That's the first thing I thought, they didn't have a big transfer pot and it'll be £10M with the rest in installments until 2092.
Transfer Rumours Transfer Rumours thread
- Thread starter Bozz
- Start date
-
Please bear with us on the new site integration and fixing any known bugs over the coming days. If you can not log in please try resetting your password and check your spam box. If you have tried these steps and are still struggling email [email protected] with your username/registered email address
-
I’d rather they just lined up.Can't wait to see them live up alongside Robben
Nowt to do with sizeIt did make a huge difference - pun intended - when Macallister was marking Burn
Should have got in his way and been cleverer
That was about not reading the situation correctly
- May 22, 2011
- 73,740
- 25,667
- 113
Size clearly gives a huge advantage when it comes to aerial duels. Not the be all, but would vvd be as dominant in the air if he was 5’9 compared to 6’3
You have your opinion
I have mine
My point is the notion of players need to be tall is utter hogwash imho
I have watched the goal and I do believe had Macallister defended it differently he could have changed the outcome
I don’t think size has anything to do with how good you can be at football
you can be tall - you can be short there are advantages and disadvantages to both
short gives you a low COG and an advantage there.
we live in an age where the FA have decided that height is important
on the form from the FA for my daughters trial - one of the first questions was how tall are your parents
same for one of the lads in my team
Imho it’s a daft blanket assessment to say someone has an advantage cause they are tall. I don’t want to get into a debate over examples as there are many.
to answer your statement IBWT
I doubt he would win the aerial duals in the air if he was shorter however - he could easily defend just as well - still win the dual and be equally as effective - so no need to be tall as a base requirement.
I accept that is how it’s viewed by people in general but I feel it’s a very myopic take on the game.
I also feel that many children get missed or discarded in the grassroots system based size.
Last edited:
The top scoring PL CB was only 6' 2"
Vertically challenged.
- May 22, 2011
- 73,740
- 25,667
- 113
2 very different things. At kids stuff when haven’t fully developed height and physicality should def not be judged and should be technical.
However when buying players in the prem, when looking at Cb’s it 100% should be a consideration. Should you rule someone out completely? Prob not as cannavaro was one of the best and not tall, but as a CF coming up against 6ft plus strikers, being able to compete with them is a must and height gives you an advantage when dealing with high balls and crosses.
So although mito’s no midgets is a bit tongue in cheek when talks about 6ft midgets, he has a point that having height and physicality is an advantage.
Top headed goal scorers in prem - crouch / Kane / benteke / Wood / Lukaku / Carroll - all at least 6ft 2 so it is an obvious advantage there.
That goal was a tactical success for Newcastle
They saw a tactical weakness in the lfc set up. They worked on it and it paid off eventually. (And not really as intended)
Basically lfc located all the big men along the 6 yard zone to defend as the opponents big men come into that zone
Newcastle then held burns outside tjst zone and he refused to enter it as he has a significant hieght advantage over macallister at that back post zone.
Their actual intent was to head it back across to score off not score direct (imo)
I would agree thst macallister should have done better jumping i to burns or working to put him off however I still contend thst goals is on slot and his team of coaches as the goal was blindingly obviously coming.
They left macallister there rather than change the system.in the fly. Any taller player who was not the two cbs could have gone and picked up burns. Szoboszlai for example.
In the end he scored a header that was from a long way out and kelleher wasn't brilliant on it.
That's imo on slot as much as it was good for howe. They had 3 or 4 warnings and didn't address the obvious weakness.
My point in the prem is different and related to central players who do need to be tall, especially centre halves, as tjry will come up against big men amd get dominated and targeted.
Young players can develop physically later and skill/pace can't be trained but thry have to be up to it in the end.
Our youth academy has some serious issues. We are failing 99.95% of the local youths as we are putting loads of imports in front of them that are no more physically ready. Imo we are back to the Gerrard/carragher era where we will be wondering who is the next scouse lad to play for lfc and will be wondering it for a lot of years.
I get what you are saying - also to stay on point I will try to answer each paragraph for ease
in your first paragraph you are imho sort of agreeing with me and I agree with you
However factually this is no longer the case - they don’t say it openly and directly but they are as close as dammit.
As I said they ask how tall Parents are so they can gauge likely height as they get older. The pyramid base is huge and so they can and will get away with it.
your second paragraph I agree with and is basically what I have said
It’s absolutely a consideration but not something to base your decision on - again imho
JB told me to go watch the goal again - is JB saying that if Mac had been taller he would have stopped the goal ? I do t think that has any bearing on that goal - I believe there are moments prior to the header that the defender could have used his smaller nature to stop that - and I would definitely be talking to Mac about it. You use Cannavaro as an example- as I said there are many examples and yes I agree he is one - so maybe you coach players who are shorter to be more like that defender and look at what made them so effective against height as it is more than possible.
