Why is there such ignorance regarding FFP?
- Thread starter District Line
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Absolutely true. Guus Hiddink will run for his money. Though my main concern is China. Theyve got the fanbase, stadiums and government to back them. And they are already starting to pull in some big names like Barrios and Anelka. It's like Qatar but a gazillion times bigger.
Page 38 states that there is an acceptable deviation. This deviation rule is explained on page 36 which states that clubs are allowed to make a an aggregate loss of up to 45 million euros for the 2013/14 and 2014/15 seasons and an aggregate loss of up to 30 million euros for the 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18 seasons. After this the current amount of loss allowed for the 2018/19 season is 5 million euros, but they also state that they will decide on a lower amount (than the 45 and 30 millions) in due course. So as things stand, from the 2018/19 season, clubs would be allowed to make a loss of up to 5 million euros each season within what the FFP rules deem as a loss. That will be amended in the future.
Not only that, but if we make a profit in accordance with the FFP in any of the monitoring periods and then make a loss greater than allowed in the following monitoring periods, we can use that profit from the last two monitoring periods in order to subtract from the loss made. For example if in 2013/14 and 2014/15 we make a surplus of 10 million euros and in the 2015/16, 2016/17 and 2017/18 seasons we make have a deficit of 40 million euros, we can use the 10 million surplus to bring us back down to 30 million which would then bring us in accordance with the maximum allowed deviation.
Oh really? because I looked on page 26 and it said nothing of the sort.
On page 34 however it did say 9and I have highlighted the important bits for you as you seem to miss them out):
"2
Relevant expenses is defined as cost of sales, employee benefits expenses and
other operating expenses, plus either amortisation or costs of acquiring player
registrations, finance costs and dividends. It does not include
depreciation/impairment of tangible fixed assets, amortisation/impairment of
intangible fixed assets (other than player registrations), expenditure on youth
development activities, expenditure on community development activities, any
other non-monetary items, finance costs directly attributable to the construction
of tangible fixed assets, tax expenses or certain expenses from non-football
operations."
And again on page 72:
"Relevant expenses are decreased if the elements a) to e) in paragraph 3 include
any items below (detailed in part C):
g) Expenditure on youth development activities
h) Expenditure on community development activities
i) Non-monetary debits/charges
j) Finance costs directly attributable to the construction of tangible fixed assets
k) Expenses of non-football operations not related to the club"
Great, so with the more than 60 million loss over 2012, you're not going to make it. Thank you for confirming my story.
This means youth camps and field trips etc, not wages and facilities. And i already corrected my mistake, its page 24.
You surely are talking utter bollocks. But thanks for the drivel, it was a good read! You also state that YOUTH DEVELOPMENT only comprises of "field trips etc" What "trip" are you on?
Youth trips and field camps ..........Are you talking about football ?...........or grooming!
No youth camps, it's how FIFA defines it. Would have not been my choice of words either.
But like i said youth player wages, facilities, maintenance etc are no exception with FFP.
Here is the Italian youth camp in China:
[video=youtube;HBLF86D9n24]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBLF86D9n24[/video]
The music is horrid though.
Joke lost............I'm aware of the concept, But thanks.
I know, but you probably still listened to the horrid music
And you're welcome
Christ is he still banging on.
Once again Cove if we're going to get kicked out of Europe shouldn't you be urging us to spend not save?
Once again Cove if we're going to get kicked out of Europe shouldn't you be urging us to spend not save?
Dear Roman,
I hope you are reading this and taking note of what Cove and UIR are saying because apparently all your spending is going to mean the aim of building a team to RETAIN the CL is all in vain as we a will get kicked out of Europe anyway.
I have no idea how much you are paying those jokers at PricewaterhouseCoopers but I suggest you bin them and hire Cove and UIR instead.
Thanks
Unconcerned Chelsea Fan.
I hope you are reading this and taking note of what Cove and UIR are saying because apparently all your spending is going to mean the aim of building a team to RETAIN the CL is all in vain as we a will get kicked out of Europe anyway.
I have no idea how much you are paying those jokers at PricewaterhouseCoopers but I suggest you bin them and hire Cove and UIR instead.
