Bulut and the future

[Oldsparkey]

Virtually the entire team yesterday and subs were either Bulut signings or players given extended deals by Bulut.

I just think hes out of his depth.

I tend to agree.

Whatever 11 (+ 9) are involved on matchday, inherited players or new, it's the management of them that's the key. It looks like Bulut is still trying to find his feet in this division and it isn't coming off. We're only where we are right now because of some very streaky wins that mask the real truth.

Apart from individual ability which admittedly is limited in this squad, players need tactical guidance and that's obviously in short supply. Either the players are not listening or Bulut is a one trick pony that doesn't sit well at this level in the UK.

 

[clingo]

My big fear is that regardless of Bulut's capabilities, if he's sacked will our illustrious, well informed and knowledgeable board find us someone else to get us into a relegation scrap next season? Their track record isn't exactly brilliant. So the question is, could we even get anyone to move us forward?
I still can't get away from how useless the board are.
But there we are we're stuck with it.

 

[clingo]

Virtually the entire team yesterday and subs were either Bulut signings or players given extended deals by Bulut.

I just think hes out of his depth.

I hear you Hilts but are we sure he signed them or extended their contracts? Not saying you're wrong, but the numpties at the top like to keep control despite their lack of knowledge.

 

[remote]

or Bulut is a one trick pony that doesn't sit well at this level in the UK.

That's a phrase I've used in the past. I think it's the nub of it.

There doesn't seem to be any evolution of game plan.
Plan A. Doesn't work. More plan A. Couple wins, woohoo. More plan A. Doesn't work, more plan A.

 

[Hilts24]

I hear you Hilts but are we sure he signed them or extended their contracts? Not saying you're wrong, but the numpties at the top like to keep control despite their lack of knowledge.

I think a fair number were his. Siopsis and Goutas and the useless Runnarson without any doubt.

With an embargo I dont think any manager would be disappointed with Bowler , Ramsey , Grant , Panzo , Phillips.

We are trying to play some sort of passing game but its so slow and the players look so uncomfortable. Theres also no press. We just sit off sides. Thats on the manager. I really think him and his coaching staff arent up to it.

Changing it is just about the last thing we needed but the football is shocking.

Hes a few games to change things. Play Colwill for the 90 along with his brother and Ashford.

 

[clingo]

I think a fair number were his. Siopsis and Goutas and the useless Runnarson without any doubt.

With an embargo I dont think any manager would be disappointed with Bowler , Ramsey , Grant , Panzo , Phillips.

We are trying to play some sort of passing game but its so slow and the players look so uncomfortable. Theres also no press. We just sit off sides. Thats on the manager. I really think him and his coaching staff arent up to it.

Changing it is just about the last thing we needed but the football is shocking.

Hes a few games to change things. Play Colwill for the 90 along with his brother and Ashford.

Great points as always Hilts. I would just say that he didn't have Panzo for long and Ramsey was missing for a huge chunk.
It must look like I'm trying to defend Erol but the truth is, I just don't know about him or if we can lure anyone better.
Totally agree that if he's going to be here next season we need to see the youngsters playing around Ramsey and O'Dowda get some life into the team.
Not holding my breath.

 

[remote]

I actually found this a reasonable read.
Maybe because most of it has been written in these threads anyway.
The only miss in the article was a debate on a DoF.
They must have missed our comments on that.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/cases-against-erol-bulut-cardiff-28923963

 

[BluefromBridgend]

I actually found this a reasonable read.
Maybe because most of it has been written in these threads anyway.
The only miss in the article was a debate on a DoF.
They must have missed our comments on that.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/cases-against-erol-bulut-cardiff-28923963

I read that. There is a lot of sense in what is said.

I agree that for the sake of stability we should keep the revolving door closed and give him another contract. How long for is another matter.

That should give the players some confidence and a longer vision.

There was another WoL article listing every current player, in the squad and out on loan, and where they could be next season. Bulut staying should ensure the retention of most of those we want to keep.

There are other advantages in his ability to dip into the European market and by keeping us in the top half of the league, despite the embargo, he will have earned some credit with higher level clubs in the UK.

On the negative side he has made a number of tactical and selection errors which show he hasn't really understood the trials and tribulations of the Championship.

Can we put this down to naivety? If so surely he would have learned enough in the first half of the season to avoid the same problems in the second half. Looking at the recent games versus Swansea and Sunderland I don't think he did. But then he pulls results like Ipswich and Coventry out of the hat.

