Match Day Thread Southampton vs Arsenal 10/05/2017 KO 7:45PM

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Ian Thumwood said:
I was originally going to respond to Onionman's comments about the anti-Puel brigade being Neanderthals but after tonight's performance and coming back to read the comments on this thread, I would have to agree. It was a decent performance and for 60 minutes Claude Puel got his tactics spot on. We played some of the best football I have seen us perform in recent weeks during the first half. Usually I am banging my head on the dash board whenever he comes on the radio post -match but I felt he was correct to say that Southampton did play well tonight.

I am not a fan of Puel's style of football and think he will be out of the door pretty swiftly at the end of the season. He had lost a good proportion of the supporters after the Hull but I think too many people on here have posted after being fired up by Dave Merrington's negative remarks post-match. Merrington has never been in favour of Claude Puel yet his analysis little that was positive yet the Saints performance did deserve some credit. Until the first goal went in, the match could have gone in any direction. Arsenal were woeful and this is probably one of the worst Arsenal teams I have seen, Both sides were guilt of poor passing and finishing in the final third. This was not unique to Saints. Players like Steve Davis, Cedric, Stephens and Bertrand all played well tonight.. Romeu was probably one of our weakest players.

There is a tendency to be over-protective towards Claude Puel on this board. However, the opprobrium poured against him on Radio Solent tonight was not justified. True, the finishing was poor and the later substitutions yet again unhinged the balance of the squad, but I think this was a half decent performance. Clearly the kind of swash-buckling performances we have seen under Poch and Koeman are alien to the kind of slow, continental football that Puel prefers and there are connoisseurs of this style on this board such as Fats and Onion who prefer this patient style of football. It is not my cup of tea at all and I have found much of this season to be a massive bore. The football has been largely unbearably boring. However, tonight was a decent performance and the criticisms of the ball being passed sideways or backwards demonstrated that many texting in to Solent tonight were not watching. It is fair to criticise poor performances but for much of tonight's game, Puel actually had the better of Wenger.
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I don't think Fats and Vin 'prefer' this style of football in fairness to them Ian, but otherwise I think this is a pretty spot on post.
 
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The Ides of March said:
A season like this was always going to happen given that SFC have been on an upward curve since the beginning of season 2009-2010 when the club found itself in League 1 and floundering on -10. How Saints react to this season's mini setback will set the narrative for the next few seasons. Do they stick with Puel - he is an intelligent man and wants his players to play in the French way where possession is paramount? If a side have players of the calibre of Barcelona it is excellent. Or even Sevilla or Athletic. It is then a case of chiselling an opening for the strikers. If there is a change of manager, then the narrative changes again and that might lead to a demise and we find ourselves playing the likes of Ipswich in season 2018-2019 as anyone from West Brom down in this season's PL could find themselves relegated next season. Just ask Newcastle fans for confirmation.
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As I've always said, it would feel a little premature in a lot of senses, but I wouldn't lose much sleep were CP to be replaced at the end of the season - depending entirely upon whom he was replaced with. If it's a clear upgrade (as per Adkins - Poch), well to a greater degree any sentiment goes out the window.
 
Dusan was on his holidays today, did diddly squat, didn't mark, didn't challenge, didn't chase back and gave Gabi no support whatsoever. My MoM was Cedric, closely followed by JS and RB. Jon Moss didn't have much to do, but what he did do was OK by me. Where is Jordy? I think I would like to see Hojbjerg play in place of Davis on Saturday.
 
Ian Thumwood said:
I was originally going to respond to Onionman's comments about the anti-Puel brigade being Neanderthals but after tonight's performance and coming back to read the comments on this thread, I would have to agree. It was a decent performance and for 60 minutes Claude Puel got his tactics spot on. We played some of the best football I have seen us perform in recent weeks during the first half. Usually I am banging my head on the dash board whenever he comes on the radio post -match but I felt he was correct to say that Southampton did play well tonight.

I am not a fan of Puel's style of football and think he will be out of the door pretty swiftly at the end of the season. He had lost a good proportion of the supporters after the Hull but I think too many people on here have posted after being fired up by Dave Merrington's negative remarks post-match. Merrington has never been in favour of Claude Puel yet his analysis little that was positive yet the Saints performance did deserve some credit. Until the first goal went in, the match could have gone in any direction. Arsenal were woeful and this is probably one of the worst Arsenal teams I have seen, Both sides were guilt of poor passing and finishing in the final third. This was not unique to Saints. Players like Steve Davis, Cedric, Stephens and Bertrand all played well tonight.. Romeu was probably one of our weakest players.