Thanks
Unconcerned Chelsea Fan.
Dear Mr. Abramovich,
I am hereby giving notice that you can contact my agency for negatiations. It is the same as Eden Hazard(you already have their contact information i presume) and i expect a similar compensation for my services.
Warm regards,
Cove
Except that that particular loss takes everything into account which includes all player wages, along with any money spent on youth development and structure, maintenance and refurbishment of any and all facilities. Seriously, our actual profits and losses and the FFP profits and losses are have two different formats. No player who was contracted pre June 2010 will have their contract taken into account.
Facilities are not included, as I even quoted - "tangible fixed assets". Yes wages obviously count, but we were talking about the development of youth and we don't pay those who are under the age of 16 and do not have a contract.
All true, no doubt about it. But whilst all your players who signed contracts before 2010 are leaving. Your replacements of this and last season still counts, and those contracts aren't any cheaper than before 2010, more likely to be more expensive. And what UIR said and this is what you can read in my links on the first page of this thread: your ticketsales are on the decline. -8%, your TV-income and prizemoney may have been extremely good, but it doesn't mean you can hand in a budget for next year expecting to win the FA and the CL again. Because that is what you do if you budget on the same revenue next year. FFP forces to budget on what's solid, ticketing, merchandise, sponsors and TV-money and some other things mentiond in the plan.
On the youth department, Chelsea has dozens of kids between 16 and 22 under their contract. My main examples: Bruma, Ake and Van Aanholt were or are part of it. They all make in general around 10k a week. Not much compared to the first team. But we are talking about 50-60 players here. 15/16 squad, 17/18 squad, reserves squad and youth players on loan with partial compensation. It's still a big load of money just on wages. Secondly the FFP rules state that it only counts for youth development 'activities'. On page 12, the term training facilities states that it is a place on which a club undertakes youth development activities. Which means the facilities itself don't count. Refurbishment, restructuring and maintenance are not included in exceptions.
Which itself is insane because this whole FFP is to force clubs to rely more heavily on their youth program.
But again, there are probably thousands of loopholes and Abramovich can pull his ties in Russia, like the usual. How else did they get the EC 2016 to Russia
All true, no doubt about it. But whilst all your players who signed contracts before 2010 are leaving. Your replacements of this and last season still counts, and those contracts aren't any cheaper than before 2010, more likely to be more expensive. And what UIR said and this is what you can read in my links on the first page of this thread: your ticketsales are on the decline. -8%, your TV-income and prizemoney may have been extremely good, but it doesn't mean you can hand in a budget for next year expecting to win the FA and the CL again. Because that is what you do if you budget on the same revenue next year. FFP forces to budget on what's solid, ticketing, merchandise, sponsors and TV-money and some other things mentiond in the plan.
On the youth department, Chelsea has dozens of kids between 16 and 22 under their contract. My main examples: Bruma, Ake and Van Aanholt were or are part of it. They all make in general around 10k a week. Not much compared to the first team. But we are talking about 50-60 players here. 15/16 squad, 17/18 squad, reserves squad and youth players on loan with partial compensation. It's still a big load of money just on wages. Secondly the FFP rules state that it only counts for youth development 'activities'. On page 12, the term training facilities states that it is a place on which a club undertakes youth development activities. Which means the facilities itself don't count. Refurbishment, restructuring and maintenance are not included in exceptions.
Which itself is insane because this whole FFP is to force clubs to rely more heavily on their youth program.
But again, there are probably thousands of loopholes and Abramovich can pull his ties in Russia, like the usual. How else did they get the EC 2016 to Russia
Who do you support BTW?
None, to be really honest. I do tend to watch about 9 or 10 matches from friday to monday evening. About 5 Eredivisie games, 2 EPL, 1 Bundesliga, 1 match in Spain.
Last year i did enjoy the Swansea games early on in the season, and the match against Arsenal at home (3-2), but was more to keep track of Michel Vorm.
But occasionally i watch the London derbies and the Mersyside one. Or the ManC - ManU derby in the FA cup.
