The Nitty Gritty of the BLM movement

[Nads]

One statistic the never wheel out.

Say there’s 30% players black, and lets say 5% managers, I haven’t the inclination to look up the actual numbers but I’ll be ballpark.

That doesn’t translate to 5% managers, it’s not that simple as the formula changes.

Football club playing staff - 28-40
Football club manager - 1

That then makes the higher percentage number in the squads something like 8-10 times as heavily weighted in their favour for the smaller number.

Sadly the black gaffer that have had chances have all been poor.

Say there’s 3 black players in 30 man squad, then there’s 11 chances for a spot in team, but only one as a gaffer, the % chances drop massively.

 

[Evil Jimmy Krankie]

So, hypothetically speaking, if a black American man assaults a black African man and that black African man calls the police and the black American man is arrested without incident is he allowed to continually shout black lives matter at the police officers who arrested him? Asking for a friend.

 

[BigPete]

I didn't say you were a racist. Again, this is why I stopped, because people read what they want to read.

Oh my apologies then mate I just thought you tarred me with the racist brush because I wouldnt bend the knee over Flloyd.

Tbf though just because he hadnt been charged in 13 years doesnt necessarily mean he wasnt still committing crime.

Maybe he just got better at not getting caught?

 

[Kittenmittons]

One statistic the never wheel out.

Say there’s 30% players black, and lets say 5% managers, I haven’t the inclination to look up the actual numbers but I’ll be ballpark.

That doesn’t translate to 5% managers, it’s not that simple as the formula changes.

Football club playing staff - 28-40
Football club manager - 1

That then makes the higher percentage number in the squads something like 8-10 times as heavily weighted in their favour for the smaller number.

Sadly the black gaffer that have had chances have all been poor.

Hughton wasn't. Moore wasn't. Ince wasn't for the first part of his career. Campbell wasn't (he saved Macclesfield and people completely overlook this is a ****ing amazing achievement from being adrift by 5 points at the bottom of the entire football league). NES isn't.

1 in 3 players is black, but that was 1 in 5 in 2002. If we assume that the overwhelming majority of football coaches have played the game professionally (there are exceptions) then it is incongruous that the number of black managers is far below 20% and whatever the reason, it is not wrong to suggest that something can be done about it.

I thought Danny Rose made the best point - it's likely about black players feeling that they are going to get an opportunity by seeing more black coaches given opportunities like their white counterparts. When they see Campbell and Ince turned into joke figures after distinguished playing careers for England, and forced to start at clubs who are as low as possible in the football league, then it is valid to say that it is not incentivising black players to potentially waste their time on something that will end up in them having to 'prove themselves' far more than their white counterparts who are given opportunities with more resource and prestige.

 

[Kittenmittons]

So, hypothetically speaking, if a black American man assaults a black African man and that black African man calls the police and the black American man is arrested without incident is he allowed to continually shout black lives matter at the police officers who arrested him? Asking for a friend.

I think although I suspect this is disingenuous, I'll engage in the hope that it's going to be reasonable.

Your situation is confusing and it's hard to see what point you're trying to make. If the black guy was arrested without incident, then he doesn't have a case to use BLM as a banner (imo).

Nobody in BLM is saying that black african lives are worth less than black American lives. Nobody has said that modern slavery, or other issues that impact ethnic minorities disproportionately, are ok or not worth making a demonstration for. They haven't tried to minimise them at all. The focus at the moment is on something that was caught on camera and brought a message that even white people in America finally saw with their own eyes - it has momentum and is within our societies' power to control and directly impact.

I've said it before, but if we get behind BLM, I think a fairer society will develop in future from that where causes are equitably supported by marginalised and economically disadvantaged groups.

If we shout it down, I think it weakens our attempts to get people to recognise that we in the North East suffer from decades of mismanagement and under-funding, being disproportionately the victims of government policy and cuts.

 

[Owld Feller]

So, hypothetically speaking, if a black American man assaults a black African man and that black African man calls the police and the black American man is arrested without incident is he allowed to continually shout black lives matter at the police officers who arrested him? Asking for a friend.

I think that's about the size of it.

 

[Owld Feller]

I think although I suspect this is disingenuous, I'll engage in the hope that it's going to be reasonable.

Your situation is confusing and it's hard to see what point you're trying to make. If the black guy was arrested without incident, then he doesn't have a case to use BLM as a banner (imo).

Nobody in BLM is saying that black african lives are worth less than black American lives. Nobody has said that modern slavery, or other issues that impact ethnic minorities disproportionately, are ok or not worth making a demonstration for. They haven't tried to minimise them at all. The focus at the moment is on something that was caught on camera and brought a message that even white people in America finally saw with their own eyes - it has momentum and is within our societies' power to control and directly impact.

I've said it before, but if we get behind BLM, I think a fairer society will develop in future from that where causes are equitably supported by marginalised and economically disadvantaged groups.

If we shout it down, I think it weakens our attempts to get people to recognise that we in the North East suffer from decades of mismanagement and under-funding, being disproportionately the victims of government policy and cuts.