There is a tendency to be over-protective towards Claude Puel on this board. However, the opprobrium poured against him on Radio Solent tonight was not justified. True, the finishing was poor and the later substitutions yet again unhinged the balance of the squad, but I think this was a half decent performance. Clearly the kind of swash-buckling performances we have seen under Poch and Koeman are alien to the kind of slow, continental football that Puel prefers and there are connoisseurs of this style on this board such as Fats and Onion who prefer this patient style of football. It is not my cup of tea at all and I have found much of this season to be a massive bore. The football has been largely unbearably boring. However, tonight was a decent performance and the criticisms of the ball being passed sideways or backwards demonstrated that many texting in to Solent tonight were not watching. It is fair to criticise poor performances but for much of tonight's game, Puel actually had the better of Wenger.
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I agree that tonight was better than recent weeks however I feel it's still far too slow and if that is what Puel considers to be a 'fantastic' performance as per his post match interview on solent then we have to let him go.

For me, the problem starts at the back when we have possession. Our centre halves like to operate with the ball arojnd 5/10 yards short of the halfway line. The allows the other team to press us higher up the pitch and us easier to counter attack on. When we played Hull there centre halves were allowed to play 5/10 yards inside our half. That difference of 10/20 yards for me is the huge issue. We are that distance short of the goal in all positions as a result and even when we do get up the other end of the pitch the midfield is too slow to join the attack or too far away from the attack.

I guess in summary, I feel another manager could come in and change our style of play and improve results and performance hugely with no personal changes at all.. for me it is all down the to coaching of the players and style of play.
 
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Le Tissier's Laces said:
I don't think Fats and Vin 'prefer' this style of football in fairness to them Ian, but otherwise I think this is a pretty spot on post.
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Dead right. I thought Ian's post was spot on as you said. When we can get the ball forward to men we're dangerous. There wasn't enough movement from the likes of Tadic and Nathan was stranded out on the left wing. I'd have taken Dusan off, brought Sofianne on and had him and Nathan switching sides to confuse the back line, with Gabby running into space. Claude definitely got the better of Arsene for 60 minutes tonight. If only we could stick one or two of our chances away. Now we must work together for next season. A well balanced squad, a few additions and (hopefully) few or no losses and we will be much stronger.
 
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I reckon we should play all of Gabbi, Boufal, Tadic, Redmond, Long and Rodriguez on Saturday. I mean, Middlesbrough still wouldn't score if we put Clasie in goal so why the hell not? <laugh>
 
I think Maya was at fault for Girouds goal, but should he still have been on the pitch, he took a heck of a whack on the head and I am sure he wasn't completely right after it?
 
Decent first half, overun in the second half ... didn't take the chances we were given. Story of our season, really.
 
SaintsNumber7 said:
I agree that tonight was better than recent weeks however I feel it's still far too slow and if that is what Puel considers to be a 'fantastic' performance as per his post match interview on solent then we have to let him go.

For me, the problem starts at the back when we have possession. Our centre halves like to operate with the ball arojnd 5/10 yards short of the halfway line. The allows the other team to press us higher up the pitch and us easier to counter attack on. When we played Hull there centre halves were allowed to play 5/10 yards inside our half. That difference of 10/20 yards for me is the huge issue. We are that distance short of the goal in all positions as a result and even when we do get up the other end of the pitch the midfield is too slow to join the attack or too far away from the attack.

I guess in summary, I feel another manager could come in and change our style of play and improve results and performance hugely with no personal changes at all.. for me it is all down the to coaching of the players and style of play.
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I don't think there is much wrong with the defence. The problem is that there is too much of a gap between the midfield and the forwards coupled with a general lack of goals around the squad. The style of football is too slow. I agree with this. I also think that a different manager could come in with the same squad and get totally different performances. For me, the problem is not that Claude Puel is a useless coach, I feel it is more a case of him being unable to communicate his ideas to the players. If you listen to his interviews it is pretty clear that he does not have a wide enough vocabulary to express what he wants to say and the say English phrases appear to be used by him to mean different things.

All in all, I feel he has been unfortunate. The lack of a decent striker hampered his early season and the loss of the central defensive pairing has been catastrophic. However, I feel that Stephens has come in and done wonders ( almost a candidate for Player of the Season given where he has come from in August) and signing Gabbi should have rectified the problem. Personally, the whole situation is broken. I can't see Claude Puel turning this around next season. There will be the odd good performance like much of tonight, but we need someone who both entertains and gets results. I just think that he will ever win the supporters around and is too far gone. The likes of Merrington and the Dutch mob were pretty woeful Saints manager's in my opinion, but Puel seems to have the Branfoot hoodoo over him with a good proportion of supporters and I don't think he can ever win them back. On paper, he looked the perfect fit in August. It has not worked out and Saints need to start again, I feel.
 
