Tim's done one...

[Mckechnie Orange]

Drameh’s been ****e and underwhelming too but at least he has the excuse that he’s a right-back playing left-back.

What’s Coyle’s excuse when playing on his strong side and being unable to look up and see the game in front of him?

Coyle’s a somewhat decent defender at this level. He can tackle and run. He doesn’t play with any sort of intelligence though. He gets the ball on the right, doesn’t look up to see the runs the right-winger or other forwards are making and he either passes back to Jones or he’ll just run with his head down into a blind alley before whipping in an atrocious cross. Sometimes he’ll mix it up by shifting inside and floating a cross with his left-foot that goes out for a goal kick. Wow, truly amazing stuff.

Jones flatters to deceive. He can also defend okay and does the odd drop of the shoulder that makes him look like Maldini but like Coyle also suffers from tunnel vision and cannot see the game in front of him. They are both extremely limited players.

It's the championship. They're defenders. They don't need to be Maldini's to do a decent job, as half of our back 4 proved last season and by having a goal a game defensive ratio this season.

Our problem here isn't the back 4. They've played the most football between themselves statistically and we have a top half defensive record in terms of goals conceded.

Despite Walters "system".

 

[Kalman II]

It's the championship.tTheyre defenders They don't need to be Maldinis to do a decent job, as half of our back 4 proved last season and having a goal a game defensive ratio this season.

Our problem here isn't the back 4. They've played the most football between themselves statistically and we have a top half defensive record.

Despite Walters "system".

You’ve completely missed the point, as per usual.

 

[Mckechnie Orange]

You’ve completely missed the point, as per usual.

Summarise it cogently then.

Are you not saying the back 4 is ****e when basically they're being asked to do the job of the defence, midfield and then be expected to pop up in the opposite channel to overload when on attacks then wonder why we have no cover when they break?

That's not players. That's incompetence in the dugout, training pitches and on the tactics board.

And you know it.

 

[Kalman II]

Summarise it cogently then.

Are you not saying the back 4 is ****e when basically they're being asked to do the job of the defence, midfield and then be expected to pop up in the opposite channel to overload when on attacks then wonder why we have no cover when they break?

That's not players. That's incompetence in the dugout. And you know it.

This is why I said you missed my point because I seriously think you have some sort of issue with reading comprehension. I said Jones and Coyle are decent at defending out of possession. In possession, they are crap. The last three managers, including the one you and others think the sun shines out of his arse because he had us finish 7th, played possession-based football building up from the back. This style of football requires the entire back four to be comfortable and competent passers of the ball under pressure. The whole concept kinda falls apart when the right centre-back and right-back are absolutely piss-poor at it and don’t see the game in front of them. Jones and Coyle were the weak links building up from the back under Rosenior’s style of play as well.

 

[Mckechnie Orange]

This is why I said you missed my point because I seriously think you have some sort of issue with reading comprehension. I said Jones and Coyle are decent at defending out of possession. In possession, they are crap. The last three managers, including the one you and others think the sun shines out of his arse because he had us finish 7th, played possession-based football building up from the back. This style of football requires the entire back four to be comfortable and competent passers of the ball under pressure. The whole concept kinda falls apart when the right centre-back and right-back are absolutely piss-poor at it and don’t see the game in front of them.

The idea that Jones, who played his part comfortably in possession, both as a defender and midfielder under McCann in L1 title win and the first season back up under both managers and put some tasty balls down the flanks on a regular basis under Rosenior - being a key player in a possession-based 7th finish is not the problem.

He's devoid of confidence and belief like the rest of them.

There's no lack of effort. Just a bunch of lads trying their best to do what they're told, when what they're being told to do is like a 12 year old on football manager without the security of the save function.

And then being *cough* "held responsible" *cough* for it by a small-town-chancer and absolute pillock like you...

 

[John Ex Aberdeen now E.R.]

Well, the inevitable happened, Acun made a mistake and will hopefully learn from it. I don't know Tony Mowbray health situation, but if he is okay, I would get someone like him, a safe pair of hands, did well at Sunderland with young players, for a season and see how it goes.

 

[originallambrettaman]

Excellent, I am glad you're content with your membership money being used to fund the boys club. I would rather see a team of professionals showing some respect for the manager and their employers and not least the supporters. A sacrifice of being a well paid footballer is that you are expected to conduct yourself as a decent individual with professionalism shown at all times.

Footballers are no different to anyone else, anyone who’s having to work under a manager making poor decisions and causing them to look poor at their job, is going to be pissed off about it.

We all thought the manager needed to be sacked, it’s no surprise that the players felt the same.

 

[Heimdallr]

Footballers are no different to anyone else, anyone who’s having to work under a manager making poor decisions and causing them to look poor at their job, is going to be pissed off about it.

