Off Topic SARS-CoV-2 Covid-19

Doors would be locked and curtains drawn CL....

 

Masks and gloves are the way forwards. It staggers me that more people don't wear them and I suspect the only reason the government won't recommend them is because they've been so crap at providing PPE for health workers and carers. The logic that it only prevents you spreading it, or minimises the spread, but doesn't stop you getting it, is flawed IMHO. If -- as the experts seem to all agree -- it reduces the spread, then if everyone wore them, then QED - it reduces the spread and therefore your chance of catching it too. The argument that it gives a false sense of security etc is also flawed. Just take the same precautions you would if you weren't wearing a mask and gloves. So, still social distance, still wash your hands, and your gloves, and sterilise your mask if it's re-useable. And insist on it for your whole household ...

 

I think you may have missed the point. Wearing masks will not prevent the spread of the virus. It reduces the spread.
The problem with masks is that the mask itself can be a problem.
Motorcyclists have to wear helmets, but that doesn’t stop them dying.
Car drivers have to obey several safety measures but that doesn’t stop car accidents.
I know that this may not

 

I don't think I have missed the point at all. If everyone wore a mask and gloves AND obeyed social distance rules, and washes hands etc etc then the spread would be massively reduced. It's a simple logical step from what most scientists admit, which is that wearing a mask has at least some effect in stopping someone spreading the virus.

 

It’s a tricky discussion
However when the key aim is to reduce the r0 figure to less than 1 (ie one person gets it but spreads it to less than one other people) then simply reducing, rather than completely preventing, is an important achievement.
I’m with Tigermaul. I suspect advice is issued taking into consideration availability of PPE
That also makes sense though as masks are more important in care homes than Aldi, but even face covering wouldn’t hurt, and would cause a slight reduction towards r0>1

 

I’ve been saying exactly this to the Missus for weeks now. As soon as they started saying that a mask doesn’t stop you getting the virus I said that may well be true but it would play a major part in stopping the spread if everyone wore one. Rocket science it ain’t. The clear issue, as you say, is that there aren’t enough masks available.

 

I sort of get why they count the numbers as they do, as that's how they know if it's under control, but are their any robust figures to show how many people have actually died OF the virus, rather than being declared dying WITH it, especially as some of those declarations will not be accurate? Isn't that a key factor in determining the real risk of reducing lock down?

 

Not sure we’ll ever know
Probably impossible to establish actually for people with more than one significant health problem
I think that to cut through everything the most important figure is overall deaths vs average deaths.
That covers that whole gambit from people with no symptoms who have died from it, to people with no covid who have died because they avoided going to hospital cos they were worried about catching it.
Doesn’t say ‘who died of covid 19’...but that’s probably not vital, or possible, to know?

 

There are definitely less people abiding the lockdown now. More on the road, more families shopping as a family, etc. They seem to think we’re over it.

 

Novelty value has worn off, the more people seen outside and the more will join them, As I said about the southern states of the USA opening up, either loads more are going to die or it will be shown that it was all an over reaction. TWT

 

Think I’ll stay in thanks and let other people’s time, or lack of it, tell

 

I would argue it is vital, because if there has been an increase in non-covid deaths, it was (arguably) the reaction to the virus, rather than the virus itself that was responsible.

 

You’re as bad, Madge

 

If I wear the cheap masks at work my glasses steam up, which proves they are useless, I now have a £30 one with changeable filters for dust, but it has a vent at the front, so that’s useless, but great for dust and my glasses don’t steam up, the only ones that seem to work are the N95 ones which can’t be bought anywhere because they are the ones the NHS use.

So until the NHS is fully stocked and the N95 become available, the Government won’t issue a mask wearing order.

 

Lying bastard, no one is as bad as you are. Steve Rico, unrivalled king of the ranters.

The views expressed in my posts are not necessarily mine.

 

Agreed. Are there stats comparing deaths in past years Dutch??

 

You might be right
Depends what you want the number for I suppose
Govt clearly disagree though or they’d be testing every deceased person for it

 

I believe it’s still the case that the WHO isn’t recommending widespread use of masks amongst the public. They risk spreading more disease rather than slow it. That might change though - for instance when travelling on public transport. The government is not yet ahead of this issue.