Off Topic UK / EU Future

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oldfrenchhorn said:
Guardian investigations editor, Nick Hopkins, has been passed a confidential Cabinet Office document that warns of a “critical three-month phase” after leaving the EU during which the whole planning operation could be overwhelmed.

The classified document sets out the command and control structures in Whitehall for coping with a no-deal departure and says government departments will have to firefight most problems for themselves – or risk a collapse of “Operation Yellowhammer”, the name for cross-government planning for a no-deal Brexit.

“The … structure will quickly fall if too many decisions are unnecessarily escalated to the top levels that could have reasonably been dealt with internally …” the document says. It also concedes there are “likely to be unforeseen issues and impacts” of a no-deal Brexit that Operation Yellowhammer has been unable to predict.

What the hell has the country talked itself into? It is beyond belief that some on the right of the Tory party are actually advocating leaving the EU without a deal.
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I can't even follow this rank stupidity anymore.
 
You haven't been keeping up have you. Your government is imploding tonight, but Macron has seen a sudden surge in popularity. Maybe a little more concentration on the state that you and the blessed St. Mogg are driving the country towards. There is little wonder that you do not wish to talk about your failed party.
 
Amazing that 27 leaders of 27 countries, with often contradictory objectives, can still work out a compromise plan within a few hours. Even people like Orban understand that compromise is essential, and actually listening to what others say. But apparently the UK Government has been searching for this word in their dictionary for over two and a half years.
 
colognehornet said:
Amazing that 27 leaders of 27 countries, with often contradictory objectives, can still work out a compromise plan within a few hours. Even people like Orban understand that compromise is essential, and actually listening to what others say. But apparently the UK Government has been searching for this word in their dictionary for over two and a half years.
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My feeling is that a lot of this inability to compromise comes from certain politicians who feel that they are right and everyone else is wrong, or even that they have interests that they need to protect, although it is at the expense of many others. Maybe it goes further than that though, some people really are living in the past when England had an Empire. If you have doubts about that just look at some of the comments in certain tabloid papers. If you are of my generation it is quite likely that at school you had a map put in front of you, and you had to colour the Empire with a pink crayon. Some people still seem to believe that their small island should rule vast areas of the world. Far too many of the older generation are wishful for those days.
 
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oldfrenchhorn said:
You haven't been keeping up have you. Your government is imploding tonight, but Macron has seen a sudden surge in popularity. Maybe a little more concentration on the state that you and the blessed St. Mogg are driving the country towards. There is little wonder that you do not wish to talk about your failed party.
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Macron's rating has gone from dire to just dreadful. I see the rioting has got so bad in France the army can now use live rounds on the demonstrators. Is Macron still the most disliked President of all time?
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
My feeling is that a lot of this inability to compromise comes from certain politicians who feel that they are right and everyone else is wrong, or even that they have interests that they need to protect, although it is at the expense of many others. Maybe it goes further than that though, some people really are living in the past when England had an Empire. If you have doubts about that just look at some of the comments in certain tabloid papers. If you are of my generation it is quite likely that at school you had a map put in front of you, and you had to colour the Empire with a pink crayon. Some people still seem to believe that their small island should rule vast areas of the world. Far too many of the older generation are wishful for those days.
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The objection to being ruled by the krauts has certainly lasted quite a while.
 
superhorns said:
Macron's rating has gone from dire to just dreadful. I see the rioting has got so bad in France the army can now use live rounds on the demonstrators. Is Macron still the most disliked President of all time?
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I am not surprised that you wish to talk about anything other than the shambolic state that your hopeless leadership has led the country to. Do you really think that placing the country onto something approaching a wartime footing is good 21st century leadership? To think that you actually pay to support this breakdown in proper governance is beyond belief. You should be asking for your money back.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
My feeling is that a lot of this inability to compromise comes from certain politicians who feel that they are right and everyone else is wrong, or even that they have interests that they need to protect, although it is at the expense of many others. Maybe it goes further than that though, some people really are living in the past when England had an Empire. If you have doubts about that just look at some of the comments in certain tabloid papers. If you are of my generation it is quite likely that at school you had a map put in front of you, and you had to colour the Empire with a pink crayon. Some people still seem to believe that their small island should rule vast areas of the world. Far too many of the older generation are wishful for those days.
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I think that there are two types of nostalgia at work in the UK. Frenchie, at opposite ends of the scale. The one is what you mention, namely nostalgia for a world of empire, but the other is nostalgia for the days when we were miners, steelworkers etc. the days when we had well knit communities in the UK. Unfortunately many of those left behind in those ravaged ex industrial heartlands have been brainwashed into believing that the EU. is responsible for their poverty. The Brexit phenomena is just another reaction to so called globalization (a nice sounding word for capitalism taking over the World) - your street has been bought up by foreign speculators, your local factory has become part of a global concern, your health service is becoming American, even your local football club has been taken over by Arabs - yet you blame the Pakistani or the Pole living on the corner.
 