We all thought the manager needed to be sacked, it’s no surprise that the players felt the same.

The last death throes of Cult Walter... Everyone else to blame but the man in charge.

Onwards and upwards.

 

[tigermaul]

Well, the inevitable happened, Acun made a mistake and will hopefully learn from it. I don't know Tony Mowbray health situation, but if he is okay, I would get someone like him, a safe pair of hands, did well at Sunderland with young players, for a season and see how it goes.

Mowbray has said he wants to return after Christmas. Too late for us.

 

[tigermaul]

For me, a quick easy tweak would be to have Palmer in a Seri type midfield role. He has the passing skills and vision to dictate play from there. He was doing it to some extent against Wednesday and that’s when we had our best period.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

Starting in 10

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[Off The Line]

**** me, this thread.

 

[Walter Sobchak]

I’m sure Coyle has been regularly in people’s
top 3 on the MOTM threads.

It’s not his fault that the team’s tactics seem to be to constantly pass to him when under pressure and then offer no outlet for him when he has the ball. Drameh has it the same on the left.

Coyle’s comfortably good enough in this league in a team that has competent tactics and shape.

 

[springtiger]

Both Coyle and Jones are limited in passing ability , Jones tends not to look up enough and nearly slways plays inside the same for Coyle who on his right foot facing firwrd too often turns inside and runs across the pitch . These things allow the oppos to get in position - it’s not dynamic enough ! Coyle is very competent defensively except positioning can get wayward later in the game . I think Jones just needs encouragement to be more expansive but then he needs a decent midfield in front of him .

 

[Jim the Tiger]

Footballers are no different to anyone else, anyone who’s having to work under a manager making poor decisions and causing them to look poor at their job, is going to be pissed off about it.

We all thought the manager needed to be sacked, it’s no surprise that the players felt the same.

Speak for yourself, I didn't think Walter needed to be sacked. For me the issue was the recruitment, particularly the strikers.

Regardless of that it is unprofessional to down tools and childish to like social media posts about a sacking.

 

[originallambrettaman]

Speak for yourself, I didn't think Walter needed to be sacked.

That's fine, but you're one of a very tiny minority, possibly even a minority of one.

 

[Kalman II]

Both Coyle and Jones are limited in passing ability , Jones tends not to look up enough and nearly slways plays inside the same for Coyle who on his right foot facing firwrd too often turns inside and runs across the pitch . These things allow the oppos to get in position - it’s not dynamic enough ! Coyle is very competent defensively except positioning can get wayward later in the game . I think Jones just needs encouragement to be more expansive but then he needs a decent midfield in front of him .

They’re both decent defenders. They’d do okay in the Championship 20 years ago when most English clubs played direct and defenders weren’t expected to be competent passers playing out from the back.

Most teams in the Championship play some variation of possession-oriented football playing out from the back these days. In fact, it’s not even a trend or style anymore; it’s just the norm. Coyle and Jones being unable to do it is why they’re incredibly limited players at even Championship level. You might be able to get away with one of them in the starting XI but both of them, on the right side of a back four, completely kills any sort of build-up. Their dithering and lack of ability to look up, see their teammates’ runs and move the ball quickly out from the back just allows teams to get back into shape.

One or both of them need to be dropped.

 

[SydneyTiger14]

Both Coyle and Jones are limited in passing ability , Jones tends not to look up enough and nearly slways plays inside the same for Coyle who on his right foot facing firwrd too often turns inside and runs across the pitch . These things allow the oppos to get in position - it’s not dynamic enough ! Coyle is very competent defensively except positioning can get wayward later in the game . I think Jones just needs encouragement to be more expansive but then he needs a decent midfield in front of him .

In the first half against Wednesday Jones broke the lines and dinked a through ball over the top perfectly weighted for kamara.

 

[Walter Sobchak]

They’re both decent defenders. They’d do okay in the Championship 20 years ago when most English clubs played direct and defenders weren’t expected to be competent passers playing out from the back.

Most teams in the Championship play some variation of possession-oriented football playing out from the back these days. In fact, it’s not even a trend or style anymore; it’s just the norm. Coyle and Jones being unable to do it is why they’re incredibly limited players at even Championship level. You might be able to get away with one of them in the starting XI but both of them, on the right side of a back four, completely kills any sort of build-up. Their dithering and lack of ability to look up, see their teammates’ runs and move the ball quickly out from the back just allows teams to get back into shape.

One or both of them need to be dropped.

Not only would they be good 20 years a go, they were good last season and at times this season.

 

[originallambrettaman]

Coyle's been poor in the last couple of games, but prior to that he'd been player of the season so far, he's not the problem.