It's more because i also watch the NFL, MLB matches. Cycling, F1 and Rugby on international level(six nations and WC). In all it's about 250 clubs if you add it all up, so can't really chose which one is my favorite or to support, there's just too many of them. I just watch it for the sport, not for a specific team.
Just yesterday i watched this game: http://forum.rojadirecta.es/showthread.php?173092
Zeefuik, De Vrij and Wijnaldum particularly impressed in that match. Although it is Luxemburg, not really a test for them. But still fun to watch the Dutch youth squad.
All true, no doubt about it. But whilst all your players who signed contracts before 2010 are leaving. Your replacements of this and last season still counts, and those contracts aren't any cheaper than before 2010, more likely to be more expensive. And what UIR said and this is what you can read in my links on the first page of this thread: your ticketsales are on the decline. -8%, your TV-income and prizemoney may have been extremely good, but it doesn't mean you can hand in a budget for next year expecting to win the FA and the CL again. Because that is what you do if you budget on the same revenue next year. FFP forces to budget on what's solid, ticketing, merchandise, sponsors and TV-money and some other things mentiond in the plan.
On the youth department, Chelsea has dozens of kids between 16 and 22 under their contract. My main examples: Bruma, Ake and Van Aanholt were or are part of it. They all make in general around 10k a week. Not much compared to the first team. But we are talking about 50-60 players here. 15/16 squad, 17/18 squad, reserves squad and youth players on loan with partial compensation. It's still a big load of money just on wages. Secondly the FFP rules state that it only counts for youth development 'activities'. On page 12, the term training facilities states that it is a place on which a club undertakes youth development activities. Which means the facilities itself don't count. Refurbishment, restructuring and maintenance are not included in exceptions.
Which itself is insane because this whole FFP is to force clubs to rely more heavily on their youth program.
But again, there are probably thousands of loopholes and Abramovich can pull his ties in Russia, like the usual. How else did they get the EC 2016 to Russia
Upon further reading, maintenance may count, but not the structure of any facilities. However all that page 12 states is information the clubs need to provide, for UEFA's own records as they have to know all of our expenditure, but nowhere does it state that the cost of building facilities will actually be taken into account - in fact it says this opposite, that they will not be taken into account, which I have twice pointed out to you and yet you still choose to ignore it and rather read it the way that you would like it to be true.
Of course we have players aged 16-22 under contract, I said below the age of 16 they are not contracted. But regardless, you do not know how much each of them earns, you are just plucking numbers out of thin air. Though apparently players under the age of 18 at the statutory closing date will not have any of their wages or bonuses count towards our expenses. I didn't know this before, but it's great as it means we have an even greater chance of being compliant with the FFP.
Also I haven't heard anything of our ticket sales being on the decline. Give me a link to a reputable place which states such a thing, specifically -8% as you have said. And Russia got the 2018 World Cup, not the 2016 Euro Cup (France is hosting that). You must be a really unreliable journalist, but you make up 99% of them so at least you're in the vast majority.
but nowhere does it state that the cost of building facilities will actually be taken into account - in fact it says this opposite, that they will not be taken into account, which I have twice pointed out to you and yet you still choose to ignore it and rather read it the way that you would like it to be true.
That's where the clown keeps going wrong.He doesn't understand there is a difference. Yes UEFA want to know where the money is spent but he can't grasp that that doesn't mean it counts as an expense against FFP. It's very clear and as you say you have pointed it out to him but he keeps ignoring it completely.He's made his mind up and that's that. It's odd that our finances are so important to him.
That's where the clown keeps going wrong.He doesn't understand there is a difference. Yes UEFA want to know where the money is spent but he can't grasp that that doesn't mean it counts as an expense against FFP. It's very clear and as you say you have pointed it out to him but he keeps ignoring it completely.He's made his mind up and that's that. It's odd that our finances are so important to him.
Stop whining like a bitch and check the links in the first page of this thread, posted like 4 of them. And so what if i mix up 2016 and 2018, it's weekend for crying out load, i'm not at work.
And here's some more reading content for you for the Dutch intake on FFP and implementation: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-18101616
And now i'm done with you lot. Goodnight.