I know MITO is tongue in cheek - but the advantage is no more or no less than if you are shorter as there other ways - and that’s all I am saying really.
on your goalscorers looking at that list yes they were good at heading but did all of the goals come against defenders who were smaller than them. If the defenders the were scoring against were in the main comparable in height that is actually telling you something different - surely ?
you also have Messi who is debatably the GOAT who outscores everyone basically - but that is another discussion.
so in short
There was something we could have done that would not have been height related - which is what I was/am saying
but overall you prefer and believe CBs should taller
Which is fair enough
I believe the best player for the job should be chosen
Height could be a consideration but I believe there are plenty of ways around it.
what were your thoughts on the player IBWT highlighted or say Mascherano at CB ?
being too short is lazy analysis/poor excuse imho
- May 22, 2011
- 73,740
- 25,667
- 113
I get what you are saying - also to stay on point I will try to answer each paragraph for ease
in your first paragraph you are imho sort of agreeing with me and I agree with you
However factually this is no longer the case - they don’t say it openly and directly but they are as close as dammit.
As I said they ask how tall Parents are so they can gauge likely height as they get older. The pyramid base is huge and so they can and will get away with it.
your second paragraph I agree with and is basically what I have said
It’s absolutely a consideration but not something to base your decision on - again imho
JB told me to go watch the goal again - is JB saying that if Mac had been taller he would have stopped the goal ? I do t think that has any bearing on that goal - I believe there are moments prior to the header that the defender could have used his smaller nature to stop that - and I would definitely be talking to Mac about it. You use Cannavaro as an example- as I said there are many examples and yes I agree he is one - so maybe you coach players who are shorter to be more like that defender and look at what made them so effective against height as it is more than possible.
I know MITO is tongue in cheek - but the advantage is no more or no less than if you are shorter as there other ways - and that’s all I am saying really.
on your goalscorers looking at that list yes they were good at heading but did all of the goals come against defenders who were smaller than them. If the defenders the were scoring against were in the main comparable in height that is actually telling you something different - surely ?
you also have Messi who is debatably the GOAT who outscores everyone basically - but that is another discussion.
I am agreeing with you on first point 100%.
I don’t think anyone here is saying short players are ****. That’s not the point. But in key areas of the pitch and Cb / GK is prob the most high profile one, having height js an advantage. That doesn’t mean can’t be a shirt cb but it’s far easier to compete against taller players in the air at crosses if you’re tall yourself. It just common sense, if ball is 7 foot in the air, the guy that’s 6ft 6 is far more likely to reach it then guy that’s 5ft 10. There’s a reason basketball players are all tall, height gives an advantage.
I also agree being shorter has its advantages - lower centre of gravity for turning and twisting, generally makes you better at dribbling etc. but those are attributes best suited for the wingers, full backs, or centre forwards if you want that type. Not so important when it comes to defending crosses in the box though.
- May 22, 2011
- 73,740
- 25,667
- 113
That Newcastle goal was an odd one. Have to give credit to Newcastle as we played them few weeks earlier and they didn’t try it once to give away their plans - does show to them that cup final was more important than league game which was fair enough.
So I can see why it would have caught us out in the final as who leaves their 6ft 7 best header on the edge of the box? As you say was more likely for the head back across goal which they didn’t try on the first attempt which almost resulted in a goal.
But after that, it comes down to organisation in the pitch. It does seem to be something lacking these days, the players almost were told where to be at set pieces and didn’t have the thought that wait, this makes no sense for corner 2/3 and we need to adjust. That shouldn’t have to come from the bench, that should be vvd and Alisson as to leaders saying guys let’s sort this out.
To link it back to the point, I do agree that having Mac there didn’t help the situation. If Konate was there would it have made a difference? Probably, would burn have still got there, maybe, would he have had such a free header? Unlikely. Is that because he’s just a getter defender rather than the height thing though?
What it may have done is stopped Newcastle using that tactic though just because a taller defender is there marking them.
Height isn't definitely an advantage but you're right in that it's not essential either.
Cannavaro wasn't the tallest and he's considered one of the better CBs of recent times
I played CB for a while and I'm only 5'8", I knew I wouldn't win the headers so I was a nuisance and made it as difficult as possible for opponents instead. There were certainly times height would have helped as well though.
AMC vs Burns was just stupid though