US Election

[brb]

Hilary was 6.5% in front of Trump, in Wisconsin, on 2016 Election Day and still ended up losing by something like half a percent.
Trump is covering all of his bases and IMO still has a huge following in the swing states. They will buy into whatever lies he keeps telling. The guy is an out an out grifter with no moral compass whatsoever.

Slightly off topic, I was talking to a couple of US colleagues around healthcare in the US and was really surprised that both were against free healthcare. Both were in favour of an insurance backed scheme, citing that they were reasonably young and healthy so don’t see why they should contribute to something they don’t use. Listening to their views on politics made me realise that it’s almost impossible to second guess how they would vote. The enthusiasm for Biden was slightly underwhelming, although I think Harris is a really smart move for Biden and could certainly sway the undecided.

I suppose that's the problem with decisions based on age. Anyone of them could be involved in an unexpected accident, not even of their own doing, or a life threatening condition, when faced with those prospects, they would then wish it was free, especially if it was a loved one that required care. It's a bit like youngsters not saving for a pension, because they feel either they will never be able to retire, or realistically might not make retirement age, so why should they. But as we know, the years soon pass you by, and before you know, you're faced with reality again. I saw the same mentality during the height of the coranavirus, should the elderly give up their beds. Then another stark reality falls, namely B&Q and Eastbourne Beach, and once again it went to show how selfish life can be. I'm sure history in a hundred years from now, will not have a mention about bog roll, demonstrating the sad face of humanity, in a so called civilised world. Basically my point being, the condition might not fit now, but at sometime, everything comes full circle and they could be decisions in later life, you live to regret.

 

[Treble]

It's a strange system certainly but Trump is only the 5th president to win the electoral vote and not the public vote so there are very few times when the president isn't actually the people's choice. They would need a major change to the Constitution to alter the voting system and that is unlikely to happen.

I was thinking more of the whole system including primaries. 30 years ago Ross Perot had plenty of money but the system was robust enough to ensure money wasn't enough on its own to get him elected. Now with media moguls like Murdoch together with 24 hour "news" channels and an openly biased/polarised media and fabricated propoganda on social media means someone like Trump and Biden rise to the top in their political parties, and ppl with better character, integrity and policies get squashed. And I can only see it getting worse with every election. The next Republican candidate for example is on to a winner because no matter how much of a **** he is, he'll still be seen as an improvement.

 

[Edelman]

Your friends are probably Republicans as they are against free health care.

To see ordinary people reigning against free healthcare and claiming it's a Communist ideal is ****ing bizarre.
We can criticise Britain for a lot but not this ****

 

[Treble]

To see ordinary people reigning against free healthcare and claiming it's a Communist ideal is ****ing bizarre.
We can criticise Britain for a lot but not this ****

If the NHS was being proposed in the UK today it would no doubt be seen in the same way

 

[johnsonsbaby]

I was thinking more of the whole system including primaries. 30 years ago Ross Perot had plenty of money but the system was robust enough to ensure money wasn't enough on its own to get him elected. Now with media moguls like Murdoch together with 24 hour "news" channels and an openly biased/polarised media and fabricated propoganda on social media means someone like Trump and Biden rise to the top in their political parties, and ppl with better character, integrity and policies get squashed. And I can only see it getting worse with every election. The next Republican candidate for example is on to a winner because no matter how much of a **** he is, he'll still be seen as an improvement.

I'm pretty much apolitical and don't have any great depth of knowledge to bring to a politics discussion. Recently though with the rise of BLM and transgender issues and gender pay gaps etc. I've taken an interest to see what drives this stuff. My conclusion is that basically there's a right and a left, a far right and a far left with more extreme views, very little in the middle and as from time immemorial, wherever you place yourself on that spectrum you will vote for whoever is standing for your side. The same applies here and the US they're just called different names.

 

[Edelman]

I suppose that's the problem with decisions based on age. Anyone of them could be involved in an unexpected accident, not even of their own doing, or a life threatening condition, when faced with those prospects, they would then wish it was free, especially if it was a loved one that required care. It's a bit like youngsters not saving for a pension, because they feel either they will never be able to retire, or realistically might not make retirement age, so why should they. But as we know, the years soon pass you by, and before you know, you're faced with reality again. I saw the same mentality during the height of the coranavirus, should the elderly give up their beds. Then another stark reality falls, namely B&Q and Eastbourne Beach, and once again it went to show how selfish life can be. I'm sure history in a hundred years from now, will not have a mention about bog roll, demonstrating the sad face of humanity, in a so called civilised world. Basically my point being, the condition might not fit now, but at sometime, everything comes full circle and they could be decisions in later life, you live to regret.

