The only box to box he's doing now is Pizza Hut
The #LUFC Breakfast Debate (Tuesday 10th January)
- Thread starter ellandback
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To be honest I quite like Marsche and believe he does have something to offer. The big question is though and I think it was Doc who said the same, can he adapt and find an effective winning formula from what we have ?
It might not necessarily be more defensive as it's entirely possible he'll go more offensive, but whatever it is he needs to win matches.
There speaks the voice of experienceThe only box to box he's doing now is Pizza Hut
I’m not having a go at Marsch personally. I just don’t like his system. I happen to think it contributes to the individual errors because of the pressure it puts the defence under, particularly the centre backs. We struggle to play out from the back because the team are on top of each other as we’re so narrow forcing us to hit long and also why we can be a tough watch
Oh and meant to add, many keep saying how much stronger we are this season though points and position suggest not.
I genuinely think he's trying. He's tried to tweak his system a few times. He's not scared to drop underperforming players and he's moved people around to get more out of them.
Not everything has worked but a fair bit of it has. He's had one transfer window and I'd say he did okay with his signings. He's turned Rodrigo in to the striker we thought we bought. His best player Sinisterra hasn't been available yet. He has openly admitted the individual mistakes are costing us and that the players are somewhat afraid to do the right things on the pitch. He's realised that the left side of defence is prone to mistakes and he's brought Wober in to help. He's realised that Bamford can't be relied on and he looks like bringing Rutter in.
We're better at set pieces both ends. He's got Summerville playing after addressing his off field issues and getting him to be more professional and turned Greenwood in to a viable option in midfield.
He's not perfect. His system has holes in it. The playing staff need upgrading but he seems to be rectifying (or at least trying to rectify) the things most of us moaned about last year. This is only his 2nd window. I'm just willing to give him time rather than just jump on his back because we are not sitting in 10th place pushing for Europe whilst playing prime Bielsaball.
That there is the main problem, even though much of what Emu says is true.too many tweaks to his system leaving the CBs looking like asses all the time. Conceding record amounts of goals in a calendar year. Being no further forward under a new manager a year later. So I get where Emu and Milky come from however them is da breaks folks and we need to move away from the bottom fast as people are losing faith. This isn’t a hatred of Marsch as we all want him to succeed, but we have stood still for a year. Only a couple of games where we showed what we are capable of but in every other game we have had more downs than ups and players look like they don’t have a clue. Marsch’s own players effected now, he needs to sort it fast
Brentford are probably the best run club in Britain at the moment. They don't get much wrong. Fair play to them.
Fulham have been in and around the PL for years and they must have collected a few hundred million more than we have just in TV money. It's pretty arrogant to think we should be better established.
Then I look at some of our games where we have been the better side and yet found a way to lose. If just one or two of those games go our way then we are up and around 10th. Alot of ifs there admittedly but pretty much all clubs outside the top 6 or 7 clubs have their seasons defined by small margins. I think we got the ****ty end of the stick last year with injuries and this year we seem to just have this thing where every individual mistake results in a goal against us. Meanwhile at the other end we've failed to take big chances at big moments.
The table suggests we haven't improved on last season but in my opinion (which can backed up by stats) we have been far more competitive in games this season. I'd say we've only been played off the park against Brighton away and City at home. Even Brighton away Llorente should have snatched a draw at the end with a free header. A bit more luck, and a few less basic mistakes and we'd see that progression.
I say what I see and I see us as a side that alot more difficult to beat than last season. We've only lost by more than 1 goal 3 times this season. We stay in games now. At times at the end of Bielsa we were wondering how many it was going to be after 15 minutes. We are much more robust now.
I personally don't think it's a confidence issue, I think he's finding the physical demands too much for him. He needs to add some bulk to his torso.
Absolutely. Other teams noticed his early season form and now get players around him and he's not strong enough to hold them off. He's young, hopefully he can bulk up and deal with the attention.
Agreed. Probably a down payment of something like £5m. And if he goes on to fulfill all the add on clauses, including eventually playing for France, he’ll be worth a lot more than £30m.
Good deal all round if it happens. Looks absolute quality.