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Saints Fan4Life said:
Decent first half, over-run in the second half ... didn't take the chances we were given. Story of our season, really.
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We weren't over-run in the second half. The first goal was pure class and the second was an error. In between, Saints were still attacking but guilty of making too many oases in the last third. There is no way that the result was a realistic reflection of this game. 0-0 would have been far more just, I think even as a non-apologist.
 
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Ian Thumwood said:
I don't think there is much wrong with the defence. The problem is that there is too much of a gap between the midfield and the forwards coupled with a general lack of goals around the squad. The style of football is too slow. I agree with this. I also think that a different manager could come in with the same squad and get totally different performances. For me, the problem is not that Claude Puel is a useless coach, I feel it is more a case of him being unable to communicate his ideas to the players. If you listen to his interviews it is pretty clear that he does not have a wide enough vocabulary to express what he wants to say and the say English phrases appear to be used by him to mean different things.
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he has a translator stood right next him in Black. Boufal also speaks french.
 
VocalMinority said:
he has a translator stood right next him in Black. Boufal also speaks french.
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Yes, you could hear someone interjecting during the interview tonight. However, if you listen to his comments, he always uses the same phrases even when apparently describing different things. He is not a commanding speaker but as someone who finds speaking French difficult because of my lack of vocabulary with this language, I can appreciate the problem he is having. It is not so much a literal translation issue word-by-word but more a case of trying to find the English for technical expressions.
 
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Ian Thumwood said:
I don't think there is much wrong with the defence. The problem is that there is too much of a gap between the midfield and the forwards coupled with a general lack of goals around the squad. The style of football is too slow. I agree with this. I also think that a different manager could come in with the same squad and get totally different performances. For me, the problem is not that Claude Puel is a useless coach, I feel it is more a case of him being unable to communicate his ideas to the players. If you listen to his interviews it is pretty clear that he does not have a wide enough vocabulary to express what he wants to say and the say English phrases appear to be used by him to mean different things.

All in all, I feel he has been unfortunate. The lack of a decent striker hampered his early season and the loss of the central defensive pairing has been catastrophic. However, I feel that Stephens has come in and done wonders ( almost a candidate for Player of the Season given where he has come from in August) and signing Gabbi should have rectified the problem. Personally, the whole situation is broken. I can't see Claude Puel turning this around next season. There will be the odd good performance like much of tonight, but we need someone who both entertains and gets results. I just think that he will ever win the supporters around and is too far gone. The likes of Merrington and the Dutch mob were pretty woeful Saints manager's in my opinion, but Puel seems to have the Branfoot hoodoo over him with a good proportion of supporters and I don't think he can ever win them back. On paper, he looked the perfect fit in August. It has not worked out and Saints need to start again, I feel.
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I think we are more or less on the same page here. I agree that his limited vocabulary doesn't help, his fantastic meaning is very different to our meaning. In his defence he could of took the easy option and used an interpreter like poch, and after following Koeman who was straight talking with good English it was a tough act to follow and it hasn't done him any favours with the fans.

I also don't think there is anything wrong with the defence but I would just like to see them operate that 5/10 yards higher up the pitch. It will push the other team further back and create those pockets that the likes of Tadic can thrive in. I really feel we are missing that at the minute. By the centre backs taking that positive touch the oppositions automatically take a step backwards, when they don't the oppositions midfielder automatically become on the front foot. Like I said in a previous post, I think this is actually the area we miss Virgil the most. How many times did we see him receive the ball and stride forward with it. He was also constantly telling the full backs and holding midfielders where to go. My only criticism of the current centre halves is they lack any leadership between them..
 
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Sorry all. I must be drunk or gone insane. I am agreeing with Ian tonight ;)

Maybe I should come back tomorrow when the alcohol/valium has worn off ;)

Either that or Ian is on the drugs :)


Seriously. Agree with most Ian is saying. We started and did well. Then it went a bit wrong. Subs were good, but we have lost too many at home this year. That was my last game at home this year. Shame really, but maybe we'll get to see if I am the jinx :) :)
 
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Ian Thumwood said:
Yes, you could hear someone interjecting during the interview tonight. However, if you listen to his comments, he always uses the same phrases even when apparently describing different things. He is not a commanding speaker but as someone who finds speaking French difficult because of my lack of vocabulary with this language, I can appreciate the problem he is having. It is not so much a literal translation issue word-by-word but more a case of trying to find the English for technical expressions.
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Im saying in training Eric can speak for him if he needs to. He goes over his ideas with black and then black can do a lot of the explaining if its technical. He's assistant manager. Black would be doing a lot of that even if Puel was English. not that i think thats the problem. We were creating a tonne of chances with the diamond.
 
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