The article also mentions the point of what is our football style and do we have one. The answers appear to be don't know and no.

We have been hamstrung by Meite's and Etete's limitations up front and the signing of 2 circus acts in Ugbo (gone) and Diedhou (must go) as opposed to one decent signing. Much had been pinned on getting Kieffer in the January window and when that didn't happen we panicked and got the nearest one available in Diedhou who is no better than, possibly worse than, Ugbo. More money down the pan.

The long term injuries to Rambo, O'Dowda and McGuiness haven't helped. Thankfully we made a very good loan signing in Phillips to cover the latter one.

The return to fitness of the first 2 will strengthen the squad for the run in and if we can find a player or 2 of ours to score some goals we could claw our way up another 2 or 3 places.

On balance, in Bulut's first season, successfully avoiding the relegation scares of the previous 2 seasons, his time so far will be judged a success.

Should he get a new contract and is properly supported in the summer window, to enable us to develop a playing style with a Plan B up his sleeve, there is the potential for a more productive season in 24/25.

As for a DoF, such a person is the Holy Grail of most City fans. Perhaps a shrubbery might be better. Just for Clingo.

 

[clingo]

I actually found this a reasonable read.
Maybe because most of it has been written in these threads anyway.
The only miss in the article was a debate on a DoF.
They must have missed our comments on that.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/cases-against-erol-bulut-cardiff-28923963

You're right and we've been plagiarised!

 

[BluefromBridgend]

The future of our players article I mentioned in my earlier post.

https://www.walesonline.co.uk/sport...kCopy&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=sharebar

 

[clingo]

I read that. There is a lot of sense in what is said.

I agree that for the sake of stability we should keep the revolving door closed and give him another contract. How long for is another matter.

That should give the players some confidence and a longer vision.

There was another WoL article listing every current player, in the squad and out on loan, and where they could be next season. Bulut staying should ensure the retention of most of those we want to keep.

There are other advantages in his ability to dip into the European market and by keeping us in the top half of the league, despite the embargo, he will have earned some credit with higher level clubs in the UK.

On the negative side he has made a number of tactical and selection errors which show he hasn't really understood the trials and tribulations of the Championship.

Can we put this down to naivety? If so surely he would have learned enough in the first half of the season to avoid the same problems in the second half. Looking at the recent games versus Swansea and Sunderland I don't think he did. But then he pulls results like Ipswich and Coventry out of the hat.

The article also mentions the point of what is our football style and do we have one. The answers appear to be don't know and no.

We have been hamstrung by Meite's and Etete's limitations up front and the signing of 2 circus acts in Ugbo (gone) and Diedhou (must go) as opposed to one decent signing. Much had been pinned on getting Kieffer in the January window and when that didn't happen we panicked and got the nearest one available in Diedhou who is no better than, possibly worse than, Ugbo. More money down the pan.

The long term injuries to Rambo, O'Dowda and McGuiness haven't helped. Thankfully we made a very good loan signing in Phillips to cover the latter one.

The return to fitness of the first 2 will strengthen the squad for the run in and if we can find a player or 2 of ours to score some goals we could claw our way up another 2 or 3 places.

On balance, in Bulut's first season, successfully avoiding the relegation scares of the previous 2 seasons, his time so far will be judged a success.

Should he get a new contract and is properly supported in the summer window, to enable us to develop a playing style with a Plan B up his sleeve, there is the potential for a more productive season in 24/25.

As for a DoF, such a person is the Holy Grail of most City fans. Perhaps a shrubbery might be better. Just for Clingo.

Yes, bring me one of those that looks nice but isn't too expensive.

 

[clingo]

Both articles seem reasonable to me.
So let's get Bulut signed up again.
That's assuming he wants to stay of course.

 

[BluefromBridgend]

Both articles seem reasonable to me.
So let's get Bulut signed up again.
That's assuming he wants to stay of course.

Good point Clingo. I hadn't considered that.

 

[BrizzleBluebird]

Yes, bring me one of those that looks nice but isn't too expensive.

Reckon you should hedge your bet and ask for two, just in case one isn't up to scratch...

 

[remote]

The article also mentions the point of what is our football style and do we have one. The answers appear to be don't know and no.

It's something I've referred to a number of times. With the managers who have had success, you've been able see what they're trying to acheive. They might have taken a few windows to get the personnel they wanted, or had an interim step to get there, but you could see the progression.
I don't feel that with Erol.
And his tinkering with starting line-ups exacerbates the feeling.
It's the main reason I'm not convinced by him.