If you look at most of the metrics, we’re a midtable side. More of the game takes place in the opponents third than ours. We create plenty of chances our goals and xg for is reasonable. But we leak too many, our xg against is relegation battling level.
We’ve had countless debates as to system v individual as to the reasons. To me its a combination. I've done a *** packet little go at adding up unforced error’s made by our opponents that have directly led to goals… and done the same for us, and then estimated the likely points impact for and against.
In our favour:
We got + 2 points for Liverpool gifting us the first goal, Chelsea did as well but I’m ignoring that as we won 3 nil.
Not in our favour:
Everton: llorente inexplicably misses the goal creating pass - probably cost us 2 points
Double fck up at Leicester for first goal… applying same logic as Chelsea game… no impact, llorente fck up Brentford, again no impact
Rodrigo pass to saka v Arsenal - 1 point
Aaronson pass to scamaca at West Ham - 2 points
So 2 points gained 5 lost from clear and obvious mistakes. Net effect 3 points
That's without considering missed penalties, var howlers etc. or nitpicking on ‘should have done betters’ like the catalogue of errors at spurs… and ignoring howlers that likely didn’t change the result ie Brentford.
However, games where poor defending and/or pure bad luck cost us the game… spurs should have been 3 points, none var decision for first, individual mistakes for two others.
Then we have games where we’ve started brightly only to fck it up and change the momentum of games… Leicester double error to gift them a lead, palace score from a free header from a (stupid) free kick the first time they get in our half.
We battered Arsenal, missed penalty, missed chances.
All sides have hard luck stories and its fair to say we've also won points in games we could have drawn/lost - but point being we’ve definitely left points out there from individual errors, that had nothing to do with systemic gaps behind the fullbacks type stuff.
We’ve had countless debates as to system v individual as to the reasons. To me its a combination. I've done a *** packet little go at adding up unforced error’s made by our opponents that have directly led to goals… and done the same for us, and then estimated the likely points impact for and against.
In our favour:
We got + 2 points for Liverpool gifting us the first goal, Chelsea did as well but I’m ignoring that as we won 3 nil.
Not in our favour:
Everton: llorente inexplicably misses the goal creating pass - probably cost us 2 points
Double fck up at Leicester for first goal… applying same logic as Chelsea game… no impact, llorente fck up Brentford, again no impact
Rodrigo pass to saka v Arsenal - 1 point
Aaronson pass to scamaca at West Ham - 2 points
So 2 points gained 5 lost from clear and obvious mistakes. Net effect 3 points
That's without considering missed penalties, var howlers etc. or nitpicking on ‘should have done betters’ like the catalogue of errors at spurs… and ignoring howlers that likely didn’t change the result ie Brentford.
However, games where poor defending and/or pure bad luck cost us the game… spurs should have been 3 points, none var decision for first, individual mistakes for two others.
Then we have games where we’ve started brightly only to fck it up and change the momentum of games… Leicester double error to gift them a lead, palace score from a free header from a (stupid) free kick the first time they get in our half.
We battered Arsenal, missed penalty, missed chances.
All sides have hard luck stories and its fair to say we've also won points in games we could have drawn/lost - but point being we’ve definitely left points out there from individual errors, that had nothing to do with systemic gaps behind the fullbacks type stuff.
Maybe quit smoking milky
Seriously though without doing any calculations and solely relying on what the eyes are seeing I'd estimate we're around 4 points less than we should be. That's based upon the general quality of our performances which overall have been reasonably good.
The concern now is getting back into a winning habit because over the next 6 to 8 games we should be winning a few of them.
Maybe quit smoking milky
Seriously though without doing any calculations and solely relying on what the eyes are seeing I'd estimate we're around 4 points less than we should be. That's based upon the general quality of our performances which overall have been reasonably good.
The concern now is getting back into a winning habit because over the next 6 to 8 games we should be winning a few of them.
think that's probably a fair assessment jambo... and from some of my posts... it's evident that it's not that i've been smoking, but what i've been smoking that's the problem
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The difference is that I'm not a 50,000 a week sportsman paid to keep fit.There speaks the voice of experience
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