.

 

[PINKIE]

Everything we see today links back to the fall of the Ottoman Empire, and the ensuing political order in the region, in which Britain, France, America and Russia were all complicit. Probably best if we learn the lessons of the past, and stay the **** out of trying to police the world.

I hear brb saying we should keep our noses out and then at the same time saying we should give Iran a slap and deal with them.

 

[brb]

Yes and no.

Going for Iran from the beginning would have opened up four fronts for Israel to deal with simultaneously. Hamas to the west, Hezbollah to the north, Houthis to the south and Iran to the east. I think even with all the help in the world that would have been overwhelming for them. We forget that Israel is an absolutely tiny country, roughly the size of Wales.

I think Israel went about this in the right way. Cut off the tentacles one by one, then a limited but crucial foray into Iran back in October which appeared to target the Hezbollah brass but was actually much more about getting the measure of Iran's air defences and how to get around them. It was a highly successful reconnaissance mission that set up the stage for what we're seeing now.

I think it was counting on more western support in dealing at least with the various tentacles, but apart from limited activity against the Houthis and aid in shooting down Iranian ballistics, the west has done what it does best - **** all.

There was certainly good reason for more intervention. The Houthis should have been crushed the moment they started blocking global shipping lanes in the Red Sea in the name of 'freeing Palestine'. Similarly Hezbollah should have been crushed the moment that deadly explosion in Beirut showed just how lost Lebanon is as a sovereign state.

The overarching problem is that there are too many people out there with acute brain damage who lap up and turn a blind eye to every and any atrocity, as long as it is doing in the name of 'resistance to Israel'. It is peddled by the mainstream media and lapped up by weak western governments the world over.

So here we are. Israel is doing the world's dirty work for it.

Actually I went back and had a speedy read, so not everything would have been digested.

My take, you are wrong in the firsty paragraph because I alluded to how small Israel are in an earlier post but I get you were speaking generally.

I agree about cutting the tentacles off one by one, rather than all at once.

I agree about the shipping lanes, I can't believe we (not just Israel) allowed that to go on for so long, as it's one of my main gripes, we should have been dealing with it then and by not doing so made ourselves appear weak. Then once you appear weak people start taking the piss.

Finally we got there, Iran, took us long enough, I just want a simple message, sit down and shut the **** up, then leave them alone if they comply. I don't want us targeting civilians, just the chiefs.

Edit: oh and targeting some weaponary of course.

 

[brb]

I hear brb saying we should keep our noses out and then at the same time saying we should give Iran a slap and deal with them.

If you got something to say, say it to be bro, and stop being a sly **** just because you want some attention today, that I did give you out of politeness a little while ago, but now you can go **** yourself.

 

[PINKIE]

Maybe, but I'm doubting that at the moment. I just think the two must have discussed it and Putin has remained incrediably silent. I know I read something about Putin wanting their uranium, maybe Putin could kill two birds with one stone here, get Trump to do the dirty work, then for Putin to step in at some point, and say I tell you what guys, let's stop this, but Iran this is what I need you to do, but saying it with a smile...soz imagination running wild now. I just think those two ****ers have cooked up some plan, and in return Trump is ignoring Ukraine, which certainly seemed to be the case yesterday.

They’ll all have their own agendas at work. Mentioned it yesterday, but I’m surprised nobody has mentioned Iranian oil yet and the shipping lanes in the straight of Hormuz.

Israel want regional dominance, that’s their agenda and the US are using them as a proxy for their own reasons to quash Iran

but there will be all sorts of grubby behind doors deals going on. The nuclear issue is a complete smokescreen

 

[PINKIE]

If you got something to say, say it to be bro, and stop being a sly **** just because you want some attention today, that I did give you out of politeness a little while ago, but now you can go **** yourself.

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ya ****ing melt

 

[Star of David Bardsley]

It would be nice if our historically important allies weren’t governed by homicidal maniacs and mentally unstable narcissists, but you have to play the cards you’re dealt.

You do. Folding every hand isn’t a great strategy but the cards analogy is being stretched now.

 

[PINKIE]

You do. Folding every hand isn’t a great strategy but the cards analogy is being stretched now.

All I see is a deck of jokers

Nobody is winning any hand with that deal