Yet another BORING attempt by the remaining SA to attract attention.

He appears to need it in the way that most need oxygen.

 

[Smug in Boots]

The only reason this thread is fading away is because any of us who have tried to make any point at all have been shouted down by people who refuse to acknowledge any specific instances of racism that have been highlighted by BLM, who spout racist tropes about black criminality and who refuse to even countenance that centuries of outright discrimination might have played a role in ensuring that black and ethnic minority people in the UK are more likely to exist in poverty, crime and violence.

Eventually, you just say 'what's the point?' - if I was allowed to have those conversations without people losing their rag because they don't like what I'm saying, then I'd continue, but they don't, so I'm not going to spend much time debating when it will inevitably end in wet blankets crying about how they don't like when they're compared with people they align with in America who are outright, unashamed racists.

But you just saying that it's over is bollocks, it'll still be a big thing even if the initial anger is translating into more considered use of time and energy. People walked away from these discussions because we've realised that there's no point in arguing with people who claim to be 'anti-racism' but can't bring themselves to acknowledge that race might be a factor when someone calls someone a 'F*cking N*gger' after they contribute to someone's death.

Why focus on those people when there are people out there who are open-minded enough to at least consider that racism may be a big issue for black people in Britain?



Chalk another one up for the things you agree with racists about, but don't like to have pointed out.

Terrible when that happens to be fair ...

... here's just a selection of your unsurpassed debating skills on this thread so far


"But you just saying that it's over is bollocks."

"Also I was 9 years old you ****ing simpleton."

"Where did I do that? Stop crying you fanny. The snowflake brigade strikes again, can't handle disagreement so they scream like bairns."

"What a load of absolute bollocks."

"The rest of it is absolute ****e and based on your own opinion that is utterly unqualified."

"You weren't getting enough attention in the other threads smug?

There's so much ****e in this thread it ****ing reeks, but I don't have time to get into it."

So much bad language, personal attacks and shouting ...

... just like these racists you keep going on about.

 

[Sandy Camel]

The only reason this thread is fading away is because any of us who have tried to make any point at all have been shouted down by people who refuse to acknowledge any specific instances of racism that have been highlighted by BLM, who spout racist tropes about black criminality and who refuse to even countenance that centuries of outright discrimination might have played a role in ensuring that black and ethnic minority people in the UK are more likely to exist in poverty, crime and violence.

Eventually, you just say 'what's the point?' - if I was allowed to have those conversations without people losing their rag because they don't like what I'm saying, then I'd continue, but they don't, so I'm not going to spend much time debating when it will inevitably end in wet blankets crying about how they don't like when they're compared with people they align with in America who are outright, unashamed racists.

But you just saying that it's over is bollocks, it'll still be a big thing even if the initial anger is translating into more considered use of time and energy. People walked away from these discussions because we've realised that there's no point in arguing with people who claim to be 'anti-racism' but can't bring themselves to acknowledge that race might be a factor when someone calls someone a 'F*cking N*gger' after they contribute to someone's death.

Why focus on those people when there are people out there who are open-minded enough to at least consider that racism may be a big issue for black people in Britain?



Chalk another one up for the things you agree with racists about, but don't like to have pointed out.

In much the same way, people like myself who raise a valid criticism of the BLM and their complete lack of acknowledgement of modern day slavery, we just get ignored. As you say, what's the point in trying to engage with people who ignore you.

 

[Smug in Boots]

Smug, "Asking people to bend their knee for a convicted criminal will never catch on here."

Chalk another one up for the things you agree with racists about, but don't like to have pointed out.

If I had a problem with it being pointed out I wouldn't post it on a public forum you clown. I posted it specifically so people would see it.
I don't care who agrees, or not, it doesn't make me a racist in any way. I agree that Ashley is a rotter, doesn't make me a Mag.

Incidentally, bending the knee hasn't caught on and never will ...

... so I'm right and there's no denying that fact.

 

[Nads]

Hughton wasn't. Moore wasn't. Ince wasn't for the first part of his career. Campbell wasn't (he saved Macclesfield and people completely overlook this is a ****ing amazing achievement from being adrift by 5 points at the bottom of the entire football league). NES isn't.

1 in 3 players is black, but that was 1 in 5 in 2002. If we assume that the overwhelming majority of football coaches have played the game professionally (there are exceptions) then it is incongruous that the number of black managers is far below 20% and whatever the reason, it is not wrong to suggest that something can be done about it.

I thought Danny Rose made the best point - it's likely about black players feeling that they are going to get an opportunity by seeing more black coaches given opportunities like their white counterparts. When they see Campbell and Ince turned into joke figures after distinguished playing careers for England, and forced to start at clubs who are as low as possible in the football league, then it is valid to say that it is not incentivising black players to potentially waste their time on something that will end up in them having to 'prove themselves' far more than their white counterparts who are given opportunities with more resource and prestige.

I agree with Hughton, Moore had a quick run then fell apart and couldn’t halt the slide, he showed nothing to justify another job.