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oldfrenchhorn said:
I am not surprised that you wish to talk about anything other than the shambolic state that your hopeless leadership has led the country to. Do you really think that placing the country onto something approaching a wartime footing is good 21st century leadership? To think that you actually pay to support this breakdown in proper governance is beyond belief. You should be asking for your money back.
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The PM took dreadful advice from fellow remainers and hopeless civil servants. Once a proper Brexiteer takes over much of the damage can be repaired. Not much sign of your middle party yet? Perhaps the public think they would be like the Lib Dems so simply ignore them.
 
superhorns said:
The objection to being ruled by the krauts has certainly lasted quite a while.
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I cannot comment as this makes no sense whatsoever.
colognehornet said:
I think that there are two types of nostalgia at work in the UK. Frenchie, at opposite ends of the scale. The one is what you mention, namely nostalgia for a world of empire, but the other is nostalgia for the days when we were miners, steelworkers etc. the days when we had well knit communities in the UK. Unfortunately many of those left behind in those ravaged ex industrial heartlands have been brainwashed into believing that the EU. is responsible for their poverty. The Brexit phenomena is just another reaction to so called globalization (a nice sounding word for capitalism taking over the World) - your street has been bought up by foreign speculators, your local factory has become part of a global concern, your health service is becoming American, even your local football club has been taken over by Arabs - yet you blame the Pakistani or the Pole living on the corner.
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I can remember a piece on the TV at the time of the referendum where an ex-miner believed that if he voted to leave the EU his old mine would be re-opened. At the time that Thatcher was closing all the mines it was because that coal could be imported for half the price of locally produced coal. Logically you could argue that people should not have to pay twice the price for a product, but the effect on a local community could be horrific. Years later that miner who hadn't worked since his mine was closed was still searching for someone to blame, and with a bit of manipulation he believed it was the fault of the EU. No one really wants those old mines reopened for many reasons, but it does need proper investment by government to provide new openings for the ex-employees, and not rely on foreign companies to come in with zero hours contracts for people to work in a warehouse or call centre.
 
superhorns said:
The PM took dreadful advice from fellow remainers and hopeless civil servants. Once a proper Brexiteer takes over much of the damage can be repaired. Not much sign of your middle party yet? Perhaps the public think they would be like the Lib Dems so simply ignore them.
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Perhaps you can explain the process where your St. Mogg or one of his ilk take over, and renegotiate everything in three weeks. I think you should go and check up on the health of your unicorns. They could be supping a pint or two in your local Spoons.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
Perhaps you can explain the process where your St. Mogg or one of his ilk take over, and renegotiate everything in three weeks. I think you should go and check up on the health of your unicorns. They could be supping a pint or two in your local Spoons.
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Thankfully, the one good thing about the agreement with the DUP is Mogg could not possibly be PM whilst it exists. In actual fact I doubt he could be under current laws anyway - let's hope so!
 
Unnamed Ministers reported this morning as saying the PM may now go with no deal. Surely she wouldn't <yikes>
 
Dan Starkey 2 said:
Unnamed Ministers reported this morning as saying the PM may now go with no deal. Surely she wouldn't <yikes>
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At times like these with a government in crisis, rumours are doing the rounds constantly. There are goodness knows how many options being put forward, the strongest one currently being that she will not be PM in a couple of weeks time. It is quite likely that Corbyn will go down the no confidence route again, and should she attempt the no deal way forward, he would probably win. Stubborn or deluded, you can take your pick, but I am not sure how much longer she will wish the constant humiliation.
 
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oldfrenchhorn said:
At times like these with a government in crisis, rumours are doing the rounds constantly. There are goodness knows how many options being put forward, the strongest one currently being that she will not be PM in a couple of weeks time. It is quite likely that Corbyn will go down the no confidence route again, and should she attempt the no deal way forward, he would probably win. Stubborn or deluded, you can take your pick, but I am not sure how much longer she will wish the constant humiliation.
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It just gets messier by the day. Yesterday we were still using 29 March as exit day till we were told to change course at 2 PM... Looking forward to working on contingency 17 c on Monday <doh>
 
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