Transfer Rumours To sack or not to sack?

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Should we sack Ange now?

  • Total voters
    31
  • Poll closed .
Dier Hard said:
If we get any worse we get relegated so I reckon that's gotta be the last straw, lol.

Thing is, if people are backing Ange in sort of defiance/ hate for Levy, it's probably counter-productive to Spurs' fortunes.

Though if people are backing Ange because they believe he can fix the mess he's partly responsible for then fair enough, hopefully they see something I currently don't.
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I don’t just get the support for Ange. There’s not one metric that shows he’s doing well. Results are and have been horrific for a long long time now. I genuinely can’t see a sustained upturn in results coming anytime soon under the current manager with his amateur, chaotic style.

Ideally for me Levy and Ange would both go but that’s never happening. But people wanting Levy to go more than Ange makes no sense to me.
 
KingHotspur said:
I don’t just get the support for Ange. There’s not one metric that shows he’s doing well. Results are and have been horrific for a long long time now. I genuinely can’t see a sustained upturn in results coming anytime soon under the current manager with his amateur, chaotic style.

Ideally for me Levy and Ange would both go but that’s never happening. But people wanting Levy to go more than Ange makes no sense to me.
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I do think a considerable amount are backing him out of defiance of Levy, because some of the very people in support of him were very vocal in wanting previous managers out who were doing better, so I do believe it's a "**** you, Levy, back him" type scenario. I don't blame them for that view though, because I'm sick of Levy too and had similar views for weeks/ months but ultimately I do find it counterproductive as well because Levy won't change so I feel the only way Spurs will improve is finding that "perfect" manager again, like we did with Jol, 'Arry and Poch.
 
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Dier Hard said:
I do think a considerable amount are backing him out of defiance of Levy, because some of the very people in support of him were very vocal in wanting previous managers out who were doing better, so I do believe it's a "**** you, Levy, back him" type scenario. I don't blame them for that view though, because I'm sick of Levy too and had similar views for weeks/ months but ultimately I do find it counterproductive as well because Levy won't change so I feel the only way Spurs will improve is finding that "perfect" manager again, like we did with Jol, 'Arry and Poch.
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I'm definitely one of those people. <laugh>
Except I’m not “backing him”, either.
For me it’s about seeing a project through and actually backing the manager, whoever that may be. We keep getting to the same point before levy ****s himself over the decisions he made in the first place!
 
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Roo said:
I'm definitely one of those people. <laugh>
Except I’m not “backing him”, either.
For me it’s about seeing a project through and actually backing the manager, whoever that may be. We keep getting to the same point before levy ****s himself over the decisions he made in the first place!
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I wanna see a project under Iraola.

That bloke is looking special.

Ange just needs £100ms, Iraola looks like he could probably work under Levy and do well (to a degree!).
 
The very worst thing to do is to make decisions based on insufficient data. It almost never makes sense to sack managers on results because the margins are so fine. Ange has also had a terrible run of injuries to contend with. I still think he can turn out OK.
 
Appointing managers is not a scientific process. Over my life the list of managers who have made a big difference to their club is something like this...
Busby
Nicholson
Shankly
Paisley
Clough (Nottm Forest)
Ferguson
Wenger
Mourinho (first Chelsea stint)
Guardiola
Klopp
Of those ten, three had no managerial experience at all, four had had some success in far inferior leagues, two had had success in similar standard leagues and only one had had success with a smaller club in the top English division.
At least 7 would look ridiculously risky if appointed to the Spurs job now with the experience they had before first turning up in their English top division roles.
 
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PowerSpurs said:
Appointing managers is not a scientific process. Over my life the list of managers who have made a big difference to their club is something like this...
Busby
Nicholson
Shankly
Paisley
Clough (Nottm Forest)
Ferguson
Wenger
Mourinho (first Chelsea stint)
Guardiola
Klopp
Of those ten, three had no managerial experience at all, four had had some success in far inferior leagues, two had had success in similar standard leagues and only one had had success with a smaller club in the top English division.
At least 7 would look ridiculously risky if appointed to the Spurs job now with the experience they had before first turning up in their English top division roles.
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So, not including Ranieri and Dalglish in that list? Or would any manager have taken 'no hopers' to PL titles?
 