Ince and Campbell have largely failed, both have had more than one chance.

Aren’t the numbers further skewered by the huge amount of coaches brought from abroad further reducing the pot?

I personally have no doubt that if I black manager proved his worth he would be considered by major clubs, most white managers aren’t either.

There’s a gap there, but it’s nothing near as simple as a numbers game and saying it is is twisting for the agenda.

Hughton has turned down several jobs since Brighton of course. He wants to be back in the PL and that’s difficult for anyone, regardless of skin.

 

[BigPete]

I think Sols problem is more that he is racist and eager to play the race card at any given moment.

Not worth the risk..

 

[Smug in Boots]

I think Sols problem is more that he is racist and eager to play the race card at any given moment.

Not worth the risk..

He comes across as a bit thick imo, especially when.he tries to use analogies, etc ...

... never seems to be able to finish his sentences.

The black Gazza

 

[BigPete]

He comes across as a bit thick imo, especially when.he tries to use analogies, etc ...

... never seems to be able to finish his sentences.

The black Gazza

He was an amazing defender no doubt about that

 

[Kittenmittons]

Terrible when that happens to be fair ...

... here's just a selection of your unsurpassed debating skills on this thread so far


"But you just saying that it's over is bollocks."

"Also I was 9 years old you ****ing simpleton."

"Where did I do that? Stop crying you fanny. The snowflake brigade strikes again, can't handle disagreement so they scream like bairns."

"What a load of absolute bollocks."

"The rest of it is absolute ****e and based on your own opinion that is utterly unqualified."

"You weren't getting enough attention in the other threads smug?

There's so much ****e in this thread it ****ing reeks, but I don't have time to get into it."

You, and your little pal, seem quite hysterical recently if you don't mind me saying. I've no idea what you're trying to say most of the time tbh.

It just comes across as attention seeking tbh.

You've no idea what a clown you make yourself look and no idea how to debate without appearing pompous.

Bollocks.

you idiot

sound like a full blown prick

"Our next contestant is Kittenmittons.
Welcome to Mastermind 2020, your specialised subject is 'missing the point' please take the chair .... "

another fictional fact from the board fantasist.

TBH you're just shyte at this and, sorry to say, as boring as can be.

you're just shouting hysterically.

You're an idiot

Are you deliberately acting thick ...

Unlike yourself I don't discriminate by colour, creed or religion.

I've no intention of allowing you to take up the idiot cudgel, from your idiotic tag mate Shameless, so I won't bother to correct everything you've claimed.

pathetic.


I'm up to page 6 and these were aimed directly at me, I've ignored plenty more that are aimed at people 'like' me.

 

[Smug in Boots]

He was an amazing defender no doubt about that

I admired him as a player, excellent.

 

[Smug in Boots]

You, and your little pal, seem quite hysterical recently if you don't mind me saying. I've no idea what you're trying to say most of the time tbh.

It just comes across as attention seeking tbh.

You've no idea what a clown you make yourself look and no idea how to debate without appearing pompous.

Bollocks.

you idiot

sound like a full blown prick

"Our next contestant is Kittenmittons.
Welcome to Mastermind 2020, your specialised subject is 'missing the point' please take the chair .... "

another fictional fact from the board fantasist.

TBH you're just shyte at this and, sorry to say, as boring as can be.

you're just shouting hysterically.

You're an idiot

Are you deliberately acting thick ...

Unlike yourself I don't discriminate by colour, creed or religion.

I've no intention of allowing you to take up the idiot cudgel, from your idiotic tag mate Shameless, so I won't bother to correct everything you've claimed.

pathetic.


I'm up to page 6.

I'm not the one who's acting all self righteous, claiming I know better than everyone else, posting as if I'm a spokesman for BLM. You keep saying 'we left this debate' etc, as if dozens have been driven away.

When you say 'we' you actually just mean you and the idiot Shameless who was banned and you defended.

You're fooling no one but yourself ...

... although, to be fair, you are making a decent job of it.

 

[Kittenmittons]

I'm not the one who's acting all self righteous, posting as if you're a spokesman for BLM and saying 'we left this debate' as if dozens have been driven away.

When you say 'we' you actually mean you and the idiot Shameless who was banned and you defended.

I'm not acting self-righteous. I'm countering the idea that people have given up on BLM. You take that as self-righteous because it helps you justify abusing the **** out of me, as evidenced above.

 

[Owld Feller]

I'm not acting self-righteous. I'm countering the idea that people have given up on BLM. You take that as self-righteous because it helps you justify abusing the **** out of me, as evidenced above.

Always the victim, NEVER the instigator!!

 

[Smug in Boots]

I'm not acting self-righteous. I'm countering the idea that people have given up on BLM. You take that as self-righteous because it helps you justify abusing the **** out of me, as evidenced above.

You obviously are.

Who exactly are you spokesman for in this instance then ...

... I know your tactics are to always avoid anything you can't answer but try, just this once.

"People walked away from these discussions because we've realised that there's no point in arguing with people."