Off Topic UK / EU Future

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superhorns said:
David Davis knows exactly what has been happening and has resigned because of being sidelined by Robbins on May's instructions. I would fully expect civil servants to close ranks after being rumbled.

Not me guv!
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Not at all - if I thought he was doing a bad job I would say so. And you'd be surprised to see the tough lines some departments have been pushing. Bit more reading required I think....
 
superhorns said:
Trump is absolutely correct in demanding equal trade tariffs and a move from all Nato members to contribute fairly towards defence. He has put previous Presidents to shame in not addressing these important issues sooner. Germany in particular has been freewheeling at the expense of others.

I would expect Trump's bold moves and future success in these areas will boost his popularity at home leading to a second term. The UK needs a leader with as much backbone, step forward Mr Rees -Mogg.
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Who needs Nato anyway ? The whole thing is simply a catspaw to further American interests Worldwide.
 
Dan Starkey 2 said:
Not at all - if I thought he was doing a bad job I would say so. And you'd be surprised to see the tough lines some departments have been pushing. Bit more reading required I think....
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It will be interesting when Davis spills the beans about the constant undermining of his position by Robbins. It is well known the civil service is packed with remainers. There are lots of fingers being pointed at Robbins. The customs partnership is his idea although the EU will not let the UK collect tax on their behalf. He has been responsible for much of the bungled efforts so far.

He needs to go.
 
If the EU accepts anything like this suggestion of a white paper they would have many of the countries within wanting their share of the cake before the UK ate it all. Lots of huff and puff from Moggy and mates, but no idea of a plan has been put forward by them. I take it that seeing all the criticism of the PM she will be challenged to a leadership election. Maybe there will not be one because the right wingers know they are a small minority and couldn't put up a candidate with the remotest chance of removing her. So if they do not take this chance perhaps it would be for the good of the country if they put a sock in it, or vote everything down so the government falls and the people can have another say.
 
colognehornet said:
Amazing how Nato can station rockets on his doorstop thus violating promises previously made to Gorbachov and yet, somehow, make Russia out as the aggressor.
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He has already aggressively invaded Ukraine by force and shot down a civilian plane. This ex KGB cretin has already used Russian gas supplies as a political weapon, nasty bit of work, makes Trump look like a saint.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
If the EU accepts anything like this suggestion of a white paper they would have many of the countries within wanting their share of the cake before the UK ate it all. Lots of huff and puff from Moggy and mates, but no idea of a plan has been put forward by them. I take it that seeing all the criticism of the PM she will be challenged to a leadership election. Maybe there will not be one because the right wingers know they are a small minority and couldn't put up a candidate with the remotest chance of removing her. So if they do not take this chance perhaps it would be for the good of the country if they put a sock in it, or vote everything down so the government falls and the people can have another say.
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Hopefully the EU will reject the latest offering like all the others, protection of the 'project' comes way before jobs, trade and security.
 
superhorns said:
He has already aggressively invaded Ukraine by force and shot down a civilian plane. This ex KGB cretin has already used Russian gas supplies as a political weapon, nasty bit of work, makes Trump look like a saint.
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Are there actually Russian soldiers on Ukrainian soil SH. do you have evidence of that ? The occupation of the Crimea was justified - the place is 80% ethnic Russian and had voted for independence which was not recognized by the government in the Ukraine - the Russian occupation there prevented a bloodbath. As for those areas of the east Ukraine where there is a Russian majority - are you trying to tell me that the Americans would ignore the plight of their own compatriots and stay out if their lives were at risk. Is there evidence that the plane was shot down by Russian forces when it was done from territory occupied by the Ukraine ? As for gas - it is Russian gas and he can do what he likes with it.
 
colognehornet said:
Are there actually Russian soldiers on Ukrainian soil SH. do you have evidence of that ? The occupation of the Crimea was justified - the place is 80% ethnic Russian and had voted for independence which was not recognized by the government in the Ukraine - the Russian occupation there prevented a bloodbath. As for those areas of the east Ukraine where there is a Russian majority - are you trying to tell me that the Americans would ignore the plight of their own compatriots and stay out if their lives were at risk. Is there evidence that the plane was shot down by Russian forces when it was done from territory occupied by the Ukraine ? As for gas - it is Russian gas and he can do what he likes with it.
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Trump had a point about Germany overly relying on Russian gas as Putin has proved he will use the supply, when convenient, for political influence. These funds are being used to finance an arms race with aggressive warnings from Putin himself.

There was evidence of Russian soldiers on Ukraine soil and there was evidence of Russian backed forces and rocket that downed that plane. You really are trying to defend the indefensible. Have we mentioned the Russian state murdering perceived opponents on foreign soil, scumbags.
 
Will I need to get my door handles checked for Novichok in future Cologne? I was only joking about your nice buddy Vlad.
 