Left on the Shelf said:
So, not including Ranieri and Dalglish in that list? Or would any manager have taken 'no hopers' to PL titles?
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Dalglish kept Liverpool about where they were and Ranieri was just a one season wonder. But even if you included them and say Bertie Mee at Arsenal and Kevin Keegan at Newcastle you still wouldn't get any sort of pattern that showed you how to select a great manager.
 
PowerSpurs said:
Dalglish kept Liverpool about where they were and Ranieri was just a one season wonder. But even if you included them and say Bertie Mee at Arsenal and Kevin Keegan at Newcastle you still wouldn't get any sort of pattern that showed you how to select a great manager.
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You can never really know how to select a great manager.

But you can make a judgement of a manager when they’re at the club.

The current one isn’t good enough, albeit he’s been poorly let down by those above. So it ends up being a double whammy for us fans.
 
Dier Hard said:
You can never really know how to select a great manager.

But you can make a judgement of a manager when they’re at the club.

The current one isn’t good enough, albeit he’s been poorly let down by those above. So it ends up being a double whammy for us fans.
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We don't know whether he is good enough yet. There are too many uncertainties to tell. The injury crisis is one of them, the bizarre difference between the GD and results another. And why do you say he has been let down? Our recruitment strategy and budget have been entirely consistent since he joined.
 
KingHotspur said:
13 votes and 9 want the manager to stay. Considering the results and the football offered that’s actually impressive by Ange to still have that sort of support.
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I want him to stay because whoever he is replaced by him will achieve what?

a few more wins? Just a few more

top 4? what do we do in the CL other than make up the numbers?

Maybe 7/8th?

meh

we are not a serious football club…we are a serious entertainment business

may as well keep him and enjoy the adrenaline rush of a relegation battle
 
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PowerSpurs said:
We don't know whether he is good enough yet. There are too many uncertainties to tell. The injury crisis is one of them, the bizarre difference between the GD and results another. And why do you say he has been let down? Our recruitment strategy and budget have been entirely consistent since he joined.
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Results say he’s not good enough. It’s not difficult.
 
PowerSpurs said:
We don't know whether he is good enough yet. There are too many uncertainties to tell. The injury crisis is one of them, the bizarre difference between the GD and results another. And why do you say he has been let down? Our recruitment strategy and budget have been entirely consistent since he joined.
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We had possibly the worst summer window since the 18/19 one where we didn’t sign anyone. That’s why he was let down. We’re over half way through January and he’s still being let down.

As for him, these injuries aren’t bad luck, they’re systematic of his style of play and training. It’s why he had bags of injuries at Celtic, as we did last season, as we do this season. His squad management is also shocking. He’s now heavily relying on players he was giving next to zero minutes to earlier in the season. Then the final point is results have been largely poor for over 14 months now.
 
Dier Hard said:
We had possibly the worst summer window since the 18/19 one where we didn’t sign anyone. That’s why he was let down. We’re over half way through January and he’s still being let down.

As for him, these injuries aren’t bad luck, they’re systematic of his style of play and training. It’s why he had bags of injuries at Celtic, as we did last season, as we do this season. His squad management is also shocking. He’s now heavily relying on players he was giving next to zero minutes to earlier in the season. Then the final point is results have been largely poor for over 14 months now.
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We can't afford to spend more so which players that we signed should we not have signed?
The injury crisis is not particularly uncommon so you can't possibly know that it is down to Ange.
 
PowerSpurs said:
We can't afford to spend more so which players that we signed should we not have signed?
The injury crisis is not particularly uncommon so you can't possibly know that it is down to Ange.
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We can spend more. We just won’t. You said yourself on the transfer thread just a couple hours ago about having another £50m to spend.

This level of crisis is certainly uncommon, and when it’s happened for years on a trot at his clubs, something certainly shows that training methods, system demands and/ or squad management certainly isn’t as good as it should be.

The man is so painfully out of his depth I genuinely feel sorry for him but I have more sympathy for us fans at watching this absolute circus that is our football club.
 
Dier Hard said:
We can spend more. We just won’t. You said yourself on the transfer thread just a couple hours ago about having another £50m to spend.

This level of crisis is certainly uncommon, and when it’s happened for years on a trot at his clubs, something certainly shows that training methods, system demands and/ or squad management certainly isn’t as good as it should be.
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I said we could spend a maximum of 50m this window. That doesn't mean we could afford to spend that last window.
Our number of hamstring injuries is nowhere near the top of the range. Klopp had many more in his first season at Liverpool and about the same in his last.
 
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