Good post !
It's a strange world .
We live in a society that has more freedom ( generally ) than previous generations .
We dont have the same.authority than we did 50 tears ago .
If I did wrong then and a nieghbour complained I got a clip around the ear .
Nowadays parents would back their kids and admonish responsibility .
My main concern is the shift to fiscal control.
Can we really trust data protection ?
Does crypto circumnavigate it in the future ?

 

[Edelman]

Trumps live update on now !
Hes blaming Biden !!
****ING HELL !

 

[Tobes]

To see ordinary people reigning against free healthcare and claiming it's a Communist ideal is ****ing bizarre.
We can criticise Britain for a lot but not this ****

Because they’ve been groomed and gaslit by those who can easily afford to self insure and who don’t want to pay for anyone else to have what they can afford.

It goes back to the basic fundamentals of what society actually is. You’d have thought that having just gone through what we have with COVID and seen the true value of society, then people might have they’re position on this, but I’d not have money on it.

 

[johnsonsbaby]

To see ordinary people reigning against free healthcare and claiming it's a Communist ideal is ****ing bizarre.
We can criticise Britain for a lot but not this ****

What Treble said and also it's not really free. To introduce a free healthcare system where there hasn't been one (USA does have Medicare and Medicaid) would be huge.

 

[Treble]

I'm pretty much apolitical and don't have any great depth of knowledge to bring to a politics discussion. Recently though with the rise of BLM and transgender issues and gender pay gaps etc. I've taken an interest to see what drives this stuff. My conclusion is that basically there's a right and a left, a far right and a far left with more extreme views, very little in the middle and as from time immemorial, wherever you place yourself on that spectrum you will vote for whoever is standing for your side. The same applies here and the US they're just called different names.

Well put, that's pretty much it. Except that's the state of play today. I disagree about time immemorial it wasn't always like that. Very much symptomatic of the last 10 years.

 

[Edelman]

Because they’ve been groomed and gaslit by those who can easily afford to self insure and who don’t want to pay for anyone else to have what they can afford.

It goes back to the basic fundamentals of what society actually is. You’d have thought that having just gone through what we have with COVID and seen the true value of society, then people might have they’re position on this, but I’d not have money on it.

Up until a few years ago I thought of the USA as a Bastian of freedom and common sense !
I Certainly dont now .
This live update is sheer embarrassment !

 

[Archers Road]

If the NHS was being proposed in the UK today it would no doubt be seen in the same way

Powerful interest groups, backed by the right wing press - and, of course, the Tories - fought tooth and nail to prevent it’s formation in the first place.

They lost though. Powerful interest groups can be defeated, sometimes. It’s good to be reminded of that, at a time when utter ****s seem to be winning everywhere.

 

[Tobes]

What Treble said and also it's not really free. To introduce a free healthcare system where there hasn't been one (USA does have Medicare and Medicaid) would be huge.

Only the US already spend twice as much on healthcare spending per capita than we do. So no, not really. They just need to stop big phama taking the ****ing piss.

 

[Tobes]

Up until a few years ago I thought of the USA as a Bastian of freedom and common sense !
I Certainly dont now .
This live update is sheer embarrassment !

Their entire system is as bent as a nine bob.

 

[Edelman]

Their entire system is as bent as a nine bob.

I cant believe that people can watch this and believe it !

 

[johnsonsbaby]

Well put, that's pretty much it. Except that's the state of play today. I disagree about time immemorial it wasn't always like that. Very much symptomatic of the last 10 years.

It goes back longer than 10 years. I remember hearing 25 years ago 'you could put a monkey in for Labour round here and it'd win' and that would have been true at least another 25 years before that if not, as I said, time immemorial.

 

[Treble]

Powerful interest groups, backed by the right wing press - and, of course, the Tories - fought tooth and nail to prevent it’s formation in the first place.

They lost though. Powerful interest groups can be defeated, sometimes. It’s good to be reminded of that, at a time when utter ****s seem to be winning everywhere.

It can but it would require a completely compromised approach. And even then it would be a hundred times harder anything Attlee experienced.

 

[johnsonsbaby]

Only the US already spend twice as much on healthcare spending per capita than we do. So no, not really. They just need to stop big phama taking the ****ing piss.

It's not big pharma it's the insurance companies.

 

[Tobes]

I cant believe that people can watch this and believe it !

“The party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.”

George Orwell 1984.

It’s the ultimate result of allowing public discourse to be flooded with lies and untruths that are somehow given equivalence with facts. Trump has dumbed down and abused the office of POTUS to a level I doubt anyone thought possible.

 

[Tobes]

It's not big pharma it's the insurance companies.

It’s both.