Effect of Brexit

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superhorns said:
So are you calling them 'stupid' or 'gullible'. ?
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Certainly gullible to repeatedly fall for the same old **** time and time again. Stupid? Well, I wouldn't call most people 'stupid' for voting Tory. I wouldn't rule it out in all cases, though. ;)

The truth is some people have stupid reasons for voting for all parties. Some people vote because they "always have" or their parents vote that way, or whatever.

The point is you allude to some perfect democracy in this country, which patently we don't.
 
Since 2010 there has been no clear support for any party to run the country. There will always be those who out of some blind allegiance to a party will vote in one way. The government therefore is elected by a small number of floating voters, and by their nature they can change their vote in the blinking of an eyelid. There is no clear agreement in the UK at present as to what route it should take. The party in government has to try and find policies that appeal to the majority if they want to retain power. The last election showed that they have failed.
 
There are only two political parties in the UK that can form a government. Since 2010 the electorate have clearly chosen the Conservatives over the Labour Party. Since 2015 the Lib Dems have been rejected as a political force, returning to a small protest party. 70% of those recently polled want the government to get a move on with Brexit a.s.a.p. The present Tory government has every chance to govern for another five years.
 
superhorns said:
There are only two political parties in the UK that can form a government. Since 2010 the electorate have clearly chosen the Conservatives over the Labour Party. Since 2015 the Lib Dems have been rejected as a political force, returning to a small protest party. 70% of those recently polled want the government to get a move on with Brexit a.s.a.p. The present Tory government has every chance to govern for another five years.
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Have you taken to rewriting history now? 2010 and 2017 the Tories couldn't form a government without getting support from others. Even now they could be quite easily beaten on votes if a handful of their MPs follow their convictions.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
Have you taken to rewriting history now? 2010 and 2017 the Tories couldn't form a government without getting support from others. Even now they could be quite easily beaten on votes if a handful of their MPs follow their convictions.
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The Conservatives were clearly the largest party in 2010, 2015 and 2017 which is why they formed the government. The electorate clearly did not trust the opposition to govern, not surprising really after the previous Labour administration.
 
superhorns said:
The Conservatives were clearly the largest party in 2010, 2015 and 2017 which is why they formed the government. The electorate clearly did not trust the opposition to govern, not surprising really after the previous Labour administration.
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What must be alarming for the Tories is that they are running out of coalition partners - the Lib Dems will never go with them again and the Ulster Unionists will very soon regret their decision. This would mean that the Tories will never be in government again other than through a majority - this is their last coalition. Labour, by contrast, have multiple possibilities because every other party is closer to them on policy issues than they are to the Tories.
 
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There maybe only two parties that can form a government, but there are other parties that can stop them having a majority. In 2010 the Tory party gained 10.7 million votes, but Labour and Liberal parties gained 15.4 million votes.
 
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oldfrenchhorn said:
There maybe only two parties that can form a government, but there are other parties that can stop them having a majority. In 2010 the Tory party gained 10.7 million votes, but Labour and Liberal parties gained 15.4 million votes.
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Without the bad advise May was given on elderly care and pensioner benefits the Tories would still have a majority. In any case we are on course for continuous Tory control for 17 years.

The main deciding factor is seats not votes. The Labour Party is still a long way behind on seats and the if the boundary changes can be implemented it would further assist the Tories to remain the natural political party for UK government.
 
superhorns said:
Without the bad advise May was given on elderly care and pensioner benefits the Tories would still have a majority. In any case we are on course for continuous Tory control for 17 years.

The main deciding factor is seats not votes. The Labour Party is still a long way behind on seats and the if the boundary changes can be implemented it would further assist the Tories to remain the natural political party for UK government.
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Diane Abbott maths!!! - 12 years
 
"Without the bad advise May was given" which she accepted despite being told that it wasn't a good idea to hold an election. Great judgement on her behalf I would say. The boundary changes have been kicked into the long grass so don't hold your breath on that one.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
"Without the bad advise May was given" which she accepted despite being told that it wasn't a good idea to hold an election. Great judgement on her behalf I would say. The boundary changes have been kicked into the long grass so don't hold your breath on that one.
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I can understand why she was tempted, she had just won a landslide victory in the local elections and was one of the most popular PMs in UK history at that time. As Macron is currently proving popularity does not always last very long. She should have stuck to traditional Tory policies, going wishy washy was not the answer. The Lib Dem's poor result showed that is not the area to aim for.
 
The UK will have boundary reform final proposals ready in 2018. The best time to reduce the parliamentary number of seats by 50 is the 2022 elections.
 
A total disaster for her that just showed up how bad she was at judging the mood of the country. I will agree that she thought she would increase her majority in numbers when she called it, but the rise of Corbyn from almost nowhere to where he stands today shows just how popular she actually is. She is now a total lame duck, and anyone who appears to be associated with her views is equally damaged.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
A total disaster for her that just showed up how bad she was at judging the mood of the country. I will agree that she thought she would increase her majority in numbers when she called it, but the rise of Corbyn from almost nowhere to where he stands today shows just how popular she actually is. She is now a total lame duck, and anyone who appears to be associated with her views is equally damaged.
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There is a very strong and experienced Tory cabinet, she probably has a 50/50 chance of lasting several years. I would like to see a Tory PM who is a Brexit enthusiast with traditional Tory values. It is not a disaster just an inconvenience, a disaster would be if the Labour Party got anywhere near power, which is unlikely.
 
It would also appear that Tory party is preparing it's fans for some bad news. "We will still be paying into the EU after we have left, just not as much." Now that could be a slip of the tongue, or it could be deliberate so that later it could be said that we told you it would be the case.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
It would also appear that Tory party is preparing it's fans for some bad news. "We will still be paying into the EU after we have left, just not as much." Now that could be a slip of the tongue, or it could be deliberate so that later it could be said that we told you it would be the case.
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This is a non story. It is fairly obvious there would be some collaborations which the UK would wish to be part of and willing to pay for. If a ransom payment can be agreed for trade access then this is likely to be paid over a longer period to make it palatable to the British public.
 
superhorns said:
Maybe it is time a Tory with a less centrist attitude and a firm brexiteer took over, I give you Jacob Rees Mogg.

David Davis was most impressive on Andrew Marr this morning, we are lucky to have such an experienced and accomplished negotiator for the UK.
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Is this a way of controlling the threat from him or could it put him in poll position for a take over, hope so.

Jacob Rees-Mogg ‘could be PROMOTED as May considers REMOVING Boris Johnson from Cabinet’ JACOB Rees-Mogg could be promoted to the Prime Minister’s top team in her next reshuffle as Theresa May scrambles to keep her...
 
It amazes me that the whole UK stance is that we are right, reasonable sensible etc..... and the EU are bullying, aggressive etc.... Have the negotiators not stopped to think that their own behaviour may lead to the responses they are now getting?

Of course, they must also realise as the Express is saying today that there is no way round the conditions laid on them..... there is a price to pay etc.... .very different from the rhetoric expounded previously...
 
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