And never mind the shrubbery, grab a herring and chop some trees down.

 

[ninian opinion]

Fair play to Glen, he covers a lot on his article and makes a decent case for and against Bulut.

I’m not convinced about him. Ok this was a debut season in a new country but I’m not sure this leopard will change his spots next season. His selections sometimes are baffling, and most of all his insistence in home games especially of the tedious slow build up from the back going from left to right across the box before the inevitable boot up field is painful to suffer.

Football is not a difficult game in theory to play. It’s how to do it in practice. We’re not expecting Man City standards but look at Ipswich, and before them in recent seasons, Brighton, Brentford, Bournemouth- those clubs were transformed by owners who got football, understood what the fans wanted and created a brand of attractive, exciting and most of all brought in skilful and adept players with a high tempo as well as putting attack to the fore.

What I’m driving at is the problem lies with the clubs owner and his lieutenants who just don’t seem to have a plan and make it up as they go along.

So the sooner Tan sells up and we get progressive and financially stable new owners supported by people qualified to run the football side of the business we’ll just be a club in limbo.

 

[clingo]

You'll get no argument from me regarding the lack of football management acumen displayed by Tan and his board. It would be a great day if we could find the right owner.

As far as Erol is concerned, while I'm still not sure about him I reckon he deserves that contract.

When you look at the season he's successfully achieved the target he was given and when anyone is given a one year contract, they're most likely to set out to reach the target. I also think he's had some tough luck with the embargo and the long term injuries to his two most influential players. Establishing a style when the style crafters are missing, is impossible I'd have thought. It just seems to me that he had to manage the squad for periods longer than a single game and that may account for some of the starting lineups.

However, I maintain that the contract length was the main influence in his work and at the end of the day, he achieved what was asked of him. He's taken a season to acclimatise, get to know the squad's strengths and weaknesses while not putting us in any danger. If course, that means he'll be under greater scrutiny next term if he stays.

 

[remote]

One of the things that surprised me in the article was the reference to ours being the 8th highest wage bill in the division.
Fair play to Tan for his spending, but he might feel aggrieved that he hasn't got more for his money.

Also, the bit that wasn't referred to in the article was the backroom staff.
It's one thing Erol not being up to speed with UK football, but if the coaches aren't either.
Also, is Erol head coach or manager? Quite different things.
Is it Erols vision and game plan letting us down, or the ability of the coaches to deliver on that plan?
Is Erol a suited manager like Wenger, or a track-suited manager like Taylor or Robson?

 

[Oldsparkey]

Just read through the last dozen or so posts - great discussion.

Here's some figures to add to the pot in a decent article/blog that published yesterday - very interesting...........

https://footballeconomyv2.blogspot.com/2024/04/substantial-owner-funding-fails-to.html

 

[BrizzleBluebird]

Just read through the last dozen or so posts - great discussion.

Here's some figures to add to the pot in a decent article/blog that published yesterday - very interesting...........

https://footballeconomyv2.blogspot.com/2024/04/substantial-owner-funding-fails-to.html

TBF that's quite a thought provoking article too.

Shows that we are beginning to move towards becoming a much more sustainable club, however that move towards sustainability is potentially also contributing towards our 'stagnation' as well.

Interesting contradiction regards the wages.... Can we really have slashed that much off yet still be the 8th highest as suggested by other articles???
I'd imagine most of our high earners are our loan players who we'll likely lose at the end of season anyhow.

Going back to our style of play, I briefly watched some of the highlights from the Coventry game and again there was enough in there to show we can play some decent stuff when the mood takes us (and I guess if the opposition allow us to some degree).
When we look back to some of our earlier games and 'phases' of other games such as Ipswich, the Jacks at home etc. we absolutely have the ability to play decent, attacking football.

It's this type of performance that I'm sure Bulut is trying to push us towards. If he's given a new deal he just needs to try instill more confidence in the squad to do these things more often and to have the bravery to not falter when the opposition are getting in our faces.... Believe in the methods and patterns of play....

I'm also potentially going to buck the general opinion and say I actually quite like it when he slams the players publicly for not doing their jobs.
It doesn't mean he isn't taking responsibility for his own part in defeats (I'm sure he's probably harder on himself more than anyone) but why shouldn't the players get called out if they aren't doing the jobs they are asked to do?
Players do 'hide' at times so highlight it if they do... We can't afford to carry passengers and one player not doing his job can then impact others massively.

I am confident that if we stick with Erol we'll begin to reap the rewards over time.