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Off Topic Trumpy pumpy.

Discussion in 'Liverpool' started by LuisDiazgamechanger, Aug 4, 2016.

  1. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

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    Tbh is 80% of axis forces were deployed on eastern front that tells you a huge amount.

    The aerial was was western allies. Strategic bombing was theirs for sure.

    The war imo was clear. By 1943 post kursk battle Germany was beaten...by Russia.

    If the western allies never landed in Normandy imo the Germans would have been beaten by Russia alone.

    Imo Greece and Yugoslavia was critical in 1941. Had Italy any competence or had Greece been ignored and Russia had been attacked 6/8 weeks earlier imo Moscow may gave fallen...

    However for me the point has to be the story told in the West thrown popular culture. The real history is rarely discussed. The Americans are indeed accredited with winning WWii just about on their own and it's through how the story is told in movies and even documentaries.

    We focus on d-day and the battle of Britain, perhaps el alemain and Sicily. There's were in fact minor battles compared to the huge battles in the east and in terms of lives lost hardly register.

    But we focus couldon Our glory, but the Russians and for good reason.

    Name 3 great wwii movies. Easy I think

    Name 3 wwii movies on eastern front... not that easy.
     
    #3141
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  2. Angry_Physics

    Angry_Physics Well-Known Member

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    I did tell you to not put any stock in my claim because I didn't provide you with the details :)
     
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  3. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

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    May I add most German civilians killed..... bomber command.
     
    #3143
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  4. Garlic Klopp

    Garlic Klopp Well-Known Member

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    "Name 3 wwii movies on eastern front... not that easy."

    Cross of Iron
    Stalingrad
    Enemy At The Gates
     
    #3144
  5. Angry_Physics

    Angry_Physics Well-Known Member

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    aye.

    I find it rather pathetic that recounts of German bombings of Guernica and Warsar were painted rightly as horrific and Dresden was painted as justified.

    US holds the record though, incendiary bombing of Tokyo killed about 100,000 women and children in one night and 40,000 men and gov officials, defenders and so on
     
    #3145
  6. Garlic Klopp

    Garlic Klopp Well-Known Member

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    Both Hitler & Napoleon found out that Russia is a bloody big place and very cold. The Russian winter helped defeat both of them.
     
    #3146
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  7. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

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    Yeah Japan was mostly wood and paper and the US dropped incendiaries knowing what they would do.
     
    #3147
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  8. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

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    I got 1st and 3rd. Who was in "stalingrad"?
     
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  9. Angry_Physics

    Angry_Physics Well-Known Member

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    Not seen Cross of Iron, Stalingrad is awful imo and Enemy at the Gates was a complete myth as far as Vasily Zaytzev is concerned.

    Zaytzev was in fact a medic who had panicked and shot a famous Russian pilot dead as he parachuted down over Stalingrad.
    In True soviet propaganda fashion, they took this morale smash and turned it into a propaganda coup, and created the fantasy of Zaytzez which inspired thousands of Russian snipers who did catastrophic damage to the German officer core in Stalingrad

    Source, Russian journalist in Stalingrad, Vasily Grossman, recounted by Anthony Beaver in his book Vasily Grossman
     
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  10. Solid Air 2

    Solid Air 2 Well-Known Member

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    the majority of the Luftwaffe spent the war in the west so not sure how the USSR destroyed it. The majority of the Werhmacht was destroyed in USSR but you ignore my points about resources and the splitting of resources i.e. the 10000 88mm guns the Germans were using as AA weapons to protect against USAAF & RAF.
    I know perfectly well the sacrifice the people of the USSR made and the damage they did with that sacrifice . .
     
    #3150

  11. Angry_Physics

    Angry_Physics Well-Known Member

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    German towns and cities were also bombed simply because they burned well.

    it was a vicious war, I can't apply the morals of today to it, that would be stupid
     
    #3151
  12. Garlic Klopp

    Garlic Klopp Well-Known Member

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    Their are two films of that name. One from the Russian point of view made in 2013, which I have not seen, and a German film from 1993 which I have on DVD. It shows how desperate the Germans became to capture Stalingrad and how the Russian winter affected the troops and how demoralized they became. It is very good.
     
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  13. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

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    Cross of iron is a story about a German soldier and is made with James Coburn.

    Stalingrad is made i think in Russia or with Russians.

    Enemy at the gates is western interpretation of legend
     
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  14. Solid Air 2

    Solid Air 2 Well-Known Member

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    been a couple of Russian ones showing on Sky recently Moscow 1942 and another whose title i can't remember about female sniper at Sevastapool
     
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  15. Angry_Physics

    Angry_Physics Well-Known Member

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    The lutfwaffe for example all but destroyed it's own transport fleet just trying to supply Stalingrad after the 6th army were cut off. This was after 3 years of war there.

    By the time Allied Bombing began in earnest later in the war, Germany had assigned almost all of it's remaining effective airforce to take down bombers over Germany, night and day fighters. By that time the airforce was very depleted.

    Then Allied long range fighter escorts furthered the demise of the Luftwaffe, by 1944 were nothing more than cannon fodder for marauding Allied "day" fighters.
     
    #3155
  16. Garlic Klopp

    Garlic Klopp Well-Known Member

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    Cross of Iron is a very good film, it follows a group of German soldiers as they retreat in the face of the Russian advance. They end up behind enemy lines and have to find their way back to their own lines, well worth a watch. James Coburn is the biggest star in it, I think he was in the US Army, but not in WW2
     
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  17. Angry_Physics

    Angry_Physics Well-Known Member

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    Interpretation of a myth that does not even exist in Russian military documents :D
     
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  18. Angry_Physics

    Angry_Physics Well-Known Member

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    I'll have to check it out. I can't watch Hollywood war films of any kind any more. Tell me it's not a Hollywood movie..
     
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  19. Solid Air 2

    Solid Air 2 Well-Known Member

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    have you read Antony Beevors Stalingrad - highly recommended if not.
     
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  20. moreinjuredthanowen

    moreinjuredthanowen Mr Brightside

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    On the other hand without even trying.

    Battle of Britain.
    Patton
    Battle of bulge
    The longest day
    Private Ryan
    The great escape
    Escape to victory <laugh>
    Von Ryan's express
    Band of brothers though not a movie
    Schindlers list
    A bridge too far
    Das boot
    Kelkys heros (a personal favorite)
    Dirty dozen
    Big red one
    Fury
    inglorious
    Sink the Bismarck
    Dambusters
    Desert fox
    Guns of navarone
    Force 10
    Tuskegee
    Valkire
    Hell is for heros

    Others one I can't think of name with yanks training special forces in Scotland. James Garber was in it.

    I've left out Pacific based movies

    Like midway etc
     
    #3160

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