I wonder how many people have actually read the Davis paper. I have browsed some of it and found that many of the things suggested are designed for a far softer parting than in the current version. Not much of a peg for the right wing to hang their coats on.
 
superhorns said:
Trump had a point about Germany overly relying on Russian gas as Putin has proved he will use the supply, when convenient, for political influence. These funds are being used to finance an arms race with aggressive warnings from Putin himself.

There was evidence of Russian soldiers on Ukraine soil and there was evidence of Russian backed forces and rocket that downed that plane. You really are trying to defend the indefensible. Have we mentioned the Russian state murdering perceived opponents on foreign soil, scumbags.
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I take it by the last sentence that you are referring to the Skrypal case. Apparently, according to our government, the most lethal form of poison known to man was used - yet, miraculously all have survived. There is no proof whatsoever that Putin was behind this - and, if the proof had been found in the meantime it would have been broadcast very loudly. Although the nerve agent was developed in the USSR, the Russians were not the last people to have access to it, because most of the stocks were in former Soviet republics such as Kazakhstan. There they were dismantled by the Americans. So......the Americans had easier access to this nerve agent than the Russians did. Do you also think that if Putin wanted to silence someone he would choose firstly someone who had been released from 10 years imprisonment and then freed to go wherever he wanted, and secondly choose a material which had 'made in the USSR stamped all over it like a visitors card', and would such an attempt have failed so miserably if the Russian state had, really, been behind it ? Quite frankly I do not believe a word of the British governments claims on this. We all saw the fabricated pictures of the time - with experts dressed in full protective clothing with normal firemen (normally clothed) only 2 feet away from them.
 
colognehornet said:
I take it by the last sentence that you are referring to the Skrypal case. Apparently, according to our government, the most lethal form of poison known to man was used - yet, miraculously all have survived. There is no proof whatsoever that Putin was behind this - and, if the proof had been found in the meantime it would have been broadcast very loudly. Although the nerve agent was developed in the USSR, the Russians were not the last people to have access to it, because most of the stocks were in former Soviet republics such as Kazakhstan. There they were dismantled by the Americans. So......the Americans had easier access to this nerve agent than the Russians did. Do you also think that if Putin wanted to silence someone he would choose firstly someone who had been released from 10 years imprisonment and then freed to go wherever he wanted, and secondly choose a material which had 'made in the USSR stamped all over it like a visitors card', and would such an attempt have failed so miserably if the Russian state had, really, been behind it ? Quite frankly I do not believe a word of the British governments claims on this. We all saw the fabricated pictures of the time - with experts dressed in full protective clothing with normal firemen (normally clothed) only 2 feet away from them.
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Is it a coincidence that the year Skripal was granted asylum in the UK Putin issued a threat of 'traitors will kick the bucket'. There must be very few who think Putin was not involved in the murder attempt, you, Corbyn, McDonnell, McCluskey and the leaders of Momentum.

The leaders of most Western countries were convinced of Russian involvement, good enough for me.
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
I wonder how many people have actually read the Davis paper. I have browsed some of it and found that many of the things suggested are designed for a far softer parting than in the current version. Not much of a peg for the right wing to hang their coats on.
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I saw it in February :biggrin: but suspect it may have changed a tad since. It's on my weekend reading list...
 
oldfrenchhorn said:
I wonder how many people have actually read the Davis paper. I have browsed some of it and found that many of the things suggested are designed for a far softer parting than in the current version. Not much of a peg for the right wing to hang their coats on.
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Davis resigned because the negotiations were becoming too soft without the necessary protections he suggested. You need to read his resignation letter again.
 
superhorns said:
Is it a coincidence that the year Skripal was granted asylum in the UK Putin issued a threat of 'traitors will kick the bucket'. There must be very few who think Putin was not involved in the murder attempt, you, Corbyn, McDonnell, McCluskey and the leaders of Momentum.

The leaders of most Western countries were convinced of Russian involvement, good enough for me.
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Why would they have let him go if they wanted to murder him ? There are too many unanswered questions here SH. And what happened to the old maxim innocent until proven guilty ? I think that Corbyn has not expressed his opinions as to the involvement of the Russian state in this - he has just said wait until you have proof, which is the better option than the empty sabre rattling which TM. was doing. And where is the proof, even now, after all this time ? There are too many other possibilities here.
 
colognehornet said:
Why would they have let him go if they wanted to murder him ? There are too many unanswered questions here SH. And what happened to the old maxim innocent until proven guilty ? I think that Corbyn has not expressed his opinions as to the involvement of the Russian state in this - he has just said wait until you have proof, which is the better option than the empty sabre rattling which TM. was doing. And where is the proof, even now, after all this time ? There are too many other possibilities here.
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Will Russia allow the suspects to travel back to the UK for a trial? Don't think so.
 
Having watched Davis in front of the select committee on numerous occasions, it became quite clear to anyone that the man was totally out of his depth. I suspect that it all became too much for him as he has admitted that he doesn't do detail, and that is what this is all about.
 
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